Interconnects and power cord info

I

imnofool

Enthusiast
I am interested in some advice. I am still in the process of obtaining equipment for my 5.1 setup. I have the marantz 7005 av processor and the sdc250 amp (2 ch) from class d audio, and my speakers Chanes tower and center and rears infinity. My need is this interconnects and power cords. I have researched for a few weeks on both. I decided on buying 3 pair of OCC silver plated copper cords with gold rca plugs (from enjoyhifi on ebay) with this in the description---Occ Copper, --- 3 core .2mm--- 2core .3mm---1core .4mm---1core .5mm with signal diameter of 1.5mm, 7N silver plated, and teflon insulated. (3pair $65). The power cords (also from enjoyhifi on ebay) were these---8Ag plated OCC power cord--- 16 strands----1.5mm per strand----diameter 11mm, High Purity OCC copper with silverplate and rhodium plated plugs. I got 1.5meter and a 2 meter one. Well ok so far. I had them since september 8 and today is the final day I can send them back (if I want to). Anybody familiar with this type of silver plated copper wire? How is the performance on your equipment? I have burnt them all in for the last 3 weeks at 16 hour days. I have done tests with my old supplied regular power cords (Marantz and Class d Audio ones) and found a slight say 10% better audio experience. The very cheap old interconnects were improved about 15%..... did I do well here? Should I just get less expensive OCC shielded cords? I am impressed with THIS-------the old generic provided power cords provided by both Marantz and Class d audio both fell in performance for the initial 30 minutes in my A to B testing BUT the performance caught up to the new silver power cords AFTER 30 minutes of use to 95% of performance with using the new silver power cords. I probably should just send back the power cords and keep the standard provided ones and just keep the new silver interconnects.....WHAT DO YOU THINK?
 
its phillip

its phillip

Audioholic Ninja
Just buy some basic cables from monoprice or blue jeans cable if you're feeling fancy.
 
-Jim-

-Jim-

Audioholic General
Sorry but I think you are wasting your $$ - especially on power cords. The OEMs who supply them make all sorts of claims on how they improve your system but they have zero accepted science, or test results, that back them up. Use what came with your gear. I'm with Phillip on the interconnects above. Go to monoprice or blue jeans for those.
 
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mtrycrafts

mtrycrafts

Seriously, I have no life.
Break in is an audio myth spread by the believers only, not real scientists. ;)
No real need for power cables beyond what comes with the component.
As to your A B comparison, one needs to know the downside of such comparisons, biased by the subconscious and brain.
 
I

imnofool

Enthusiast
Well I might buy from Blue Jeans as the latest 3 from monoprice quickly went defective in the last 3 months (quality control went out the window with the 3 cables I bought awhile back or I just got unlucky with these particular ones). I always use monoprice and for years now and so was surprised with what happened to my latest ones. Maybe Blue jeans though.
 
ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Overlord
Live up to your screen name and don't be fooled.

Here is a great article by Roger Russel, former Director of Acoustic Research at McIntosh Labs:
Speaker Wire

All you need is a good quality conductor (i.e. not steel or aluminum (I like to avoid copper-clad cables)).

Something like Monoprice Choice 12AWG (or 14AWG) is more than good enough to provide a clean pathway for Electrons to travel. They also sell good quality in-wall rated cabling, too.

And unless you are going to rip out the Romex in your walls, redo all your household circuitry and install an Audiophile Grade Power Pole, what makes you think a fancy Power Cable is going to magically outperform the stock Power Cord? ;)
(Hint: it won't.)

You are way overthinking all of that. :)
 
I

imnofool

Enthusiast
Not so in my experience with my equipment.... I heard with my own ears a noticeable difference and yet I will still investigate. I no longer believe the engineers have enough of the science down correctly or have simply not enough of the correct science to evaluate the efficacy of using 'improved' cable technology or not. I have researched competing engineers on this subject from this and other forums for months now and there is very set in but contrary viewpoints.... the best thing I can think of is to experiment with my own equipment and ears to find out what pleases me the most. The blue jeans might work out or just a better preamp or speakers to improve overall performance I seek.
 
ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Overlord
Not so in my experience with my equipment.... I heard with my own ears a noticeable difference and yet I will still investigate. I no longer believe the engineers have enough of the science down correctly or have simply not enough of the correct science to evaluate the efficacy of using 'improved' cable technology or not. I have researched competing engineers on this subject from this and other forums for months now and there is very set in but contrary viewpoints.... the best thing I can think of is to experiment with my own equipment and ears to find out what pleases me the most. The blue jeans might work out or just a better preamp or speakers to improve overall performance I seek.
Unless you are doing Double Blind Level Matched Tests, you cannot trust yourself. Sorry, just simple truth. Expectation bias is real and sighted testing is known to be quite fallible.

