Canton Vento vs Chrono SL (models with ceramic tweeters)

everettT

everettT

Audioholic Ninja
Found them in the garage
Not to keep hijacking the thread, but I'd bet the woofers are the same. The cabinets would make a fun project speaker when time is available, or definitely make good surround speakers.
 
slipperybidness

slipperybidness

Audioholic Spartan
It’s not that they were really boomy or bass was even bad. Just was more boomy then I like with a ringing. Really GE are great speakers, I just found something I prefer. Another factor was aesthetically they weren’t as stunning. I didn’t really mention that because it’s not as important to anyone what I think they look like.

What I’d like to see is GE and definitive change the amps.Delay or phase knobs would drastically improve sound for using lfe input. Setting to large just doesn’t sound as good when using multiple subs from companies like Rythmik, jtr, svs, psa or Hsu. In fact I had a pair of energy ap5+2 that had all those features and even more with peq at one frequency. Those are 20 years old now.
Yeah, personally I like the understated look on the GEs, but that is all just personal preference.

I'm currently just running my T2s as a straight 2CH system in my bedroom, just speaker level inputs. They are actually quite nice in that application.

I previously had them set up in 3.1 with a Rythmik F15HP for many years! So, I'm with you on the separate subs.
 
C

chemist323

Audioholic Intern
Is there any type of music, pink noise, etc, i should use to break them in?
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Thanks everyone for your help, finally placed my order on AC4L. Went with the Vento 896 towers, 866.2 center, and 816.2 for surrounds. Merry xmas to me! Approximately in 2004 I planned on getting some Boston acoustics towers but ended up going with an open box boston acoustics Micro 9000 system from Good guys. The center channel of that system is my current center LOL. Those speakers are still partially in use in the garage but now using Kef Q100 for fronts. I've waited all this time to get a true upgrade. I'm excited!
Congratulations on the new speakers!
I think you'll be very happy with them! I use yoga blocks under my Vento 876's to raise them a bit for critical listening. They sound fine on the floor, but a little better if you raise the tweeter closer to ear level! Talking fine points! If you leave them on the floor, they will still distinguish themselves as exceptional speakers, but raising them and removing the grill sounds the best to me!
 
C

chemist323

Audioholic Intern
Congratulations on the new speakers!
I think you'll be very happy with them! I use yoga blocks under my Vento 876's to raise them a bit for critical listening. They sound fine on the floor, but a little better if you raise the tweeter closer to ear level! Talking fine points! If you leave them on the floor, they will still distinguish themselves as exceptional speakers, but raising them and removing the grill sounds the best to me!
Thanks, very excited! I wish I could leave the grills off but I have a 1.5yo that would love to explore the drivers.
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Thanks, very excited! I wish I could leave the grills off but I have a 1.5yo that would love to explore the drivers.
It would be great if someone started making aftermarket grills that only covered the woofers! The grill won't have much (if any) audible effect on the woofers, and I am assuming that the tweeter and mid are above the kid's reach (for now, at least).
However, just like any speaker, the grill is not going to ruin the sound, it is just a little better with it off!

Or you can get one of these:
Crutchfield advertises them for keeping your dog out of the trash, but Crutchfield is an audio company, so we know what they are really thinking!;):D
 
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KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Does anyone have any idea on how to remove the trim rings on the drivers to get to the bolts?
I would really like to take a couple apart and find out exactly what differences exist in the components.
Tim says they clearly sound different, but that is not my experience*. I certainly don't know that they are identical (other than cabinets); however I have not seen any proof that they are not.

*within reason - they do sound different, but I have tested amps to see if they sounded different using identical speakers side-by-side and they did sound different! I switched the cables and found that most (if not all) of the audible differences I was hearing came from one speaker being 14" to the right of the other rather than a difference in amps. So I do not expect the same speaker to sound identical unless it is in the exact same location. I feel like I can get a better comparison of speakers with instant electronic level matched switching as compared to having to take the time to physically relocate them! I will say that the differences I heard due to position were not ones that allowed me to conclude "this one sounds better" (though I would expect that to depend on the specific instance).
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
I can listen to the the cheaper canton and hear that canton sound that even the reference have.
I hear a substantial difference between my Chrono 502.2 and my Vento 820.2 and would not recognize a Canton sound in common between them (aside that they are both good speakers for the cost). I believe the Infinity R162 and the Vento 820.2 share more similarities in their sound.
However, the Chrono SL 536.2 sounds very much the same as the Vento 820.2 (aside from the bass difference due to one being a 7" bookshelf and the other being a 6" bookshelf)!
But my curiosity is truly piqued and I am committed to finding out what exact differences really exist! I can get a little OCD that way. I will get into these speakers!
 
