Need Amplifier Recommendation for Speakers

[j_garcia]

The EP2500 is on sale right now too I think. I looked at the specs of the A500 when it first came out, and I'd have to agree, it looks like it is worth exactly $180. I *almost* bought one for my sub, but close inspection of the specs showed that it wasn't going to work for me - doesn't specify if it is 4 Ohm stable in bridged mode, which is what I need. For it's 8 Ohm rating, it seems like it would definitely outperform a the first few levels of receivers, and it's probably comparable to most mid level receivers. What it WILL do, is unload some of the work from the receiver. I've heard the Yammie 2095 in two different setups and it has a fair amount of power already - I'd say the A500 probably isn't going to provide more power than the 2095; probably about the same.

 

[pearsall001]

I just love it when guys give their opinion on a piece of gear w/ out ever seeing it or hearing it. They quote specs & then they try to tell you how it should perform, & actually compare it to other gear. I find this amazing & I hope nobody puts any stock in these kind of comments. Try to keep your opinions to gear you've actually seen & heard & keep your assumptions to yourself. Guys here post questions hoping for good info based on someone's actual experience w/ the gear they're talking about.

 

[mike c]

pearsall001, do you leave your a500 amps ON all the time, or turn them on and off EVERYTIME?

 

[j_garcia]

So, did you have a recommendation then?

Why do they bother to give us those specs if they don't expect them to be useful to us in comparing? Why don't they just say "Here's an amp, it puts out a lot of power."? Specs don't tell the entire story, but looking at the specs I can get a pretty darn good idea of what an amp will do based on past experience. Without driving them both, I can tell that a Ferarri 430 will outperform a Toyota Prius just by looking at the specs.

 

[pearsall001]

mike C

I turn them on & off. Not a big deal for me anyway. My son knows how to operate all the gear. My wife, well that's a story for another day.

 

[mike c]

thanks pearsall001. im too much of a couch potato to stand up and turn them on.

 

[pearsall001]

Specs are great for comparing on paper. The real world says let me hear it perform. How many manuf. do you think fudge their specs to make them look good on paper & then get out performed by gear that didn't spec out as good on paper? You have to actually hear it to give an honest opinion. As far as the Ferarri & Toyota go the Toyota blows the Ferarri out of the water!!! The one spec that's important to me is - gas mileage. No fudgeing the numbers on this one.

 

[mtrycrafts]

The truth on the Behringer A500 amp is that it's not all people have talked it up to be. That amp will unlikely put out 100 watts into two channels at .05% thd. When you have speakers that can handle, say 250 watts rms, this Behringer is not the best amp for the application. My Denon 3805 puts out very similar power.

That's not saying the A500 is any slouch, but it's no more than a quality A/V receiver. Without knowing the capacitor size, transformer, or heat sink, and knowing the A500 has a weight of 18lbs, it's my opinion that amp is worth every bit of $180, but not a penny more. It's a great addition to an A/V receiver to biamp a set of mains that need a little more juice in the low end, but to recommend it for a set of Khorns is probably going a bit too far.

Denon 3805 specs into 1kHz and .07% thd:
http://usa.denon.com/AVR3805_DFU_ownersmanual.pdf

A500 specs:
Specifications: *Output power (1 kHz, 0.1% THD)** per channel stereo: 160 watts RMS @ 8 ohms, 230 watts RMS @ 4 ohms. *Output power (1 kHz, 0.1% THD) bridged mono: 500 watts RMS @ 8 ohms. *Weight: 18.5 lbs.
** now imagine what the ratings would be, taken at 20-20,000Hz and .05% THD. Check the difference in wattage on the Denon 3805 to get an idea.

I'd much rather see someone invest another $120 and get the Behringer EP2500 Europower amp with the Khorns. It matches up better with peak rms output handling.

You are right, the amp for some reason is overstated by the maker. But, it is bridgeable to over 300 watts into 8 ohms. Is your receiver have 300 watts per channel at $180 per channel? All channels driven?

 

[mtrycrafts]

The EP2500 is on sale right now too I think. I looked at the specs of the A500 when it first came out, and I'd have to agree, it looks like it is worth exactly $180. I *almost* bought one for my sub, but close inspection of the specs showed that it wasn't going to work for me - doesn't specify if it is 4 Ohm stable in bridged mode, which is what I need. For it's 8 Ohm rating, it seems like it would definitely outperform a the first few levels of receivers, and it's probably comparable to most mid level receivers. What it WILL do, is unload some of the work from the receiver. I've heard the Yammie 2095 in two different setups and it has a fair amount of power already - I'd say the A500 probably isn't going to provide more power than the 2095; probably about the same.

Which receiver has 300 watts per channel, a bridged A500, at $180 per channel? All channels driven?

 

[mtrycrafts]

Try to keep your opinions to gear you've actually seen & heard & keep your assumptions to yourself. .

I see, then you never opine about anything unless you have first hand experience???

 

[mtrycrafts]

Specs are great for comparing on paper. The real world says let me hear it perform. How many manuf. do you think fudge their specs to make them look good on paper & then get out performed by gear that didn't spec out as good on paper? You have to actually hear it to give an honest opinion. As far as the Ferarri & Toyota go the Toyota blows the Ferarri out of the water!!! The one spec that's important to me is - gas mileage. No fudgeing the numbers on this one.

