AudioScienceReviews measured SVS Ultras and the pink panther gets out in one piece!

T

Tachead7075

Audioholic Intern
If you are worried about Atmos speakers blending with the system, you don't need to. I am a big proponent of matching up the main speakers for Multi-Channel audio and built my system accordingly, with the closest matching Speakers at Main, Center and Surround. Even my rears currently have matching tweeters! But when I add Atmos, I'm going to be using different drivers most likely, though my goal will be to have the voicing still as close as possible, they will be different.
Part of the reason I want them to blend well is in case I ever want to repurpose them to Surrounds. I would imagine also, particularly when listening to Atmos or Aura 3D music, blending is still quite important for the best transitions and SQ. Not to mention, why not try and have them blend as it will only increase SQ if only a little bit. Given the choice I would just go with identical drivers but, Paradigm only makes in ceiling now and that is not an option for me as I have decided I want to stay modular. Hopefully they make an Elevation option for all of their lines eventually(I called and complained about this lack of elevation options jusy to make sure they know there is a demand). If not, I will be looking at options like SVS, KEF, Monitor Audio, etc. as they all make this style.

All of my drivers are matched now as well...

Towers: 2 x Paradigm Premier 800F
Center: Paradigm Premier 600C
Surrounds: 2 x Paradigm Premier 200B(I may add 2 more 200B's or Surround 3's for rear Surrounds once I have a larger room to work with)

Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk
 
ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Spartan
Part of the reason I want them to blend well is in case I ever want to repurpose them to Surrounds. I would imagine also, particularly when listening to Atmos or Aura 3D music, blending is still quite important for the best transitions and SQ. Not to mention, why not try and have them blend as it will only increase SQ if only a little bit. Given the choice I would just go with identical drivers but, Paradigm only makes in ceiling now and that is not an option for me as I have decided I want to stay modular. Hopefully they make an Elevation option for all of their lines eventually(I called and complained about this lack of elevation options jusy to make sure they know there is a demand). If not, I will be looking at options like SVS, KEF, Monitor Audio, etc. as they all make this style.

All of my drivers are matched now as well...

Towers: 2 x Paradigm Premier 800F
Center: Paradigm Premier 600C
Surrounds: 2 x Paradigm Premier 200B(I may add 2 more 200B's or Surround 3's for rear Surrounds once I have a larger room to work with)

Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk
First, if you choose the Elevation Speakers, I would urge you consider not repurposing those to a more demanding job.
I do not know your listening habits; likewise I am not experienced with those speakers. However, I would consider those to be on par with small Standmounts, and with the sacrifices usually made for size, they just will not perform as well.
The caveat there is if you only game or use them for HT, it may very well not even matter.
I mentioned before that my primary usage is music, and I built my system out to support Multi-Channel recordings. I'm not talking running in Multi-channel stereo, but DTS 5.1 CDs and SACD content. I did not want to leave anything on the table in terms of a speaker not hanging with my mains, and just short of having 5 matching towers, I did just that.

So back to the other point... this is a rabbit hole that people tend to fall down. I was the same way early on, trying to figure out how to match EVERYTHING. ;) The truth of it is that it really does not matter, and for this you need to consider what these speakers do. Unlike the Mains and the Center, the other speakers are all in a support roll. Yes, that roll has changed over the years and there are greater demands placed on them, but the fine point is that you are never going to notice a timbre mismatch when a helicopter flies overhead, or a bullet whizzes past...
Most people I've talked to also prefer a speaker that has a bit more controlled directivity to it for Atmos, as opposed to wide dispersion.
Those examples I cited are all more or less in the realm of Spacial Cues. By getting at least four good Atmos points, usually Top Front and Top Back, and having a very tightly dialed in system in terms of placement and separation of Atmos layer from Bed Layer, you then achieve a bubble of sound where you get that added dimension of sound coming from overhead.
I know several members here with very discerning demands for their front speakers who use mismatched speakers for the Surrounds. Likewise, many friends here use different speaker for Atmos (those using in-ceiling for example, rarely have the option of matching their mains).

