Planning my home theater in a living room

[dolynick]

Seems I stand corrected about the heights.

Dolby's 7.1.4 setup has them similar to how you had your originally:
https://www.dolby.com/about/support/guide/speaker-setup-guides/7.1.4-overhead-speaker-setup-guide/

There's not much point with arguing with the designing company itself if they say that is their recommended positioning.

A lot of rooms don't allow for a perfect setup but users are happy with the results anyways. It's alright if it's not exactly the same. A good processor should be able to do a reasonable job of compensating anyways.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

https://www.dolby.com/siteassets/technologies/dolby-atmos/atmos-installation-guidelines-121318_r3.1.pdf

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

I thought your original location for the rears was alright. The rear heights overhanging them was more what I was looking at.

Atmos is like a half-circle bubble around you. Try thinking about your speakers being on the wall of that bubble in terms of positioning. If your heights are well above head, then your diagram makes it more of a square with more vertical front and rear ends rather than a curing slope bubble. I would think they should move inwards towards the MLP a bit, and that puts them relatively close together then you might want to consider combining them into one pair - probably just a touch forward of the MLP.

If it was me, I'd also move the rears back in to a more behind the couch position again.

I tend to agree about the rear surrounds.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Found new place for rears, hoping this makes it a bit better?
View attachment 64887

I think the original spot was better. Although if you went 5.x.4 with the surrounds at 110°, I don’t think you’d be disappointed. In my room adding atmos was more impactful than adding rear surrounds. Luckily I don’t have to choose, but if you were going to simplify the installation a bit, rear surrounds could be left out.

 

[TLS Guy]

Found new place for rears, hoping this makes it a bit better?
View attachment 64887

These are the Dolby specs.

If you must do Atmos, then 5.1.2 is optimal for that space.

This is 7.1.4.

There is not a lot of wiggle room, although I find it works best if the surrounds are very slightly behind the MLP.

Since my room is fairly long, I place the rear ceiling heights between the rear backs and surrounds but in line with the front mains.

I have found that works very well.

If you want Atmos then I recommend the 5.1.2 as by far your best option. Adding more speakers will be a downgrade. When you get speakers too close together you get acoustic chaos.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

These are the Dolby specs.

If you must do Atmos, then 5.1.2 is optimal for that space.

This is 7.1.4.

There is not a lot of wiggle room, although I find it works best if the surrounds are very slightly behind the MLP.

Since my room is fairly long, I place the rear ceiling heights between the rear backs and surrounds but in line with the front mains.

I have found that works very well.

If you want Atmos then I recommend the 5.1.2 as by far your best option. Adding more speakers will be a downgrade. When you get speakers too close together you get acoustic chaos.

Actual mark, there is some wiggle room. Don’t forget that there is a “range” for overhead speakers. These diagrams are from Dolby, and illustrate just a little bit more granularity, although there are even more out there.

Also. Those black lines in line with the mains aren’t what you think. If they line up then great. There’s Avery long thread on the “other” forum about.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Salesforce

dolby.my.salesforce.com

https://professional.dolby.com/siteassets/tv/home/dolby-atmos/dolby-atmos-for-home-theater.pdf

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Here’s an easy way

 

[Trebdp83]

I think the 5.1.4 configuration will work. Surround Back speakers aren't going to work here for a 7.1.4 setup.

 

[dolynick]

I think the 5.1.4 configuration will work. Surround Back speakers aren't going to work here for a 7.1.4 setup.
View attachment 64897

Why do you say that? I see no reason why what he had allocated for behind the MLP wouldn't work when it's nearly exactly what Dolby recommends in their own diagram.

You're concerned about the lack of a back wall behind them? I'm genuinely curious as I don't really see an issue there. If it's the ergonimics of having to walk around them behind the couch, I can see that but the OP was already prepared to do that so I'm not sure why it would be a problem if he himself is willing to accept it.

Perhaps the best option is that he wire for the full 9.2.4 he originally planned out and then just use what he finds he actually needs.

 

[Trebdp83]

Many force 7.1.4. The surround back speakers are the most expendable in an Atmos configuration. The 5.1.4 configuration, with surrounds against the wall and slightly behind the sitting position per Dolby, makes the most sense here unless of course nobody minds dodging surround back speakers on their way to the dinner table.

 

[lovinthehd]

For center I could go with RC-64 III as price limit, but if 3x cheaper one is "almost as good", I would consider the more value friendly option. I don't know if I'm getting my point across..


What I want to avoid is to spend 5x for one piece where other components are way below that quality level, hence the "comparable pricing range", given that front speakers cost around 2000Eur what should be the rational budget for sub?
I also find it complicated to pick the best place for sub before I decide where to get the wiring done, the room is empty and I won't have subs before the room is done.


