Getting a paradigm sub12 later today.

[Warpdrv]

Warpdrv, in your opinion, what's the best value for the TC Sounds drivers (using the prices at Parts Express)? Obviously, that sort of depends on the intended usage, but I'm thinking home theater primarily. I'm still learning about how the T/S parameters work, but there's something that keeps drawing me back to the LMS-R 15" at $323 a pop...

Or, maybe it's just that I don't think my stomach or wallet could stand getting more than 1 LMS Ultra 5400.

The 15" LMS-R is a great value.... I would really like to hear it to see how close to an 18" LMS it really is....

Yes there are alot of drivers out there - with excellent value and offer great performance - but I have to be honest, that once you spend some time with an LMS, everything else seems to just fall a bit short after that... it has a unique nimble/accurate quality that doesn't shine through with the other drivers... I'm not sure if its the combination of the aluminum cone and the linear motor but its something that just stands out in my mind in listening sessions, I can't explain it but I also can't forget it...

For me I guess Its almost like hearing a real live symbol and then putting a sheet or pillow case over the symbol and trying to get that same experience....

Not all drivers can do it right...... Bass is not just bass for me...

 

[clouso]

I called my dealer today and i was willing to sell my sub12.''online''... to get a sub15 but since he knew i want at least 2 subs and the price difference he told me i was better to keep my sub12 and get another... he told me 2 sub 15 would be to much for the studio 60v5?....

 

[zumbo]

I called my dealer today and i was willing to sell my sub12.''online''... to get a sub15 but since he knew i want at least 2 subs and the price difference he told me i was better to keep my sub12 and get another... he told me 2 sub 15 would be to much for the studio 60v5?....

Dealers.

 

[clouso]

Dealers.

yeay..thats what i think...dealers..!..

 

[clouso]

i will get what i want..first dual sub12..just to see and then dual 15.................

 

[KEW]

I called my dealer today and i was willing to sell my sub12.''online''... to get a sub15 but since he knew i want at least 2 subs and the price difference he told me i was better to keep my sub12 and get another... he told me 2 sub 15 would be to much for the studio 60v5?....

The presumable greatest difference between the sub12 and sub15 is how low they go (and probably how loud, but we'll leave that alone). The idea that how low you want your sub to play is determined by your speakers is simply absurd!

Next time you see him, ask him what sub the Studio20's "can handle" - I'm just curious what his notions are about this. Generally, I would expect a Paradigm dealer to be a bit more savvy than a Best Buy salesman!

 

[clouso]

The presumable greatest difference between the sub12 and sub15 is how low they go (and probably how loud, but we'll leave that alone). The idea that how low you want your sub to play is determined by your speakers is simply absurd!

Next time you see him, ask him what sub the Studio20's "can handle" - I'm just curious what his notions are about this. Generally, I would expect a Paradigm dealer to be a bit more savvy than a Best Buy salesman!

i just think he is a good guy and what you said he knows all about!...but thats the best dealer i had here in canada....and he knows im a good costumer!...but he is beeing honest and truthfull when he tells me 2 sub12 would be enough for the 60's...that im not sure thou like you said but i will get what i want anyway...

 

[Unobtainium]

I think that there might be some truth to what he is trying to get across.
My studio 100's are a much better speaker than my Athena S3's. They play music nicer in every way, but they also go lower in my room. This has allowed a very good blend with my current dual-12" sub. It was instantly better by a margin I did not see coming. I believe this is because they play lower. Maybe the dealer has experienced a similar situation with the smaller studio speakers.
Maybe he feels the sub 12 can be x-over higher with your smaller 60's. Maybe the 12" does a better job of the higher frequencies than the 15" does in his opinion. I have to assume if he is saying this,that he maybe has personal experience with the combo, and could not achieve a blend he was happy with.
Ask him if he has set-up such a combo.
My dealer told me the sub 12's were better for music in his opinion. He told me he personally has a sub 15 in his HT, but liked the sub 12 better in his music system. I got the dual 12's as I thought they would be great in my smaller room.
I really wanted more punch, or visceral impact. The high-power amps and high-excursion drivers seemed like they could do it in pairs. My budget would have been stretched with dual 15's.
I am going to keep my 12's no matter what, and buy the FW 18.0 for my next upgrade, whenever that may be.