Regardless, at the end of the day, it is your system and your ducats!

By all accounts, the SVS Elevation speakers are great for wall mounting at the ceiling and getting that near to perfect Atmos placement. I do not think you would be disappointed in using those for that purpose.
 
D

Danzilla31

Audioholic Ninja
First, if you choose the Elevation Speakers, I would urge you consider not repurposing those to a more demanding job.
I do not know your listening habits; likewise I am not experienced with those speakers. However, I would consider those to be on par with small Standmounts, and with the sacrifices usually made for size, they just will not perform as well.
The caveat there is if you only game or use them for HT, it may very well not even matter.
I mentioned before that my primary usage is music, and I built my system out to support Multi-Channel recordings. I'm not talking running in Multi-channel stereo, but DTS 5.1 CDs and SACD content. I did not want to leave anything on the table in terms of a speaker not hanging with my mains, and just short of having 5 matching towers, I did just that.

So back to the other point... this is a rabbit hole that people tend to fall down. I was the same way early on, trying to figure out how to match EVERYTHING. ;) The truth of it is that it really does not matter, and for this you need to consider what these speakers do. Unlike the Mains and the Center, the other speakers are all in a support roll. Yes, that roll has changed over the years and there are greater demands placed on them, but the fine point is that you are never going to notice a timbre mismatch when a helicopter flies overhead, or a bullet whizzes past...
Most people I've talked to also prefer a speaker that has a bit more controlled directivity to it for Atmos, as opposed to wide dispersion.
Those examples I cited are all more or less in the realm of Spacial Cues. By getting at least four good Atmos points, usually Top Front and Top Back, and having a very tightly dialed in system in terms of placement and separation of Atmos layer from Bed Layer, you then achieve a bubble of sound where you get that added dimension of sound coming from overhead.
I know several members here with very discerning demands for their front speakers who use mismatched speakers for the Surrounds. Likewise, many friends here use different speaker for Atmos (those using in-ceiling for example, rarely have the option of matching their mains).

Regardless, at the end of the day, it is your system and your ducats!

By all accounts, the SVS Elevation speakers are great for wall mounting at the ceiling and getting that near to perfect Atmos placement. I do not think you would be disappointed in using those for that purpose.
You can actually even ceiling mount the SVS Elevations which makes them perform even better in my opinion
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Warlord
How they compare to other other speakers of similar design like Paradigm as they also use an aluminum tweeter with a phase plug grille in front on many of their models. I would also like to hear opinions on how they blend with Paradigm, from anyone who has listened to or owned both, as I am considering 4 of their elevation speakers to add to my Paradigm Premier setup.

Sent from my SM-N975W using Tapatalk
I haven't had an opportunity to listen to much from Paradigm, but have had a 5.0 Ultra setup for the last few years. I wouldn't have upgraded from them had I not heard better in the form of the Sierra 2 with the RAAL ribbon tweet. I would describe them as very clean, detailed and non fatiguing. In fact if anything they are just a touch of the laid back side. Capable of handling lots of power and maintain their composure very well at high spl.
 
ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Spartan
*blushes
Wait! No, we are supposed to focus on the topic! SVS, not S-E-X with SVS. :rolleyes: :p :p

Lets try this...

Based on everything I've seen, and the moderate amount of experiences I've had, most everything else in the pricepoint categories that the SVS Speakers live in share similar weaknesses in that every speaker will have some balance of strength against the trade off of possible poor (less-than-optimal) performance somewhere else.
Consider that the main complaint about the Ultra Towers is that placement is challenging. @Pogre says they may be a bit laid back...
This is the story with everything though.
The best part of familiarizing ourselves with even the BS reviews is that they do tend to call out the aspects that may be troubling, even if only in an oblique manner. A great example is the Stereophile B&W 700Series Tower review where the review is pretty glowing, but the measurements show a different picture with SA remarking that since his colleague didn't comment on an audible issue maybe it isn't a problem...
I don't think Martin Logan and Monitor Audio are without problems, I just found their issues to not be noticeable to me. Conversely, Def Tech, B&W, and even KEF all had issues that would have made me a very unhappy owner.
Just as another example, consider @KEW and his comparison threads about different speakers, different drivers, etc... It all points to the same thing: what works and why and how do we interpret it for individual taste. :)

