Getting a paradigm sub12 later today.

[GranteedEV]

If the overall Q on the other subs is different then the Sub 25 which I would think it will be, the lesser quality subs may muddy up the sound of the extra clean Sub 25....

Now the question is whether or not you will like the sound of them paired together.... I am not familiar with the BPS line...

People suggest sticking with the same subs to match SQ - but it is possible that it may not be bad with them working together... Ultimately - I am an experimenter so I tend to like to try things out - trial and error if a big fav of mine... I have tried out many different drivers in purchased products and ultimately in my many different builds.

Now, I do have a suggestion for you.... instead of dropping major amounts of money on that Sub25 - how about you build your own 18" LMS - I would suggest a pair.... For the price you will pay for 1 Sub25, you can have dual LMS's that will easily blow away the Sub25's in output and SQ.

Or quad SDX15mk IIs

 

[Warpdrv]

Are those even released yet.....

I would like to see how those spec out against the LMS-R's like Mike P was wondering.... Curious if the SQ is as good...

T/S's haven't been released yet from what I have seen...

 

[GranteedEV]

Are those even released yet.....

I would like to see how those spec out against the LMS-R's like Mike P was wondering.... Curious if the SQ is as good...

T/S's haven't been released yet from what I have seen...

Nope, still waitin to see how they end up.

 

[Unobtainium]

Warp,

After reading your whole thread on AVS, I might try this. I just have to find a good cabinet guy around here. 1 of those would likely be enough, as my basement HT will only be maybe 26ft long, 12ft wide, with 9 ft ceilings. It will be open to the rest of the basement, but not to the top 2 floors.
Those subs turned out very nice. For sure alot nicer than most DIY I have seen.
I have skilled hands,(to quantify, please google my name followed by welding. have a browse of my site)but I hate wood! So like I said, a skilled cabinet guy will be needed. I'm really picky, and my lack of interest to working with wood has always been a deal breaker. If I could find a guy to make cabinets similar to yours, but curved like the paradigm offerings, I'd be set for sure.
I haven't even got my sub 12's yet and I'm making plans for upgrades. These sights are a disease!

 

[billy p]

Warp,

After reading your whole thread on AVS, I might try this. I just have to find a good cabinet guy around here. 1 of those would likely be enough, as my basement HT will only be maybe 26ft long, 12ft wide, with 9 ft ceilings. It will be open to the rest of the basement, but not to the top 2 floors.
Those subs turned out very nice. For sure alot nicer than most DIY I have seen.
I have skilled hands,(to quantify, please google my name followed by welding. have a browse of my site)but I hate wood! So like I said, a skilled cabinet guy will be needed. I'm really picky, and my lack of interest to working with wood has always been a deal breaker. If I could find a guy to make cabinets similar to yours, but curved like the paradigm offerings, I'd be set for sure.
I haven't even got my sub 12's yet and I'm making plans for upgrades. These sights are a disease!

You might want to give Nathan @ Funkywaves a PM. He could very well build the cabinet you my be seeking or even build you a sub for the cost of a sub 12. He has excellent wood working skills!

Just a thought...

 

[Warpdrv]

Or john @ AEspeakers could build the cabs as well.

Both are great cabinet makers. You could get a matching pair of curved cabs with 15" LMS-R's, & amps from Nathan for sure.

 

[billy p]

Or john @ AEspeakers could build the cabs as well.

Both are great cabinet makers. You could get a matching pair of curved cabs with amps from Nathan for sure.

Hey warp, I know John build your cabinet and did a beatiful job but shipping to Alberta could get expensive. Fwiw...being reading the Avs threads and it saddens me to hear that John's surround guy has left him high and dry?

 

[Warpdrv]

Yes - sorry I didn't know he was from Canadia
Nathan is the right choice for this one.

 

[GranteedEV]

Best ya do it before the Audioholics funky waves review hits

 

[billy p]

Best ya do it before the Audioholics funky waves review hits

You think...betcha they'll review his last....just a feeling I have.

 

[Unobtainium]

Nice. I actually like the 18" sealed one on the website. It likely performs on par with the sub 25 for alot less coin, and no aesthetic loss like SVS or Hsu.
Hmmm....you guys are evil for sure!!!
Thanks though!

 

[GranteedEV]

Nice. I actually like the 18" sealed one on the website. It likely performs on par with the sub 25 for alot less coin, and no aesthetic loss like SVS or Hsu.
Hmmm....you guys are evil for sure!!!
Thanks though!

If you've got the room, get the passive radiators version.

 

[Warpdrv]

Nice. I actually like the 18" sealed one on the website. It likely performs on par with the sub 25 for alot less coin, and no aesthetic loss like SVS or Hsu.
Hmmm....you guys are evil for sure!!!
Thanks though!

Ahhh The LMS will dominate the Sub25.

I wouldn't say don't get the sealed, small 2500^3 room like that will dip low into the single digits with room gain effortlessly. The PR's will drop like a rock hard around 15hz. Not that's a bad thing but it will def have more output and be driven easier with less amp you decide what you want, but I'm sure Nathan will back up those statements.

