DAC Comparison

[DubPlate]

Hi guys:

I have a Marantz av7702mkii. I learned the built in DAC for the mkii (which supports 192/32) is a slight upgrade from this dac: TI PCM 1690 (24-bit/192 kHz).

I have a CD player on the way that has the following built in DAC: Wolfson 192/24.

In order to save myself too much experimention when the CD player arrives, does anyone have an inclination as to which is the better DAC? In other words, should I use the DAC in the CD player or the processor?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

What you asking it's like asking which jet engine is best for daily driving to work.
Or in other words - if one measured -120db thd and other is -121 db thd - it doesn't matter since you can't really notice it anything below -100db - bare it mind - it's exponencial scale

 

[lovinthehd]

If you hook up your player's analog outputs to the receiver as well as connect it digitally you could compare and see if you can tell any difference (and you could just leave it hooked up that way so all you're doing is fooling with a remote control). They're both quite competent dacs but don't dictate sound quality just based on the chip alone. I think you're reading too much into the role of a dac chip....

 

[DubPlate]

What you asking it's like asking which jet engine is best for daily driving to work.
Or in other words - if one measured -120db thd and other is -121 db thd - it doesn't matter since you can't really notice it anything below -100db - bare it mind - it's exponencial scale

I supposed I asked the question as before I got curious about this kind of stuff, I noticed that my Xbox Console hooked up by RCA to my Onkyo 604 would sound better than my PS3 hooked up by HDMI to the same receiver.

Based on what I have read thus far, the main difference appears to consist of which DAC was being used (that of the PS3 or Xbox Console).

As I have hooked my current system up in a way that makes it relatively inaccessible (kids roaming about and such), I wanted to save some experimentation time in choosing between the two DACs of which I spoke, if they are relatively close in terms of sound quality.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[lovinthehd]

You could also be misinterpreting input levels/gain structure for differences in sound quality.

 

[DubPlate]

I do suppose that I could be doing just that, but if I recall correctly all my source input gain on my Onkyo was set to 0db, except for my phono input, if that makes any sense.

However, I think I should do as you suggest and hook it up both ways was simultaneously.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[lovinthehd]

I do suppose that I could be doing just that, but if I recall correctly all my source input gain on my Onkyo was set to 0db, except for my phono input, if that makes any sense.

However, I think I should do as you suggest and hook it up both ways was simultaneously.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That just meant your input gains were set equally for various sources except for your phono.

 

[cel4145]

Depending on what sound modes you are using on your receiver, analog inputs may get converted back to digital, processed, and then back to analog by your AVRs DAC.

 

[PENG]

Hi guys:

I have a Marantz av7702mkii. I learned the built in DAC for the mkii (which supports 192/32) is a slight upgrade from this dac: TI PCM 1690 (24-bit/192 kHz).

I have a CD player on the way that has the following built in DAC: Wolfson 192/24.

In order to save myself too much experimention when the CD player arrives, does anyone have an inclination as to which is the better DAC? In other words, should I use the DAC in the CD player or the processor?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It is hard to say because it the overall specs of a DAC depends not only the DAC chip but everything else that works with the chip. If you are just comparing the specs of the chip itself you still have to know the exact model. For example, the Wolfson WM8741 has better specs than the AK4458 that is probably the one in your 7702mkii but the WM8740 is not. You CD player probably has the Wolfson chip that is even below the WM8741 so again it is hard to know.

 

[Bucknekked]

I will wager a doughnut you can't tell the difference. I am going to go ahead and eat mine now because I have faith in the outcome.

 

[DubPlate]

I will wager a doughnut you can't tell the difference. I am going to go ahead and eat mine now because I have faith in the outcome.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[DubPlate]

I will wager a doughnut you can't tell the difference. I am going to go ahead and eat mine now because I have faith in the outcome.

