How would you bring people back to theatres?

[mpompey]

Amen, HiFiMan.

TESTIFY!!! <CLAP>

 

[dan_j_h.]

I'm willing to bet that the people going to the theaters will continue to decline due to many reasons. Home theater equipment is getting much better and lower in price! Front projectors are really more affordable now and getting better in quality all the time.

Things I hate about going to the theater: Commercials, people talking during the movie, my seat being bumped, prices, movie not in perfect focus sometimes, movie not loud enough sometimes, worring if my truck will still be there after the movie (at some theaters).

I am building a dedicated HT in my basement that will have front projection.

One thing that would make me see more movies at the theater is if most movies were IMAX big! Quite a tall order I know.

 

[majorloser]

There is a chain in Florida, Muvico, that has the movie experience "DOWN". It's a shame the idea has not caught on. Here's one their best examples:

http://www.muvico.com/main/muvico_palace.htm

http://www.muvico.com/main/thepremier.htm

Note the balcony seating with love seat style chairs. In-seat food/drink service and a BAR

Of course this is in Boca Raton............rich bastards!

 

[Methost]

Most theaters really need to remove the first 10 rows of seats. I only go to the theater on very special occations. (Star Wars, LotR, etc). When I went to see Return of the King on opening night, the theater was of course packed so I had to sit in like the second row. I could live with that on opening night, and I knew that I would be back in a week or so anyway. Of course the next week the theater was just as packed and when I entered there was only the front rows open again. I walked out that time, got my money back and went to a smaller theater down the road. Its attatched to a small shopping center and only has 4 screens. I now always go to the smaller theater rather then the 20 plex that everyone else crams in to.

 

[WmAx]

Most theaters really need to remove the first 10 rows of seats. I only go to the theater on very special occations. (Star Wars, LotR, etc). .

Once I had the horrible experience of getting stuck in the 1st row at one of these modern theatres. I could not see the entire scene without turning my head side to side and up and down some, and it made me dizzy to be at that perspective/distance. Those front rows, I believe, are yet another bit of evidence that the theatre does not give a damn about your viewing experience, and simply wants to have as many seats as possible. I can't image anyone being able to enjoy anything in the front rows.

-Chris

 

[gellor]

Once I had the horrible experience of getting stuck in the 1st row at one of these modern theatres. I could not see the entire scene without turning my head side to side and up and down some, and it made me dizzy to be at that perspective/distance. Those front rows, I believe, are yet another bit of evidence that the theatre does not give a damn about your viewing experience, and simply wants to have as many seats as possible. I can't image anyone being able to enjoy anything in the front rows.

-Chris

The good thing is, as Methodist said, many theaters will refund your money if the front seats are all that's left and you don't wish to sit there.

 

[SilverMK3]

There's an interesting article on movie theater economics posted at Ars Technica:

A peek into movie theater economics

1/5/2006 12:12:40 PM, by Ken "Caesar" Fisher

Our undying devotion to simultaneous movie releases has earned us a small share of hate mail over the years, especially from folks in the movie theater business. Our complaining about the crowds, the inconvenience, and most importantly, the cost really gets on their nerves. They make all manner of excuses for what goes on in theaters. The high prices of concessions, we're told, stems from two factors. First, they say, movie theater employees earn more on average than your man at McDonald's, so you shouldn't expect the price to compare with Chez McDo. More importantly, they claim that the movie studios take all of the proceeds from ticket sales, leaving the theaters without a way to make money. The problem with all of this is that it's not true.

Edward Jay Epstein has written a brief article looking at just how the theaters make their money. As you might expect, it's not from begging, or charity. No, theaters have three major sources of revenue: the movies themselves, their concessions, and more recently, their onscreen advertisements. The concessions are a cash cow, and everyone knows it. The only other places on earth where prices are this ridiculous are airports, theme parks and four star hotels.

Popcorn reportedly makes 90 cents on the dollar, which means that the "large" popcorn they charge US$4 for cost them, at most, 40 cents. Soda products are the Original Ripoff™, but everyone has already been regaled with stories about how a $3 dollar Coca Cola costs 10 cents, or some such (the actual numbers are secret because companies like Coke negotiate private deals). Wash, rinse, and repeat for everything else they sell that you can stuff in your mouth. Bottom line: they make a killing off of concessions.

The one-two punch comes with what happens after you purchase your concessions. This is where the advertisements come in. While so many people are sitting there waiting for the movie to start (and hopefully eating their concessions), they get the pleasure of watching advertisements on the big screen. Captive, bored audience + seats all facing a big screen = advertising heaven. But this is where a conflict of interest arises, and Epstein explains.