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C

chemist323

Audioholic Intern
Just regular content, even just basic cable tv. After 30 hours or so they should be good to start increasing the volume levels. After the 60-70 mark they’ll be about done. What preamp, avr or amp are you using? With a lower power avr I’d probably not go past -15 on volume. Wouldn’t be fun smoking a tweeter in the first week. Also if it’s a denon or marantz get a cooler for it. With the cantons it’ll get very hot. anything under 90db with many 4ohm dips needs a good power supply.
I'll be using a denon x4300, what kind of cooler are you referring to ? any recs?
 
slipperybidness

slipperybidness

Audioholic Spartan
I love the idea of a simple setup like that for a bedroom. Hard to beat powered towers if you don’t have room for subs. I used bp7001 in my bedroom and was awesome. I still really like the older definitive technology gear that Sandy did. Have you ever heard the bp7000, 7001 or bp3000? If you like GE you’d probably like them.
I auditioned the BP line when I bought my GEs, I think they were on the 8xxx series at that point.

The thing that took me away from the DT BP was the general consensus that they needed to be pulled out away from the front wall more than a conventional speaker. And, in my auditioning, the GE sounded better to my ears.
 
S

snakeeyes

Audioholic Ninja
Be careful breaking into the 536.2. The prices went back up after the sale ended. :)
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Also do you own the newer vento line to compare serial and part numbers? 820.2 isn’t the best to compare. Good luck and I hope you find peace with it.
I have a pair of Vento 876's. These do not have the trim rings, but they are the titanium driver. I seriously doubt they would design and manufacture a different set of drivers. For manufacturers, it is so much easier to use an existing set of parts and assembly line procedure than to maintain alternate processes that there needs to be substantial saving in the cost of components to justify it. Witness that Marantz used the same amp section in their 6 and 7 series AVR's for several years (as established with measurements and inspection of their SR6001 and SR7001). The 7 series were spec'ed at the actual capability of the amp and they down-rated the 6 series by 10 or 15 WPC just to make it appear to be a different capability.
I think it is curious that the 8" titanium woofers in the Chrono SL 596.2 are 200mm rounded to 7.9" while the 200mm titanium woofers in the Vento are rounded to 8", but we will see what Canton did.
seems like you’re on a mission to try and prove me wrong and you right.
Sorry, I can understand why you feel that way, because I guess I am, if I am right!
However, if you are right, I'm on a mission to prove myself wrong!
So, you see, my mission is to find out what real differences there truly are!
 
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KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
does the 876 have same drivers as your vento bookshelves?
My Vento bookshelf is the 820.2 which predates the titanium woofer, so definitely not. However the 876 does have the newer Titanium driver. It is likely not the same part number even if it is the same driver because I suspect there is a feature on the newer driver frame to accommodate the trim ring and they would change the P/N..
 
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mtrot

Full Audioholic
get a ac infinity cooler to sit on top of that denon. Do you like listening louder? A nice option would be a better avr like the integra drx 7.1 or 1.1. Even has a true pre amp mode when you buy an amp. Pre amp mode is way more important then people realize. As you increase the volume distortion comes into the channels even when you run a separate amp. Eventually you’ll start clipping and think your new 200x5 emotiva or whatever is junk. When it’s really the avr that is doing it. Only denon that does this is the 8500. Also the power on those integra avrs is a substantial improvement over the denon 4300. If you were on a budget I’d say keep it and it’s a good avr to build around. You said money doesn’t matter so the move to a better avr is definitely smart. The integra is a d3 amp, so digital to make it simpler to explain. Runs way cooler with way less power draw. At 4 ohms and 1 percent distortion or below you’ll be getting close to 280x2, 240x5 and even 200x7. The denon will be half that or less.
Hmm, I've been using my Denon AVR-X5200 as a pre-pro(for the front L/R channels) for years now. It seems to sound great, but it's getting rather long in the tooth, and I've wondered if a newer AVR with more state of the art DACs would decode Blu-ray and UHD Blu-ray better. I can't say it's clipping or distorting, but I do like the idea of a true pre-amp mode. One drawback to the 5200 is that it does not transmit the full UHD data, which means I have to run two HDMI cables from my Oppo 203, one to the TV and one to the AVR.