Regardless, it is your system and your Ducats. Enjoy!
 
highfigh

highfigh

Audioholic Slumlord
Not so in my experience with my equipment.... I heard with my own ears a noticeable difference and yet I will still investigate. I no longer believe the engineers have enough of the science down correctly or have simply not enough of the correct science to evaluate the efficacy of using 'improved' cable technology or not. I have researched competing engineers on this subject from this and other forums for months now and there is very set in but contrary viewpoints.... the best thing I can think of is to experiment with my own equipment and ears to find out what pleases me the most. The blue jeans might work out or just a better preamp or speakers to improve overall performance I seek.
Seriously? You don't trust the people who have more background in Science, Math, logic and the principles of Physics than almost everyone on the planet, but you think that you're not biased in any way and this makes your opinion correct? Opinion isn't fact. If you know something will change or has changed and you know which is being used, you can't be objective.

Listen to the music. If the sound doesn't make you want to puke, keep listening. If it sounds bad and this can be corroborated by other people, make some changes but don't forget that your room is the most expensive part of the system and your mind is the one thing that's most difficult to change.

In the 45+ years of working with audio equipment (pro and consumer, including live sound mixing and diagnosing the odd sound problem in a couple of studios), I have taught myself to not care if something is good or bad, better or worse- that way, I can be impartial when listening. If something sound better, great and if not, that's OK, too. I have to base equipment choices on my opinions, but I also use objective measurement and between the two, I choose with cost being the next criterion. If something sounds good and is extremely expensive, I don't see as much value as if it were close in sound quality but less expensive. My job isn't to spend people's money, it's to find better value and solve problems. One of the hardest problems to solve is bias in thinking that one thing is better than another when it's not.
 
Eppie

Eppie

Audioholic Samurai
I don't see anything wrong with spending a little extra on interconnects as long as it's not crazy thousand dollar snake oil cables. There is no audible difference with oxygen free copper, but that seems to be all the rage these days. Agree with above to avoid copper clad and stick to stranded copper. Yes, poor quality interconnects can be a detriment, but any good quality RCA cable will work as well as another.

I've posted before on power cables. They are nothing more than prettier cables compared to stock. Any difference you experience is what they term expectation bias or placebo effect. You think that they will perform better, so you convince yourself that they will. The brain is kind of funny that way.

It only takes a basic understanding of power supply design to realize that it is virtually impossible for two 15 amp rated cables to have different effects on the audio output stage. That 's all the cable does... supply current to the internal power supply, which converts it to DC. If you're interested in a more detailed explanation, let me know.
 
ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Overlord
There is no audible difference with oxygen free copper, but that seems to be all the rage these days.
Agreed. Russell says as much, but OFC has been super affordable and thus became the mainstay for audio cables. *shrugs

And some people still use Lamp Cord! :D
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
Not so in my experience with my equipment.... I heard with my own ears a noticeable difference and yet I will still investigate. I no longer believe the engineers have enough of the science down correctly or have simply not enough of the correct science to evaluate the efficacy of using 'improved' cable technology or not. I have researched competing engineers on this subject from this and other forums for months now and there is very set in but contrary viewpoints.... the best thing I can think of is to experiment with my own equipment and ears to find out what pleases me the most. The blue jeans might work out or just a better preamp or speakers to improve overall performance I seek.
In that case your handle is the reverse of the truth.

You only have half a sentence that makes any sense or has any validity: - "just a better preamp or speakers to improve overall performance I seek." The rest is lunatic gibberish. Even in that half sentence the would preamp is dubious.
 