And some advertisers are paying more than $50,000 per screen annually, especially to theaters willing to pump up the volume to near ear-shattering level so that seated customers will pay attention. Since there are virtually no costs involved in showing ads, the proceeds go directly to the theater chains' bottom lines. But to fit paid advertising into the gap between showings, multiplexes have to cut down on the length of the studios' coming attractions (which are free advertising), a decision that hardly pleases studios. (Often, getting the coming attractions shown involves the studios "leveraging our goodwill," as one studio executive explained. The studios will threaten to hold back a popcorn movie, such as the new Harry Potter or Star Wars sequels, unless the chain agrees to play a full reel of trailers.)

The advertising problem is getting so out of control that some communities are turning to the law in order to do something about it. Many people object to published movie "start times" being mere tricks to get people in seats for 10 to 15 minutes of advertising. Many are calling on theaters to publish true start times.

Finally, we arrive at the old standby, the movie ticket. In general, the theaters are splitting the total right down the middle, taking $6 of a $12 ticket (for instance). In many businesses a 50 percent mark-up on a product would be healthy, but Epstein claims that the theaters lose much of this profit to the costs of maintaining the theater. Or, of course, you could spin it the other way and say that they keep all of this profit, but then lose part of their outrageous concessions profits to maintaining the theater.

At the end of the day, most theaters are squeaking out a profit, even though ticket sales are declining. However, they also have to push the limits of their customers with outrageously priced snacks and barrels of on screen advertising to earn that profit. It's not hard to see why everything from on demand, to online movie services, to Netflix has the theaters in their sights, and plenty of people are rooting for them.

 

[johnu]

Most theaters really need to remove the first 10 rows of seats. I only go to the theater on very special occations. (Star Wars, LotR, etc). When I went to see Return of the King on opening night, the theater was of course packed so I had to sit in like the second row. I could live with that on opening night, and I knew that I would be back in a week or so anyway. Of course the next week the theater was just as packed and when I entered there was only the front rows open again. I walked out that time, got my money back and went to a smaller theater down the road. Its attatched to a small shopping center and only has 4 screens. I now always go to the smaller theater rather then the 20 plex that everyone else crams in to.

Couldn't agree more. They also need to remove that last 10 rows because they are too far away, the 10 rows on the far right because the angle is bad, and the 10 rows on the far left because the angle is bad. In fact, they should remove all but 3 or 4 seats directly in the middle of the theater at a perfect distance for viewing.

For one blockbuster opening, I went to the trouble of getting to the theater early and got perfect seats, but it was inconvenient for me so I don't do that anymore.

 

[Mr. Lamb Fries]

Last night I went and saw Legend of Narnia. I thought it would be a good movie to see on the big screen. The movie was good but I had to make an exausting effort to block out all the "extras" that came with movie theaters.

$24 for a matinee (tickets, popcorn, drinks)

We sat in the back of the theater (sacraficing the sound but gaining an unobstructed view of the screen). About five minutes into the movie, three of the BIGGEST heads set directly in from of us. Not just heads but GIANT heads with the biggest hair I have ever seen. If I had a tape measurer, their hair would probably measured an eighteen inch wing span. They could have sat two seats to the right, or two seats to the left, but no...sat directly in front of us. After multiple adjusts in the uncomfortable seats, we decided to move. I realize people can sit in fron of us but when seats are available elsewhere...what about common courtesy? Not the end of the world but a little annoying.

We moved near a group of people that appeared to be eating popcorn like the athorities were comming to confiscate their troffs. Not just nibbling but shoving handfulls at a time with the efficiency of the crew at the Nathan's Hot Dog Eating Contest at Coney Island during the Fourth of July. When they got to the bottom of the troffs...they left NO curnell un eaten. Scraping around the bottom of the bag making sure there was no straglers. If you would close your eyes, you would think it was Christmas morning and a hundred presents were be torn apart by kids in a frenzy looking for the ONE gift they really wanted.

Next I noticed the sound... UNEXCUSABLE!!! We sat near a blown speaker You know...that unmistakable harsh, scratchy, popping, hissing, crackeling noise that sounds like two cheese graders sliding across each other in opposite directions. Every note in the music...every action sequence...every word...PURE "nails on the chalkboard" to most of us...

ALL THAT CAN BE OVERLOOKED WHEN...CELLPHONES about a dozen or so times. (I dont know what to say...)One kids went off 5 times. Each time, he ran down the isle, with all his friends laughing, all the way to the back of the theater. Once there, he had a normal conversation...like he was in his livingroom. Yeah...thanks for the effort. (I dont know what to say...) This behavior is inexcusable!!! Leave at home...turn it off...leave in the car...put on vibrate...HOW HARD IS IT??? we all got along fine with out them. They are convenient and I use mine regularily...but not at the expence of rudeness. There should be a jail sentance for having your cell phone ring in a theater. Maybe capital punishment.