So then is it safe to say that with all else equal, one DAC from another will generally not produce an audible difference in terms of quality/accuracy? Or is because the DACs of which I spoke are similarly situated?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[lovinthehd]

So then is it safe to say that with all else equal, one DAC from another will generally not produce an audible difference in terms of quality/accuracy? Or is because the DACs of which I spoke are similarly situated?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yep, pretty much. Would you please remove the tapatalk/phone ad from your tapatalk settings? Please?

 

[DubPlate]

Yep, pretty much. Would you please remove the tapatalk/phone ad from your tapatalk settings? Please?

Got it. Can do.

 

[PENG]

Or is because the DACs of which I spoke are similarly situated?

I actually don't know which Wolfson DAC you referred to. It may be safe to assume the one your Marantz is either the AK4458 or one with comparable specs, but no idea which Wolfson is in your CD player.

AKM, Burr Brown/TI, Wolfson all have multiple models in their DAC product line. So even just to compare the DAC chip itself, we have no idea which one (your AVR vs CD player) is better, without knowing the exact model number.

 

[DubPlate]

I actually don't know which Wolfson DAC you referred to. It may be safe to assume the one your Marantz is either the AK4458 or one with comparable specs, but no idea which Wolfson is in your CD player.

AKM, Burr Brown/TI, Wolfson all have multiple models in their DAC product line. So even just to compare the DAC chip itself, we have no idea which one (your AVR vs CD player) is better, without knowing the exact model number.

Certainly appreciate all the feedback. If this helps, the CD player is the Onkyo C-7030.

 

[gzubeck]

Hi guys:

I have a Marantz av7702mkii. I learned the built in DAC for the mkii (which supports 192/32) is a slight upgrade from this dac: TI PCM 1690 (24-bit/192 kHz).

I have a CD player on the way that has the following built in DAC: Wolfson 192/24.

In order to save myself too much experimention when the CD player arrives, does anyone have an inclination as to which is the better DAC? In other words, should I use the DAC in the CD player or the processor?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think this is more like asking do you like your champagne dry or sweet etc. each presentation and dac companies chips have their advantages and disadvantages. Also if you dont have to go through extra steps in conversion the cd player may sound better straight to your preamp. If the preamp stinks in the marantz receiver you may think the direct digital connection may be better than the analog outputs. theres no way in getting around trying a couple of options unless you run across someone with your exact equipment.

 

[shadyJ]

If a DAC sounds different from other DACs, it is either broken or very poorly designed.

 

[killdozzer]

If a DAC sounds different from other DACs, it is either broken or very poorly designed.

This comes closest to everything I read on DAC's so far, if one doesn't confuse the DAC itself with the entire unit so to speak. A lot of DAC units do something with the signal after the conversion itself and this is what distinguishes them - everything that comes after conversion and before the signal leaves the unit. Digital to analog conversion seems to be about an exact task given to the device and it is not a difficult task at that. I was looking for information on DAC's to see whether I need an extra (and expensive) box next to an inbuilt DAC in an amp or CD player. Apparently, only if you're planing on buying a DAC that can serve as a preamp and you like the sound of the preamp section and it is in your budget should you buy a separate DAC.

In your case, if you notice anything, a safer bet is to attribute that to the sound difference between Onkyo and Marantz IF!! there is one. I can't tell as I never heard Onkyo playing.

 

[PENG]

Certainly appreciate all the feedback. If this helps, the CD player is the Onkyo C-7030.

Yes that helps. So at least we now can make 2 reasonable assumptions.

1. The Marantz AV7702MkII has the AK4458 or the TI 1795, more likely the AK4458 because that's in the SR7010 and the AV7702MkII was launched at around the same time.

2. The Onkyo 7030 has the WM8718 based on a review linked below as well as the published specs (SNR)
https://www.amazon.com/review/RZN7NUL44AUKX

Based on above assumptions, the AV7702MkII has a better DAC chip (better specs). That does not mean the 7702MkII will sound better, worse or same as there are many other factors.