I'm building a new sealed LMS to replace the Submersive pretty soon. It'll be driven by my extra 4000w crest. Nothing compares to the LMS. IMO

 

[GranteedEV]

Ahhh The LMS will dominate the Sub25.

I wouldn't say don't get the sealed, small 2500^3 room like that will dip low into the single digits with room gain effortlessly. The PR's will drop like a rock hard around 15hz. Not that's a bad thing but it will def have more output and be driven easier with less amp you decide what you want, but I'm sure Nathan will back up those statements.

I'm building a new sealed LMS to replace the Submersive pretty soon. It'll be driven by my extra 4000w crest. Nothing compares to the LMS. IMO

Just an FYI to Unobtainium, Funkywaves denotes the LMS Ultra as "18" Linear Motor Driver" and the LMS Pro as the "18" Underhung Neodymium Driver".

The former has better deep subsonic bass and excellent output whereas the second has less deep bass but can give you ridiculously clean concert level output.

They, along with the Exodus Maelstrom X 21", Exodus Maelstrom X 18", and Re XXX 18" are some of the top readily available "big" drivers out there... because they're big they reproduce bass with ease and clarity that smaller drivers just can't. They may possibly struggle outside a subwoofer passband but who cares if your sub can't do 200hz as greatly as someone else's sub? In the average subwoofer passband of ~15hz to ~140hz they'll pretty much all wipe the floor with most commercial subs given the right enclosure and proper amplification. They're not necessarily constrained by concepts like "footprint" or "WAF". I don't know much about for example the MTX Jackhammer but it may be a quality driver.... but at that price a couple LMS-Ultras are a much smarter option.

There are of course lots of nice "not-so-big" DIY 12" and 15" drivers though. Acoustic Elegance, Seas, CSS Exodus, TC, SB Acoustics, all make nice ones but those are usually for those people with the same constraints as those buying commercial subs. The 18" and 21" offerings are the ones that really shine in DIY

If you wanna go big... you GO BIG

 

[templemaners]

Warpdrv, in your opinion, what's the best value for the TC Sounds drivers (using the prices at Parts Express)? Obviously, that sort of depends on the intended usage, but I'm thinking home theater primarily. I'm still learning about how the T/S parameters work, but there's something that keeps drawing me back to the LMS-R 15" at $323 a pop...

Or, maybe it's just that I don't think my stomach or wallet could stand getting more than 1 LMS Ultra 5400.

 

[GranteedEV]

If you've got the room for huge boxes, go with a pair of Mal-X 18s instead of LMS-Rs. While an LMS can probably have a bit less distortion than XBL^2 and requires a smaller box, the difference between the two drivers isn't enourmous, but the price is. LMS-Rs are for people with box-size constraints, LMS-Ultras are for people we hate, and Maelstroms are for normal people with budget constraints

The next step after getting a driver, of course, is deciding on a box that works with your room. I've got a low Q sealed cabinet for my mal-x right now, but I'm going to have to take some measurements to see what kind of room gain I'm getting to see if I would be better off with a transmission line, ported, or passive radiator box, or maybe even try my hand at a tapped horn.

 

[Unobtainium]

I really am stuck on that look for some reason. The Fw-18.0 is a beautiful box similar to the sub 12's that this thread is about. That elegant look.
I'm sure the 18" LMS is killer, so I might add it to my system. Is Funky waves Canadian? Is that why you think it's a good fit?
On topic, say I love my sub 12's, and I want to add the 18, I think I would run them stereo like my bps 150i's were. Send the L/R bass to them up front.
Or, is it better to keep 3 "subs"?
I know for a fact that getting rid of them is not going to happen. I love the look, and so does the wife. She will not understand selling them.
Who has cranked up their sub12's so far? Anybody else have 2?
The room they will occupy for at least 2 years is 1800ft3, open to another
3000ft3, but it doesn't seem that bad. Right now the lonely 400w rms dual 12" mirage is exceeding 100dB without strain, and hits almost 110 when the wife and kid aren't around. I'm thinking the dual 12's will keep me giggly until the move into the basement.(concrete, wide open to 6000ft3)
Anyway, I better go weld something...

 

[GranteedEV]

I'm sure the 18" LMS is killer, so I might add it to my system. Is Funky waves Canadian? Is that why you think it's a good fit?

Being canadian is a good advantage as you're not paying imports... but that has nothing to do with it. The guy is a great woodworker plain and simple, and he uses only the finest available drivers in the world.

 

[Unobtainium]

Being canadian is a good advantage as you're not paying imports... but that has nothing to do with it. The guy is a great woodworker plain and simple, and he uses only the finest available drivers in the world.

Good to hear. I'm going to google them and see what kind of reviews are out there.

 

[billy p]

Good to hear. I'm going to google them and see what kind of reviews are out there.

Don't forget to use .ca when you do....