I wonder if I'd be giving anything up by going with one of these Integra units, such as the ability to play my SACDs via DSD output over HDMI from my Oppo 203.
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
I was told I can buy the new trim rings for my 896 to make them look like 896.2. Drivers are the same on 896 and 896.2.
I think he may have misled you!
The fit is so perfect on these that I could not get in through the woofer of the SL 526.2, however the tweeter trim ring had enough clearance for me to get into it and the trim ring is held in with pegs (like most grills that are not magnetic use). The holes that the pegs fit into are in the outer speaker ring (where the speaker bolts to the cabinet). That is for the tweeter trim ring, but I have to believe they would use the same attachment system for the woofer.
The 896 does not have the holes required for the trim ring to attach!
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Okay! I just got done looking over the crossover in the Chrono SL-526.2.
I had in my phone photos I had taken of the Vento 820.2 crossover.
The components of the crossovers are absolutely identical in layout and every part number which is a little surprising given the Vento 820.2 is 2 (?) generations older than the Chrono SL-526.2.
This also supports my suspicion that the change to titanium was likely only cosmetic as you would expect a woofer with significantly different performance to require modification of the crossover.
I will get up photos before the end of the weekend. I have a pretty clean photo of the 820.2 crossover, but the photo of the 526.2 is compromised since I could not get in through the woofer to give me a good vantage point. However, the photo from the terminal plate shows about two thirds of the components and the rest I established using a flashlight and inspection mirror. I tried to get photos, but the port is only 1-3/4" wide and the camera kept focusing on the wrong thing (and I established a renewed appreciation for the human eye)!
However, I think when you see the photos, there won't be any reason to doubt that the Chrono SL (ceramic tweeter) is indeed identical to the Vento except for the cabinet!
I believe you believe you heard a distinct and significant difference, but the bottom line is we are not machines and if you expect something to sound better it usually will. This is called "expectation bias" and is why I set up where I can switch back and forth instantly in the middle of a note at the push of a button. It makes it easy to repeat/verify and pick out specifics. It is not perfect, but the best I can manage with a subjective evaluation.
 
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Trell

Trell

Audioholic Chief
Okay! I just got done looking over the crossover in the Chrono SL-526.2.
I had in my phone photos I had taken of the Vento 820.2 crossover.
The components of the crossovers are absolutely identical in layout and every part number which is a little surprising given the Vento 820.2 is 2 (?) generations older than the Chrono SL-526.2.
This also supports my suspicion that the change to titanium was likely only cosmetic as you would expect a woofer with significantly different performance to require modification of the crossover.
I will get up photos before the end of the weekend. I have a pretty clean photo of the 820.2 crossover, but the photo of the 526.2 is compromised since I could not get in through the woofer to give me a good vantage point. However, the photo from the terminal plate shows about two thirds of the components and the rest I established using a flashlight and inspection mirror. I tried to get photos, but the port is only 1-3/4" wide and the camera kept focusing on the wrong thing (and I established a renewed appreciation for the human eye)!
However, I think when you see the photos, there won't be any reason to doubt that the Chrono SL (ceramic tweeter) is indeed identical to the Vento except for the cabinet!
I believe you believe you heard a distinct and significant difference, but the bottom line is we are not machines and if you expect something to sound better it usually will. This is called "expectation bias" and is why I set up where I can switch back and forth instantly in the middle of a note at the push of a button. It makes it easy to repeat/verify and pick out specifics. It is not perfect, but the best I can manage with a subjective evaluation.
Canton typically percolate down technology from higher end speaker series after some time, and combine that with frequent refreshes it is not surprising that components are reused. I think I've earlier posted a picture from a review of a Vento speaker where the crossover was marked with the previous models number.

With the Vento series refreshed about every three year it stands to reason that most refreshes have minor (if any) improvements with respect to sound quality.
 
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snakeeyes

Audioholic Ninja
I had the denon 5200, was a decent avr for it’s time. The integra models I mentioned would be a substantial upgrade. Couldn’t tell you about the oppo. I have a Sony uhd player that I’ve used maybe 5 times. I don’t use any kind of discs to watch or listen anymore.

I don’t hear any difference from streaming vudu movies or playing tidal.

I’ve done many tests with numerous enthusiasts that are shocked when you level match spl levels with vudu vs disc. People have no clue which is better but it helps having good equipment and fast internet.

our family now streams everything
And it helps to have the Rythmik FV18, right? LOL :)
 

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