Paradigm 100v4 with receiver, or amp and receiver?

[lovinthehd]

Dynamo


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There are/were several Dynamo series subs....can't tell which from the photo but looks like a really small one...8"?

 

[Jleis14]

Yes. 8 or 10. I’m not near it anymore.


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[lovinthehd]

Yes. 8 or 10. I’m not near it anymore.


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Yeah there's much better, and 8" doesn't really qualify as a sub IMO ML does have some good subs like shadyj reported on here, altho without a discount may not be as competitive as others

MartinLogan Dynamo 600X and Dynamo 1600X Subwoofer Review

Martin-Logan's new Dynamo 600x and 1600x subwoofers pack as much technology into a small enclosure as modern science will allow, yet still manages to be affordable. Read on to find out how.

www.audioholics.com

MartinLogan Revamps Dynamo Subwoofers

MartinLogan has totally redesigned the Dynamo subwoofer series in a massive project that was years in the making. To find out more, read our preview of the new MartinLogan Dynamo subwoofers.

www.audioholics.com

 

[Jleis14]

Good to know! looks I’m adding a sub to the list of items to get.


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[mazersteven]

Looks looks I’m adding a sub to the list of items to get.

 

[Jleis14]

I’ll do some research and read some reviews. Pick one or two and then figure out what kind of receiver I need. Or receiver and amp.


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[PENG]

I think I entered the correct numbers. Here is what I got.

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Your AVR should be adequate if you listen to say 10 dB below reference, that would likely be with volume at between -10 to -20, I don't recommend higher than -15. You really should put an external fan on top of the unit if you want the avr to last longer. Adding subs will certainly help somewhat if you set the crossover the 90 or 100 Hz. Yes the big towers can go much lower but why not let the subwoofer do the job.

 

[Jleis14]

Your AVR should be adequate if you listen to say 10 dB below reference, that would likely be with volume at between -10 to -20, I don't recommend higher than -15. You really should put an external fan on top of the unit if you want the avr to last longer. Adding subs will certainly help somewhat if you set the crossover the 90 or 100 Hz. Yes the big towers can go much lower but why not let the subwoofer do the job.

Would it be beneficial to just go all out and do the receiver and amp? From what I’ve read it seems like you can either dish out some $$$ for a high end receiver or buy a decent receiver and then use the extra $$ to buy an amp.


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[PENG]

Would it be beneficial to just go all out and do the receiver and amp? From what I’ve read it seems like you can either dish out some $$$ for a high end receiver or buy a decent receiver and then use the extra $$ to buy an amp.

If you compare the impedance and phase angle graphs of the V2, and V3, and since the specs of the V4 look very similar to that of the V3, it would be reasonable to assume the V4 has similar impedance and phase angle measurements too.

Unfortunately that would mean the V4 is more like a 4 ohm speaker.

So it depends on your seating distance, spl you listen to, and how much headroom you wish to have on hand, you may or may not benefit from an external power amp assuming you are getting a new AVR that has multi-channel preamp outputs.

As to "high end" receiver, I have no idea what you would consider "high end". Regardless, subjective reviews are subjective, often not based on measurable performance. If you go by actual bench test measurements, you should take a look of the review at ASR.

Denon AVR-X8500H AVR Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Denon AVR-X8500H Flagship 13.2 Audio/Video Receiver (AVR). It is kindly loaned to me by a member and costs US $3999. The 8500H is a beast: it is both deep and heavy. Thankfully the transformer is centrally located so as manageable as 51...

www.audiosciencereview.com

And you will see that there currently 4 Denon receivers in the top 10 measured there so far, rank by the preamp output's THD+N at 2 V using digital inputs.

Even the $6,600 NAD separate preamp/processor (I would consider it "high end") did not make it to the top 10 (it did manage 11)

Paradigm Reference Studio/100 v.2 loudspeaker Measurements | Stereophile.com

Sidebar 3: Measurements The big Paradigm's sensitivity weighed in at 89.5dB(B)/2.83V/m, 1dB more sensitive than the earlier version we reviewed three years ago. This is within the margin of error of the older speaker but is still almost 3dB higher than average. The impedance, however, drops...

www.stereophile.com

Paradigm Reference Studio/100 v.3 loudspeaker Measurements | Stereophile.com

Sidebar 2: Measurements The Studio/100 v.3's voltage sensitivity is above average, at an estimated 88.5dB/2.83V/m, which is within the margin of error of the earlier v.2's measured sensitivity of 89.5dB. The speaker's impedance plot (fig.1) reveals it still to be quite a demanding load, however...

www.stereophile.com

 

[Jleis14]

I can’t believe a $6,600 receiver didn’t make the list! My first car cost half of that [emoji1787]

You guys clearly have a much better understanding of the technical side of home theater. I just want to get the best receiver to power my system and make it sound to the best of its ability. I feel like my Denon avr 1912 is lacking based off of age and watts.


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[PENG]

feel like my Denon avr 1912 is lacking based off of age and watts.


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What is your power requirement according to the calculator again? Sorry, 6 pages after I lost track of what has been posted way back.

 

[Jleis14]

What is your power requirement according to the calculator again? Sorry, 6 pages after I lost track of what has been posted way back.

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[PENG]

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Sorry again, of course I read it as you posted it only yesterday lol!! So my comments in that post still apply.