All I could think was...where is that post in Audioholics!!!
It will be a LONG time before I go back to the theater

 

[Tomorrow]

I have a bit of a different take on this. (What's new, lol). Please know that I'm old enough to remember when Saturday matinees were a dime and you got 2 movies, a great cartoon, AND a newsreel.("This is John Cameron Swazee coming to you from Korea.")

Many of the posts herein rebel against the cost, inconveniences, ads/commercials, disruptions, and quality of commercial theaters (theatres for Buckle-miser). Well lemme tell ya:

COST...I would venture that all of you who regularly post on this forum have spent MUCH more money on your HT's than you have going to all the movies you've seen, and will see, in your lifetime...food included, even if you hadn't purchased an HT.

INCONVENIENCE...This may be your only valid complaint. I find I am more prone to burp, fart, wear something other than pajamas, etc. when I'm home watching, as opposed to being around other people at a theater. On the other hand, it's kinda nice to get together with friends for an outing of a movie and dinner, once in a while (farting NOT allowed).

ADS...I can't remember the last time I bought a DVD that didn't have commercials and government warnings on it (which you're NOT allowed to skip).

DISRUPTIONS...C'mon people. You have all kinds of interruptions of your movies at home...phone calls, bathroom breaks (while others wait), door visitors, little Johnny's broken toe, etc. Granted you can hit the Pause button...but it's still an interruption.

QUALITY...Well, this is a bit ticklish. I doubt most of you have audio equipment and screen size that can come near matching that available in most theaters. (I know...Gene does. ) And being as old as dirt, I can tell you that the presentation of movies in commercial theaters has never been better. No more flapping fill rolls. No more scratchy vids and audio tracks. Broken speakers? In 60 years of movie-going, I've never heard one.

Granted, I live in a small, rural community, but the "problems" should be the same here as where you live. We almost always pick times to go to the movies that coincide with kids being in school! (You gotta outwit them, sometimes. ) That's usually during the daytime, too, so we get cheap matinee prices. And one last thought....I cannot ever ever ever make slimy, buttery popcorn any better than I get in most theaters. Anyone out there with a foolproof recipe, please let me know.

Much good cheer and happy New Year to all.

 

[Tomorrow]

I just did a quick check on the "How much is your HT worth" thread. Roughly 30% of the respondants said their systems were worth more than $9,000.

Now let's see how many movies that pays for. Hmmmm. 9,000 divided by 25 bucks for two tickets, some popcorn, and large drink...why that comes to 360 trips for two to the theater. If you were to go once per week, that would come to...hmmm...almost seven years of movies for two, once a week.

In 7 years, most of us are already due for another expenditure for an upgraded HT, yes?! Or alternatively, those movie visits translate into just 360 DVDs. Not a king's ransom in movies.

Naw, I think the issue of cost of theater-going is not a valid reason for not returning. I think it's still a bargain.

 

[hifiman]

I have a bit of a different take on this. (What's new, lol). Please know that I'm old enough to remember when Saturday matinees were a dime and you got 2 movies, a great cartoon, AND a newsreel.("This is John Cameron Swazee coming to you from Korea.")

Many of the posts herein rebel against the cost, inconveniences, ads/commercials, disruptions, and quality of commercial theaters (theatres for Buckle-miser). Well lemme tell ya:

COST...I would venture that all of you who regularly post on this forum have spent MUCH more money on your HT's than you have going to all the movies you've seen, and will see, in your lifetime...food included, even if you hadn't purchased an HT.

INCONVENIENCE...This may be your only valid complaint. I find I am more prone to burp, fart, wear something other than pajamas, etc. when I'm home watching, as opposed to being around other people at a theater. On the other hand, it's kinda nice to get together with friends for an outing of a movie and dinner, once in a while (farting NOT allowed).

ADS...I can't remember the last time I bought a DVD that didn't have commercials and government warnings on it (which you're NOT allowed to skip).

DISRUPTIONS...C'mon people. You have all kinds of interruptions of your movies at home...phone calls, bathroom breaks (while others wait), door visitors, little Johnny's broken toe, etc. Granted you can hit the Pause button...but it's still an interruption.

QUALITY...Well, this is a bit ticklish. I doubt most of you have audio equipment and screen size that can come near matching that available in most theaters. (I know...Gene does. ) And being as old as dirt, I can tell you that the presentation of movies in commercial theaters has never been better. No more flapping fill rolls. No more scratchy vids and audio tracks. Broken speakers? In 60 years of movie-going, I've never heard one.

