Ground Loops - Eliminating System Hum and Buzz

T

tokehectic

Audiophyte
Hope this helps

Actually, I should have been more specific. My ground loop is manifested as a slowly scrolling line(s) in the video signal, rather than an audio hum. I'm going to see if it goes away when I keep the Tivo box plugged in, but detach the two satellite connections.
RGPC Ground Loop Eliminator Safely Squelches Hums and Bars

New Orleans, LA - May 3, 2007 - Richard Gray's Power Company (RGPC) announces the availability of its Ground Loop Eliminator, an HD/Digital compatible product that safely removes Ground Loops from the coax line. Simply put, Ground Loops are low AC voltage differences between Ground potentials that result in scroll bars in video and a constant, annoying hum in audio.

Ground loops are generally caused by leakage to the Ground (usually through chassis) of a component or by the presence of an unbalanced load which can modulate - or talk to - the neutral in the AC line. Since the neutral is bonded to the Ground at the residence service, this voltage on the neutral can become a small difference when multiple Grounds are present. When two or more devices are connected to a common Ground through different paths, a Ground loop occurs. Currents flow through these multiple paths and develop voltages which can cause damage, noise or a 50Hz/60Hz hum in audio or video equipment. As the name implies, the RGPC Eliminator eliminates these voltages therefore removing one of the largest and most time consuming problems in the setup of home theater today. It also does not attenuate the higher frequencies like some of the other products on the market so Digital and HD signals are not interrupted.

Cable or satellite services generally get their Ground from a Ground rod at the utility providers' pole or near the satellite dish (in the case of satellite). This is primarily used as a lightning preventative but it is also acts as another Ground. Since there is a Ground on every pole, these are usually effective compared to a single Ground rod at a residence near the incoming service. Also, because they are used with low voltage cable or satellite equipment the likelihood of Ground loops caused there is reduced.

However, once the feed is hooked up to the residence, it's a different story. The equipment or the neutral can have low level AC voltage and these can both affect the reference to Ground by allowing voltage to pass through the coax line. It is this voltage that causes the heretofore nearly impossible to remove bars or hum in a system.

When the RGPC Eliminator is combined with the recently released TV Guard coax surge protector, the combination can effectively protect sensitive AV gear from catastrophic surges and maintain a connection to the Ground while eliminating the loops. The RGPC Eliminator has a very low insertion (signal) loss and is compatible with both HD and Digital Cable.

For more information on RGPC, please visit www.richardgrayspowercompany.com.

RGPC's parallel technology captures and restores instantaneously high-current-on-demand, working cycle-to-cycle to satisfy power hungry equipment while rejecting power spikes and smaller surges that lead to premature failure of sensitive electronics. RGPC products are proudly manufactured in the U.S.A. and are sold solely through their network of professional audio/video dealers and installers.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Audioholic Overlord
"Cable or satellite services generally get their Ground from a Ground rod at the utility providers' pole or near the satellite dish (in the case of satellite). This is primarily used as a lightning preventative but it is also acts as another Ground. Since there is a Ground on every pole, these are usually effective compared to a single Ground rod at a residence near the incoming service. Also, because they are used with low voltage cable or satellite equipment the likelihood of Ground loops caused there is reduced"

Go out to 10 houses with cable and satellite, then count the number that are grounded according to code. They also have a lot of problems with voltage leaking and causing similar symptoms. I measured over 15V when I got zapped by the cable feed. The satellite guys didn't originally ground my feeds, either, until I called to tell them that I wanted it done . The person I talked with wanted to argue but I started to read what the NEC says about it and they just said that someone would be out in a day, or so.
 
Rickster71

Rickster71

Audioholic Spartan
"Cable or satellite services generally get their Ground from a Ground rod at the utility providers' pole or near the satellite dish (in the case of satellite). This is primarily used as a lightning preventative but it is also acts as another Ground. Since there is a Ground on every pole, these are usually effective compared to a single Ground rod at a residence near the incoming service. Also, because they are used with low voltage cable or satellite equipment the likelihood of Ground loops caused there is reduced"

Go out to 10 houses with cable and satellite, then count the number that are grounded according to code. They also have a lot of problems with voltage leaking and causing similar symptoms. I measured over 15V when I got zapped by the cable feed. The satellite guys didn't originally ground my feeds, either, until I called to tell them that I wanted it done . The person I talked with wanted to argue but I started to read what the NEC says about it and they just said that someone would be out in a day, or so.
Exactly right!
 