I'm not sure yet if the old equipment will move to the new place, but in case it does I will use it as you suggested.
Have I used Atmos feature? That made me wonder, but I think I did

Hard to comment on pricing/availability, not that familiar with what's available in europe. A good basic sub is probably north of 700 euros these days, but again not that familiar with what's available there (outside of that it's much more limited choice there than in the US).

Rather than that RC64III I'd rather try the phantom center first.

Wiring for the sub I'd probably just add some possible runs to a few points in the room but you might find it easier to just keep them up front to make it simpler.

It doesn't look like you setup atmos....did you re-assign the SBR speakers to be Atmos speakers?

 

[complexL9]

Why do you say that? I see no reason why what he had allocated for behind the MLP wouldn't work when it's nearly exactly what Dolby recommends in their own diagram.

You're concerned about the lack of a back wall behind them? I'm genuinely curious as I don't really see an issue there. If it's the ergonimics of having to walk around them behind the couch, I can see that but the OP was already prepared to do that so I'm not sure why it would be a problem if he himself is willing to accept it.

Perhaps the best option is that he wire for the full 9.2.4 he originally planned out and then just use what he finds he actually needs.

I actually looked into those atmos recommendations when planning, so yeah I was kind of disappointed by the initial responses that "everything is bad no atmos for you". I moved the rear speakers to their original place and gonna go 7.1.4 gradually with the wiring for 9.1.4

 

[dolynick]

I actually looked into those atmos recommendations when planning, so yeah I was kind of disappointed by the initial responses that "everything is bad no atmos for you". I moved the rear speakers to their original place and gonna go 7.1.4 gradually with the wiring for 9.1.4

For what it's worth, I just expanded my living room 2.1 system to 4.1 yesterday. I added a pair surrounds on either side of the couch. The room is 25'x13' and the system is set up in the middle of the long wall and across the narrow dimension. The couch and surrounds are positioned against the back wall so really not the "ideal" set up either. My 2.1 setup was solid for what it needed to do. I expanded because the new receiver I picked up to 4k processing allowed for extra amp channels and I had some extra bookshelves going unused anyways.

The difference as soon as something with some proper Atmos or DTS was played was obvious. I haven't even properly balanced or Room EQ'd the new additions yet and I can already say that I'm happy I put in the effort to get them set up.

Your space might present challenges but I don't think you should be discouraged.

Even if things aren't optimal, I think you'll find it more immersive than not having the surround setup. If you are concerned about spending a lot of money and not achieving a great result, perhaps you can use some old or borrow some bookshelves to try it and judge from that? If you think the extra discreet channels bring value/enjoyment, then invest in proper matching speakers.

 

[mtrycrafts]

Welcome to AH
Not an Atmos expert but in your space may want to move Atmos speakers closer to the couch even if it is out of Dolby specs. Front Atmos is almost on top of the front L/R speakers. Specs are good in a good room that you just don't have.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Welcome to AH
Front Atmos is almost on top of the front L/R speakers.

Not really. It just depends on the room. The Atmos renderer assumes certain angles, so that’s why it matters. Front height is supported but if only a single pair is used, the overhead speakers will only a couple feet in front of the MLP. In the old days of pro logic IIz they just went up on the wall above the mains.
The main spec for tops is 45° fore and aft, so in a small room, they might end above the mains, and iirc the spec for height(vs top) is about 30° so maybe close enough for front height.

 

[mtrycrafts]

Not really. It just depends on the room. The Atmos renderer assumes certain angles, so that’s why it matters. Front height is supported but if only a single pair is used, the overhead speakers will only a couple feet in front of the MLP. In the old days of pro logic IIz they just went up on the wall above the mains.
The main spec for tops is 45° fore and aft, so in a small room, they might end above the mains, and iirc the spec for height(vs top) is about 30° so maybe close enough for front height.

I was talking about his Atmos unless his post #8 are not Atmos that is also in the larger circle in post 17.

 

[complexL9]

Could anyone clarify what people are referring to exactly when they say 'surrounds' or 'atmos' speakers?

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Could anyone clarify what people are referring to exactly when they say 'surrounds' or 'atmos' speakers?

Yes. “Atmos speakers” are the overhead speakers. Surround and rear surround speakers are ear level. In 5.1 “surrounds” are placed to the sides at 90-110°. In 7.1, with the addition rear surrounds, the “surround” speakers get called side surrounds.

 

[lovinthehd]

Generally outside of the mains all other speakers can be considered to be "surrounds", outside of 2ch sources the only sources using center/surrounds/atmos are "surround" sources recorded as such (outside of upmixing in the avr).