 

[mazersteven]

110dB's is Very Loud. Its telling you your Receiver should have no problem driving the Paradigms.

My Suggestion is once your system is up and running. Once everything is in it's proper position and calibrated. If you feel your Receiver is not bringing out the best, or its running super Hot (even with fans), or you just don't like the looks of it Anymore.
Then a new receiver could be warranted. Or amps with the old receiver.

Model 2220

Mono? Mini? Micro? Magnificent? Whatever that M is, this is one UNREAL little single-channel amp. 200 Watts (conservatively!) into a 3-inch chassis with balanced input stage to offer Common Mode Rejection! MANUAL See Front Panel Huge See Rear Panel Huge

outlawaudio.com

 

[Jleis14]

110dB's is Very Loud. Its telling you your Receiver should have no problem driving the Paradigms.

My Suggestion is once your system is up and running. Once everything is in it's proper position and calibrated. If you feel your Receiver is not bringing out the best, or its running super Hot (even with fans), or you just don't like the looks of it Anymore.
Then a new receiver could be warranted. Or amps with the old receiver.

Model 2220

Mono? Mini? Micro? Magnificent? Whatever that M is, this is one UNREAL little single-channel amp. 200 Watts (conservatively!) into a 3-inch chassis with balanced input stage to offer Common Mode Rejection! MANUAL See Front Panel Huge See Rear Panel Huge

outlawaudio.com

Maybe I just didn’t have everything in the proper position and not calibrated correctly.

I know you guys said I can’t compare one system at a store to mine because of all the reasons you said. But I played the same song on my phone via aux cable on my system and then went to the store where he had the new paradigms with an anthem receiver and there was no comparison. The ones at the store just sounded better in every aspect.

As long as I entered everything correctly in that calculator and it’s saying my receiver is good then I’ll give it a shot. I do need to replace the Martin Logan 8 inch sub with something much more powerful and larger though.


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[PENG]

As long as I entered everything correctly in that calculator and it’s saying my receiver is good then I’ll give it a shot. I do need to replace the Martin Logan 8 inch sub with something much more powerful and larger though.


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Just because you use the same song does not make it an apples to apples comparison. There is no way that the way you compare you AVR to the Anthem in the store is valid, far from it. Another thing, base on bench measurements, the newer Denon AVRs should do much better than Anthem's except the MRX-1120 that is comparable. Even then, you can only hear a difference given the right conditions. If the store was using anything like the MRX 520, well that one ranked right at the bottom.

Normally I wouldn't worry much about such results but in this case

MRX520 ASR Review 65 dB SINAD = 0.056 % THD+N, and it was measured at 1 kHz at rated output so even for me that would seem too high for comfort. Again, the MRX-1120 did a lot better as you can see in the charts. I also like their power amps, have one myself, but for AVRs no thanks.

It's DAC did do better, so if you are going to get an Anthem, you may benefit from adding a good external amplifier.

Denon AVR-X8500H review

 

[Jleis14]

I love charts like that, they show actual numbers you can compare and see what’s best.

I’m assuming he was an anthem dealer so that’s why he liked them. But he was very adamant that anthem will make the paradigms sound best. Good thing I’m not an easy sell! Haha


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[PENG]

I love charts like that, they show actual numbers you can compare and see what’s best.

I’m assuming he was an anthem dealer so that’s why he liked them. But he was very adamant that anthem will make the paradigms sound best. Good thing I’m not an easy sell! Haha


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I would expect him to say that, if not he wouldn't be there long. I used to live close to Anthem, and have auditioned quite a few of their power amps, but never even bother trying their AVRs/AVPs as I believe those things are so complicated nowadays that I would rather trust the big dogs like D+M, Yamaha, Sony, and even Onkyo/Integra or Pioneer before I would consider those also-ran like Anthem and NAD's.

You will do very well with something like the Denon AVR-X3700H and Anthem MCA525 combination for you 5.1 system. The Monolith 200W X 5 is also a good option. Either amp can satisfy your need for the big Studio 100s with a few extra dB headroom on reserve.

You are right about the age factor of the AVR-1912. Denon has since upgraded their volume control and DAC ICs in major ways since 2016/17, whether that has resulted in audibly "better" sound quality is a different story, but improvements on paper has certainly been reflected/verified in the ASR bench test measurements.

 

[Jleis14]

Another member on here posted a link for the outlaw amp and receiver. Both producing 140w and $1800 for both.

Not sure how that combination would compare to the Denon receiver and anthem amp you are talking about.


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[lovinthehd]

110dB's is Very Loud. Its telling you your Receiver should have no problem driving the Paradigms.

My Suggestion is once your system is up and running. Once everything is in it's proper position and calibrated. If you feel your Receiver is not bringing out the best, or its running super Hot (even with fans), or you just don't like the looks of it Anymore.
Then a new receiver could be warranted. Or amps with the old receiver.

Model 2220

Mono? Mini? Micro? Magnificent? Whatever that M is, this is one UNREAL little single-channel amp. 200 Watts (conservatively!) into a 3-inch chassis with balanced input stage to offer Common Mode Rejection! MANUAL See Front Panel Huge See Rear Panel Huge

outlawaudio.com

He doesn't have the option of adding an amp to the old Denon 1912 as it doesn't have pre-outs....but I would recommend future avrs to have pre-outs just for that flexibility if needed.