Granted, I live in a small, rural community, but the "problems" should be the same here as where you live. We almost always pick times to go to the movies that coincide with kids being in school! (You gotta outwit them, sometimes. ) That's usually during the daytime, too, so we get cheap matinee prices. And one last thought....I cannot ever ever ever make slimy, buttery popcorn any better than I get in most theaters. Anyone out there with a foolproof recipe, please let me know.

Much good cheer and happy New Year to all.

Well I'm really miffed. I spent a lot of time responding to this post and now I don't see it. Am I getting too old to remember to hit the submit button? Anyway, let me see if I can recreate my rant (now that I think about it, was my rant posted, but then removed? I hope not, it wasn't an attack). It started something like this. I respectfully disagree with some of your arguments.

As far as costs are concerned, I have spent more money on my system than the grand total of every movie I've ever seen and likely ever will see in the future, but there's is big difference. With the money I've invested I get to use it whenever I want. I can listen to music, watch TV, or play a game. So the cost is spread out over a variety of uses. The theaters charge a premium to experience a movie for a couple of hours give-or-take, and that's all I get to do with there system - watch a movie.

DVDs do have ads. I skip through the ones I can. If I can't skip, then I fast-forward through the ads. If I can't even do that, then I take the opportunity to turn off lights, get a drink, etc. When I return to my seat I can then select "play" on the title screen. At the theater I am part of a captive audience. I can get up and go to the lobby during the ads, but it's a hassle that the theater owners know I'm not going to do.

As for disruptions at home, yes I've got 'em. The phone rings, someone's at the door, etc., but I've got the pause button on my side. I can resume where I've left off without missing anything. It's bit iffy at best to get most projectionist to stop the movie at the theater while the person behind me takes that ultra important call on their cell phone to catch us all up on old times.

And of course I'm more than a bit biased when it comes to matching the quality of my system to that of the theaters, but I really don't think it takes a huge investment to blow them out of the water. The theaters do have those really huge screens that allow me to notice all of the grain in the film, but given the difference in scale, my big-ish TV in my small living room gives a pretty decent viewing experience. As for sound - it's no contest, my modest system can run rings around the best theater I've ever been in. Again, scale is on my side when competing. And as for broken speakers - I'm just hoping to someday see a movie in a theater that doesn't have at least one driver hurting.

 

[Tomorrow]

Well I'm really miffed. I spent a lot of time responding to this post and now I don't see it. Am I getting too old to remember to hit the submit button? Anyway, let me see if I can recreate my rant (now that I think about it, was my rant posted, but then removed? I hope not, it wasn't an attack). It started something like this. I respectfully disagree with some of your arguments.

As far as costs are concerned, I have spent more money on my system than the grand total of every movie I've ever seen and likely ever will see in the future, but there's is big difference. With the money I've invested I get to use it whenever I want. I can listen to music, watch TV, or play a game. So the cost is spread out over a variety of uses. The theaters charge a premium to experience a movie for a couple of hours give-or-take, and that's all I get to do with there system - watch a movie.

DVDs do have ads. I skip through the ones I can. If I can't skip, then I fast-forward through the ads. If I can't even do that, then I take the opportunity to turn off lights, get a drink, etc. When I return to my seat I can then select "play" on the title screen. At the theater I am part of a captive audience. I can get up and go to the lobby during the ads, but it's a hassle that the theater owners know I'm not going to do.

As for disruptions at home, yes I've got 'em. The phone rings, someone's at the door, etc., but I've got the pause button on my side. I can resume where I've left off without missing anything. It's bit iffy at best to get most projectionist to stop the movie at the theater while the person behind me takes that ultra important call on their cell phone to catch us all up on old times.

And of course I'm more than a bit biased when it comes to matching the quality of my system to that of the theaters, but I really don't think it takes a huge investment to blow them out of the water. The theaters do have those really huge screens that allow me to notice all of the grain in the film, but given the difference in scale, my big-ish TV in my small living room gives a pretty decent viewing experience. As for sound - it's no contest, my modest system can run rings around the best theater I've ever been in. Again, scale is on my side when competing. And as for broken speakers - I'm just hoping to someday see a movie in a theater that doesn't have at least one driver hurting.