 

[clouso]

I think that there might be some truth to what he is trying to get across.
My studio 100's are a much better speaker than my Athena S3's. They play music nicer in every way, but they also go lower in my room. This has allowed a very good blend with my current dual-12" sub. It was instantly better by a margin I did not see coming. I believe this is because they play lower. Maybe the dealer has experienced a similar situation with the smaller studio speakers.
Maybe he feels the sub 12 can be x-over higher with your smaller 60's. Maybe the 12" does a better job of the higher frequencies than the 15" does in his opinion. I have to assume if he is saying this,that he maybe has personal experience with the combo, and could not achieve a blend he was happy with.
Ask him if he has set-up such a combo.
My dealer told me the sub 12's were better for music in his opinion. He told me he personally has a sub 15 in his HT, but liked the sub 12 better in his music system. I got the dual 12's as I thought they would be great in my smaller room.
I really wanted more punch, or visceral impact. The high-power amps and high-excursion drivers seemed like they could do it in pairs. My budget would have been stretched with dual 15's.
I am going to keep my 12's no matter what, and buy the FW 18.0 for my next upgrade, whenever that may be.

yes he already had the experience and auditioned dual 12's with the 60's and he also auditioned a single 15 with the same 60's...what he told me is that he beleive dual 15 would be too much for the 60's while dual 12's are awesome with that set up... i do beleive he is beeing honest and frank...

 

[Warpdrv]

It really depends on what your room size is clouso....

Dual 12's in a sizable room will not be able to give you that pressurization and impact that a pair of 15's would... If your room isn't all that big then you should be fine... Depending on what amp power your driving your 60's with and how loud you want to get and how low you want to go as well... The 60's with decent amp power behind them can easily keep up with a pair of 15" high power subs crossed over in a larger room will level the playing field between the 2....

It sounds like he doesn't want to oversell you and thats a good dealer IMO..

If he has taken in consideration your room size, amp power and general listening levels then you should be in great shape...

Its an addicting hobby and people generally like to suggest you go for as big as you can right from the get go in order to keep you off the upgrade path.....

 

[clouso]

It really depends on what your room size is clouso....

Dual 12's in a sizable room will not be able to give you that pressurization and impact that a pair of 15's would... If your room isn't all that big then you should be fine... Depending on what amp power your driving your 60's with and how loud you want to get and how low you want to go as well... The 60's with decent amp power behind them can easily keep up with a pair of 15" high power subs crossed over in a larger room will level the playing field between the 2....

It sounds like he doesn't want to oversell you and thats a good dealer IMO..

If he has taken in consideration your room size, amp power and general listening levels then you should be in great shape...

Its an addicting hobby and people generally like to suggest you go for as big as you can right from the get go in order to keep you off the upgrade path.....

Thx for your input!...i will think about it seriously....

 

[Unobtainium]

It's true. This is just as bad as cars for upgrading. Just easier since it doesn't require taking stuff apart and tuning. I can see DIY being good as building the stuff is not only cheaper, but slows down your spending.

 

[clouso]

Well i took the desision and i will keep the sub12 and just add more and more lol....i know it will take some times but i wanna get to 4 total and i think ill be good...i wont push things and will start by a second one first..lol....

 

[Unobtainium]

Well i took the desision and i will keep the sub12 and just add more and more lol....i know it will take some times but i wanna get to 4 total and i think ill be good...i wont push things and will start by a second one first..lol....

That sounds like a heck of a plan. 4 would really control the room.

 

[clouso]

Well for those who didnt see i posted on the tread ''HSU-VTF-15H holy freakin moly''....my sub is already for sale on the net....yeah yeah..i know....lol.......

 

[billy p]

Well for those who didnt see i posted on the tread ''HSU-VTF-15H holy freakin moly''....my sub is already for sale on the net....yeah yeah..i know....lol.......

This kind of resembles the time you just bought your Toshiba and before to long you switched over to the Panasonic and later the Pioneer...lol. Sure sounds like you've second guessed yourself ...if your spending that kind of dough.. IMO you owe it to yourself to get your moneys worth...just give Nathan @ Funkywaves a PM if the Hsu option falls through. You've got nothing to lose...

 

[clouso]

This kind of resembles the time you just bought your Toshiba and before to long you switched over to the Panasonic and later the Pioneer...lol. Sure sounds like you've second guessed yourself ...if your spending that kind of dough.. IMO you owe it to yourself to get your moneys worth...just give Nathan @ Funkywaves a PM if the Hsu option falls through. You've got nothing to lose...

You are right yes i admitt it..i changed my mind often you know why?...i was and still a newbie in some sort....i made these changes yes and if you can agree i changed for better!..i can sound stupid sometimes but im not....i read a lot and i take all advises guys gives me here...and beeing in canada there are brands i cannot audition...thats why im trusting you guys.......thx...i am sure HSU is one of the best subwoofer manufacturer.....

 

[clouso]

Oh and btw having owned so many brands and kind off stuff i think made me learned!.

 

[Warpdrv]

I will say that the Paradigm Subs look nice, sound good are well constructed and the addition of pbk is excellent, but I think that they are a bit overpriced for what you can get elsewhere.....

 

[clouso]

I will say that the Paradigm Subs look nice, sound good are well constructed and the addition of pbk is excellent, but I think that they are a bit overpriced for what you can get elsewhere.....

Exactly!...i can ****in get better elswhere....haha...i am very please with the speakers thou...but sub wise i think i can have better for less...