J

JAMS

Junior Audioholic
2 prong plug adaptor

Seems my old house never had a ground wired in and only 2-way plugs everywhere,and ive been reading a 60hz hum is fixed by a 2-way female to male adaptor pluged into the wall and the affending 3 prong plug into the adaptor,fixed it fine!
Ive not been able to recall being shocked by any device except a wet drill and my elec guitar used too bite me during thunderstorms , other than that cpu,amps,tv,ect: have never been fried by power surge or lightning, i did indeed get visable electrical discharges from a 80 ft sw antenna wire running horizonally to the garage,could hear it arcing to metal window frame alot!
Halicrafters sw receiver was a tough sob!
 
Skymeat

Skymeat

Audioholic Intern
I had very bad video hum for about 2 years before corrected. Cable TV goes into the PC, then from there the amp to the screen and monitors. I had everything on an APC power conditioner, changed out video cards, berated card manufacturers and Comcast.

The solution of the problem was having my buddy slash electrician create a dedicated circuit grounded like a beast. We used a 1" INOX rod that was driven 7 feet into salted earth.

All the hum disappeared immediately. It only cost 120$ for the rod and electrician time.
 
C

carmine7

Audiophyte
Jensen transformers

I had a ground looping problem when I installed my system in 2003. Thanks to this site I was able to solve both the humming and the rolling bars on the plasma TV by installing a Jensen ISO-MAX CATV Isolator.About a week ago I lost some of my basic cable channels and my modem was cutting out. I called Cablevision they sent a repair man out he found that the signal was very erratic so he finally grounded their wires to the water main in the basement . It seems it wasn`t grounded properly . Then he used his tester and found that the signal was still very distorted.When he used his tester on the cable line before going thru the Jensen Isolator the signal line was perfectly linear ( no Oscillation) but when it was hooked up after the Isolator there was lot of distortion.Could my Jensen Isolator Model VRD-1FF be bad?:
Thanks ,
 
highfigh

highfigh

Audioholic Overlord
I had a ground looping problem when I installed my system in 2003. Thanks to this site I was able to solve both the humming and the rolling bars on the plasma TV by installing a Jensen ISO-MAX CATV Isolator.About a week ago I lost some of my basic cable channels and my modem was cutting out. I called Cablevision they sent a repair man out he found that the signal was very erratic so he finally grounded their wires to the water main in the basement . It seems it wasn`t grounded properly . Then he used his tester and found that the signal was still very distorted.When he used his tester on the cable line before going thru the Jensen Isolator the signal line was perfectly linear ( no Oscillation) but when it was hooked up after the Isolator there was lot of distortion.Could my Jensen Isolator Model VRD-1FF be bad?:
Thanks ,
If the channels were part of the digital lineup, it's possible that the isolator isn't helping.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Slumlord
I had a ground looping problem when I installed my system in 2003. Thanks to this site I was able to solve both the humming and the rolling bars on the plasma TV by installing a Jensen ISO-MAX CATV Isolator.About a week ago I lost some of my basic cable channels and my modem was cutting out. I called Cablevision they sent a repair man out he found that the signal was very erratic so he finally grounded their wires to the water main in the basement . It seems it wasn`t grounded properly . Then he used his tester and found that the signal was still very distorted.When he used his tester on the cable line before going thru the Jensen Isolator the signal line was perfectly linear ( no Oscillation) but when it was hooked up after the Isolator there was lot of distortion.Could my Jensen Isolator Model VRD-1FF be bad?:
Thanks ,
The Jensen transformer likely can not handle the frequency response required for digital signals.