No problem Hifiman. No offense is taken and your respect seems fully intact. (Tho' I didn't see your first post, lol. But our patrons are out of town and we've been left...Home Alone. I don't think anyone is guarding the ship right now, lol. So I doubt it was squelched.) As a matter of fact, it doesn't sound like you're disagreeing with me at all. You have granted all my points. But my post is as much in jest as it is serious. I realize that one can legitimately complain about theaters. It's just that as stated, those complaints don't stand alone as causes for the evaporating theater attendance. Correct, you don't have someone else's phone ( ) to deal with and you have that pause button at home. In fact, I also agree with most of what you say. (But those 22 huge surround JBL's, and hidden center channels and subs in my local theater blow MY system away...maybe not yours.)

The point I was trying to make is that perhaps the complaints were a bit strident and not well thought out. Each of those points had been stated as complaints, and I merely pointed out that they could be said about one's HT experience, as well. I think that there is deeper meaning as to why people are staying away from theaters. I'm sorry I didn't spell that out. I surely should have.

You want my opinion? For what it's worth, I don't think people will ever come back to theaters in droves. That era is gone. Even though the industry is working... well... industriously on the problem (there was a report on the NBC tv national news about their efforts just last week), it's too late. Times and conditions have changed. People have changed. Our society has changed. 9/11 has pushed along some of those changes. Our selfishness has, as well. Certainly the affordability of the HT technology has become a torpedo in the side of the multiplex ship.

And that's my story and I'm stickin' to it.

Good cheer.

 

[hifiman]

You want my opinion? For what it's worth, I don't think people will ever come back to theaters in droves. That era is gone. Even though the industry is working... well... industriously on the problem (there was a report on the NBC tv national news about their efforts just last week), it's too late. Times and conditions have changed. People have changed. Our society has changed. 9/11 has pushed along some of those changes. Our selfishness has, as well. Certainly the affordability of the HT technology has become a torpedo in the side of the multiplex ship.

And that's my story and I'm stickin' to it.

Good cheer.

I agree with you. People aren't coming back to the theaters in droves anytime soon. One of the older theaters in our city was converted into a laser tag facility. Maybe conversions like that are what is needed to get them back in the theaters.

 

[trfcrugby]

I think everyone has already said it before, but poor environment coupled with crappy movies makes the theater experience suck. I believe if we ever see simultaneous releases, then that will signal the end of the theater as we know it.

 

[Tomorrow]

I think everyone has already said it before, but poor environment coupled with crappy movies makes the theater experience suck. I believe if we ever see simultaneous releases, then that will signal the end of the theater as we know it.

This is an uber-accurate point. 3/4 of all the movies coming out are REMAKES!! It doesn't seem Hollywood has any original ideas, anymore. All we get is less story, more fx, and poorer acting.

 

[Buckle-meister]

I agree with you.

Well I dont! (stamps foot petulantly)

Times and conditions have changed. People have changed. Our society has changed. 9/11 has pushed along some of those changes. Our selfishness has, as well. Certainly the affordability of the HT technology has become a torpedo in the side of the multiplex ship.

I have to disagree (fancy that ). With all due respect, 9/11 cannot be used as a reason, because the criticism levelled at theatres (s p e l t...t h e...w a y...y o u...s a y...i t) doesn't just occur in America.

I'm siding with Hifiman; everyone that I know agrees that the worse thing about going to the cinema today is the clowning around of youths and/or noise from talking and/or phones going off. Immersion in big sound and an even bigger picture form most if not all of the movie going experiance and are the principal reasons we frequent such venues, and in breaking that suspension; that fabulous experiance is utterly lost.

 

[Tom Andry]

I think everyone has already said it before, but poor environment coupled with crappy movies makes the theater experience suck. I believe if we ever see simultaneous releases, then that will signal the end of the theater as we know it.

Check this out!

 

[Tomorrow]

Check this out!

Yeah, "opens a wealth of options" my A$$....a wealth of wealth to the industry is more like it. And thankfully, the coding will be broken within 5 minutes of this technology hitting the street. Thanks for getting me fully awake this morning, Tom. Grrrrrr.

 

[Tomorrow]

I'm siding with Hifiman; everyone that I know agrees that the worse thing about going to the cinema today is the clowning around of youths and/or noise from talking and/or phones going off. Immersion in big sound and an even bigger picture form most if not all of the movie going experiance and are the principal reasons we frequent such venues, and in breaking that suspension; that fabulous experiance is utterly lost.

You disagree with whom? Hifiman and I agree. You can't disagree with me. 'Taint allowed, even if it made sense. ho ho hooooo

Biggest problem at my house when watching a flick? People clowning around and phones going off. Just ask AverageJoe. See?! Same problem, but it's not keeping me away from watching movies in my home. 'Twas my point, you disagreer, you. 'Tis something else that lies at the bottom of this boycott.