MaxInValrico

MaxInValrico

Senior Audioholic
I am interested in some advice. I am still in the process of obtaining equipment for my 5.1 setup. I have the marantz 7005 av processor and the sdc250 amp (2 ch) from class d audio, and my speakers Chanes tower and center and rears infinity. My need is this interconnects and power cords. I have researched for a few weeks on both. I decided on buying 3 pair of OCC silver plated copper cords with gold rca plugs (from enjoyhifi on ebay) with this in the description---Occ Copper, --- 3 core .2mm--- 2core .3mm---1core .4mm---1core .5mm with signal diameter of 1.5mm, 7N silver plated, and teflon insulated. (3pair $65). The power cords (also from enjoyhifi on ebay) were these---8Ag plated OCC power cord--- 16 strands----1.5mm per strand----diameter 11mm, High Purity OCC copper with silverplate and rhodium plated plugs. I got 1.5meter and a 2 meter one. Well ok so far. I had them since september 8 and today is the final day I can send them back (if I want to). Anybody familiar with this type of silver plated copper wire? How is the performance on your equipment? I have burnt them all in for the last 3 weeks at 16 hour days. I have done tests with my old supplied regular power cords (Marantz and Class d Audio ones) and found a slight say 10% better audio experience. The very cheap old interconnects were improved about 15%..... did I do well here? Should I just get less expensive OCC shielded cords? I am impressed with THIS-------the old generic provided power cords provided by both Marantz and Class d audio both fell in performance for the initial 30 minutes in my A to B testing BUT the performance caught up to the new silver power cords AFTER 30 minutes of use to 95% of performance with using the new silver power cords. I probably should just send back the power cords and keep the standard provided ones and just keep the new silver interconnects.....WHAT DO YOU THINK?
Think about this, why would any equipment vendor put substandard power cables on their equipment? Does that make any kind of business sense?
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Slumlord
Oh boy, a "I can hear the difference in power cords!" thread! Been a li'l while since we had one of these!

giphy (1)_copy_150x150.jpg
 
ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Overlord
Audiophile grade outlet: $255.00 each
Of course, you will need at least one of these for your more sensitive electrical devices: $1650.00 ea
Dedicated in wall electrical wiring that is BETTER than Romex: $500 per 10meters
Equi Tech 10WQ Sub Panel: $17965.00
Audiophile Grade Power Pole: ~$3000-8000

SITTING DOWN AND JUST ENJOYING YOUR RIG: PRICELESS!!!
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
Is this serious or a troll?
Probably not, but a failure of education, leading to lack of reasoning and logical thought.

So the chap has probably read a lot of pseudo nonsensical science and is so confused will believe anything, no matter how daft. Then convinces himself that nonsensical spouting by ignorant charlatans is audio truth.

It is identical reasoning to the dangerous misleading garbage spouted by antivaxxers. So their world gets turned upside down.

It is no accident that this chaps moniker is the absolute 180 degree opposite of the truth, since in fact, he fulfils every criterion of the fool.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Audioholic Slumlord
Audiophile grade outlet: $255.00 each
Of course, you will need at least one of these for your more sensitive electrical devices: $1650.00 ea
Dedicated in wall electrical wiring that is BETTER than Romex: $500 per 10meters
Equi Tech 10WQ Sub Panel: $17965.00
Audiophile Grade Power Pole: ~$3000-8000

SITTING DOWN AND JUST ENJOYING YOUR RIG: PRICELESS!!!
What, no audiophile-grade sub-station and high tension wiring from a dam or power plant? What about the power plant or dynamos, anyway- nobody talks about those, do they?
 
highfigh

highfigh

Audioholic Slumlord
I don't see anything wrong with spending a little extra on interconnects as long as it's not crazy thousand dollar snake oil cables. There is no audible difference with oxygen free copper, but that seems to be all the rage these days. Agree with above to avoid copper clad and stick to stranded copper. Yes, poor quality interconnects can be a detriment, but any good quality RCA cable will work as well as another.

I've posted before on power cables. They are nothing more than prettier cables compared to stock. Any difference you experience is what they term expectation bias or placebo effect. You think that they will perform better, so you convince yourself that they will. The brain is kind of funny that way.

It only takes a basic understanding of power supply design to realize that it is virtually impossible for two 15 amp rated cables to have different effects on the audio output stage. That 's all the cable does... supply current to the internal power supply, which converts it to DC. If you're interested in a more detailed explanation, let me know.
I (unfortunately) remember when talk of OFC and HQ-OFC copper started- 40+ years of bull crap later, we're still debating it.

Most people can only hear somewhat well to about 15KHz- it's just not very critical that the copper be anything other than the usual grades at audio frequencies.

Read the link below- almost every section has something about electrical properties and impurities. The summary contains "Oxygen is intentionally added in small quantities to control the impurity level and improve the electrical conductivity."- let's see the audiopile arguments ro the contrary after seeing that. I'm not naive enough to believe they'll acutually read it and think about it more than to have a knee-jerk reaction. Well, maybe they'll have some kind of conniption.

 
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