The tech really has not done things right, they usually don't. You need to have a good house ground. Three large 7 ft copper rods usually do the trick. These should be tied together.

Then your house ground, cable ground and phone ground, and any other service entering the house, should be tied to the house ground with No 4 copper preferably, as close to home entry as possible.

If you do that you will be free of problems.
 
C

craig7

Senior Audioholic
would it be possible to have a ground loop on a computer, because on my computer there is always a noise coming from the speakers, and if i move my mouse or click something, the noise gets louder, and if i attach a mic, it is even worse :mad:
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Slumlord
would it be possible to have a ground loop on a computer, because on my computer there is always a noise coming from the speakers, and if i move my mouse or click something, the noise gets louder, and if i attach a mic, it is even worse :mad:
Computers are just renowned for ground loops. You will need to open the case and make sure all circuits have no ground return.
 
S

spooony

Enthusiast
Actually you need to run your equipment from 1 power source. That means they must have the same ground. What happens is when you use different sources one might supply 241v a other 239v. Now since its the potential between two wires will leave your ground with 1 at the one power point and -1 at the other power point. That's 2 of AC volts running up your wires changing polarity 50 times a second.
using one power source can help with it but the best way to get rid of it is to use filters to clean out the power.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Slumlord
Actually you need to run your equipment from 1 power source. That means they must have the same ground. What happens is when you use different sources one might supply 241v a other 239v. Now since its the potential between two wires will leave your ground with 1 at the one power point and -1 at the other power point. That's 2 of AC volts running up your wires changing polarity 50 times a second.
using one power source can help with it but the best way to get rid of it is to use filters to clean out the power.
Ground loops have absolutely nothing to do with the AC voltage, and differences between outlets. Ground loops have everything to do with very small voltage potentials between grounds.

Power filters will not control ground loops. A well thought out grounding scheme will prevent ground loops.
 
Rickster71

Rickster71

Audioholic Spartan
Actually you need to run your equipment from 1 power source. That means they must have the same ground. What happens is when you use different sources one might supply 241v a other 239v. Now since its the potential between two wires will leave your ground with 1 at the one power point and -1 at the other power point. That's 2 of AC volts running up your wires changing polarity 50 times a second.
using one power source can help with it but the best way to get rid of it is to use filters to clean out the power.
:confused::confused:
In the movie, 'Mr Mom' I distinctly heard Michael Keaton say, "220....221...whatever it takes."
 
S

spooony

Enthusiast
:confused::confused:
In the movie, 'Mr Mom' I distinctly heard Michael Keaton say, "220....221...whatever it takes."
lol
^^eh that was in riddles lol ground loops are not the issue yet ground loops cause the problems what? Lol
ain't it electricity running up your wires hence the 50hz hum?
 
B

BAJANX

Audiophyte
hum problem

My Stereo system constantly has a HUM .It comes through the speakers as i turn the knob on the Pre Amp (McIntosh C36) . I am connected to a HUM-X and a Monster Cable Pro Power 3500 still the noise is LOUD.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Slumlord
My Stereo system constantly has a HUM .It comes through the speakers as i turn the knob on the Pre Amp (McIntosh C36) . I am connected to a HUM-X and a Monster Cable Pro Power 3500 still the noise is LOUD.
You have a ground loop. Fancy cables and devices are not part of the solution. Basic grounding rules are what prevents ground loops.

We need to know every connection to your system, especially cable/sat phone etc.

We need every detail in a diagram preferably. Then we tell you how to stop the hum.
 
Zer0K3wL

Zer0K3wL

Junior Audioholic
Hmmmmm 1 speaker off mine has a buzz like when my ps3 loads something their no sound from rear channels my right speaker then buzzes.

thought it was just to thin wire now i have 6 gauge wire it gotten way less tough.
 
S

shoesisok

Audiophyte
ground loops

Here are some methods to help you get rid of ground loops.Reconnect your subwoofer's coaxial cable from the subwoofer input to your receiver's subwoofer output and disconnect the cable-TV feed (or satellite feed) from your outboard set-top cable box or satellite tuner.you can contact us,mypapers@live.com
 

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