Actually, the real world tells you exactly what is on paper. And, research indicates this very well

You are right, you don't know what condition the maker conducted the tests. That is why you also look for third party testing and confirmation of the specs.

Hearing amps and many other components is way over rated in audio, modern components. Need to check out some of the real world data on listening tests of such components.

 

[mtrycrafts]

That's interesting, but I wouldn't want to be anywhere near those 104 dB sensitivity speaker driven by that much power.

Ah, 127 dB is a bit loud?

 

[j_garcia]

You are right, the amp for some reason is overstated by the maker. But, it is bridgeable to over 300 watts into 8 ohms. Is your receiver have 300 watts per channel at $180 per channel? All channels driven?

No, and I also won't need 6 power cords either I'm talking stereo output at 8 Ohms, which is listed as 160w @ 1kHz.

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

EP2500 better deal than A500 for stereo

Which receiver has 300 watts per channel, a bridged A500, at $180 per channel? All channels driven?

When you bridge the A500, you have a one channel amp. You would need a second A500 to run a set of speakers at that output. It's less expensive to go with the Europower EP2500 when driving two channels if cost per watt is the goal. Also keep in mind the manual states the amp cannot handle anything less than an 8ohm speaker when bridged. It will handle two 4ohm speakers in stereo mode. If you have anything less than 1 8 ohm speaker, it can't be bridged with the A500 (and you would need two A500's to run a pair of speakers). The EP2500 is stable down to 2 ohms stereo; 4 ohms mono.

$299 shipped for the EP2500 is an excellent find.
http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php?masterid=2610850&search=behringer+ep2500

 

[MacManNM]

Actually, the real world tells you exactly what is on paper. And, research indicates this very well

You are right, you don't know what condition the maker conducted the tests. That is why you also look for third party testing and confirmation of the specs.

Hearing amps and many other components is way over rated in audio, modern components. Need to check out some of the real world data on listening tests of such components.

I have a question for you.

Why is it you think you can tell the sonic characteristis of an amp by its specs, yet you can't do the same when looking at speaker specs?


According to your logic, we should be able to apply this to speakers too. If you have 2 speakers that have the same FR spec (i.e. 35-20k -3db) and the same distortion spec, they will sound the same as long as they are level matched and not driven beyond their capability. No?

 

[pearsall001]

Correct. I never offer my comments or opinions unless I've actually had the gear in my house & in my system. How in the world can someone give advice on gear w/ out ever hearing it? Specs only get you so far in evaluating a piece of gear. You have to hear how it performs then you can give advice to others. Guessing how something should sound according to it's specs just don't cut it in my book. How in the world do you buy speakers? Check out the specs & run out & buy them or do you take your favorite material & go listen to them? I'll bet it's the latter

 

[highfihoney]

Hearing amps and many other components is way over rated in audio

i have to question how you came to that conclusion?

 

[MacManNM]

Correct. I never offer my comments or opinions unless I've actually had the gear in my house & in my system. How in the world can someone give advice on gear w/ out ever hearing it? Specs only get you so far in evaluating a piece of gear. You have to hear how it performs then you can give advice to others. Guessing how something should sound according to it's specs just don't cut it in my book. How in the world do you buy speakers? Check out the specs & run out & buy them or do you take your favorite material & go listen to them? I'll bet it's the latter

The only thing here is that all good clean linear amp's sound pretty much the same. There may be some subtle timbral differences, but all in all I think you can make a general decision by the specs of a component (watts, THD, Output Z). That is of course if the manufacturer is of integrity.

And I don't believe that you must listen to it in your house with your equipment, if that were the case, then people would only be able to give an opinion or advice to people with the exact same setup, which in this buisness is pretty rare.

 

[PENG]

The only thing here is that all good clean linear amp's sound pretty much the same. There may be some subtle timbral differences, but all in all I think you can make a general decision by the specs of a component (watts, THD, Output Z). That is of course if the manufacturer is of integrity.

And I don't believe that you must listen to it in your house with your equipment, if that were the case, then people would only be able to give an opinion or advice to people with the exact same setup, which in this buisness is pretty rare.

Mac, good to see people like you who would argue from both sides, totally unbiased. Seriously that's one reason why I like this forum.

 

[mtrycrafts]

When you bridge the A500, you have a one channel amp. You would need a second A500 to run a set of speakers at that output. It's less expensive to go with the Europower EP2500 when driving two channels if cost per watt is the goal. Also keep in mind the manual states the amp cannot handle anything less than an 8ohm speaker when bridged. It will handle two 4ohm speakers in stereo mode. If you have anything less than 1 8 ohm speaker, it can't be bridged with the A500 (and you would need two A500's to run a pair of speakers). The EP2500 is stable down to 2 ohms stereo; 4 ohms mono.

$299 shipped for the EP2500 is an excellent find.
http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php?masterid=2610850&search=behringer+ep2500

You are right, this may be the better amp when going to 4 ohm loads, especially with low sensitive speakers.