At the end of the day, I think SVS has earned a valid reputation for quality gear and exceptional CS. If I were to give up on building speakers, I would easily consider their Prime Pinnacles and Ultra Standmounts for the GreatRoom.

Ok... now back to the S-E-X!
:oops:

:p :D :cool:
 
T

Tachead7075

Audioholic Intern
First, if you choose the Elevation Speakers, I would urge you consider not repurposing those to a more demanding job.
I do not know your listening habits; likewise I am not experienced with those speakers. However, I would consider those to be on par with small Standmounts, and with the sacrifices usually made for size, they just will not perform as well.
The caveat there is if you only game or use them for HT, it may very well not even matter.
I mentioned before that my primary usage is music, and I built my system out to support Multi-Channel recordings. I'm not talking running in Multi-channel stereo, but DTS 5.1 CDs and SACD content. I did not want to leave anything on the table in terms of a speaker not hanging with my mains, and just short of having 5 matching towers, I did just that.

So back to the other point... this is a rabbit hole that people tend to fall down. I was the same way early on, trying to figure out how to match EVERYTHING. ;) The truth of it is that it really does not matter, and for this you need to consider what these speakers do. Unlike the Mains and the Center, the other speakers are all in a support roll. Yes, that roll has changed over the years and there are greater demands placed on them, but the fine point is that you are never going to notice a timbre mismatch when a helicopter flies overhead, or a bullet whizzes past...
Most people I've talked to also prefer a speaker that has a bit more controlled directivity to it for Atmos, as opposed to wide dispersion.
Those examples I cited are all more or less in the realm of Spacial Cues. By getting at least four good Atmos points, usually Top Front and Top Back, and having a very tightly dialed in system in terms of placement and separation of Atmos layer from Bed Layer, you then achieve a bubble of sound where you get that added dimension of sound coming from overhead.
I know several members here with very discerning demands for their front speakers who use mismatched speakers for the Surrounds. Likewise, many friends here use different speaker for Atmos (those using in-ceiling for example, rarely have the option of matching their mains).

Regardless, at the end of the day, it is your system and your ducats!

By all accounts, the SVS Elevation speakers are great for wall mounting at the ceiling and getting that near to perfect Atmos placement. I do not think you would be disappointed in using those for that purpose.
Well, I don't really plan on it right now but, I figured if I don't like the added effect 4 x height makes(many say it isn't worth the $1000+) then I can always add a nice SVS center and sub for a 5.1 satellite system for my bedroom or hobby room. The other reason is if Paradigm even releases matching heights I would swap them out to match(for both aesthetics and a slightly better timber match). In this case they would be used mainly for HT as I have my main system for music. I was talking about HIFI Aura 3D encoded music for instance like Tidal offers. More and more Atmos music offerings seam to be being added too. I didn't want to leave anything on the table either so, all of my tweeters and mid woofers are identical on my mains, surrounds, and center(driver size and design). I also will soon have identical matching subs. I just figured having identical elevation too would make it even better. Plus, the gf likes stuff to match aesthetics wise.

Yes, I realize elevation do only a small part of the mix. But, I still can't help but think a timber match will help with things like Atmos and Aura 3D concerts and music. Also, in your example, if a helicopter took off from the ground and transitioned to the elevations it would transition more smoothly with timber matched drivers. Now, would that difference be huge, probably not, maybe not even audible. But, I am a bit anal lol and given the choice I would always choose to fully timber match. Also, there is aesthetics like I mentioned earlier. Both myself and my gf prefer symmetry and matching furniture in general. Paradigm actually makes really nice matching in ceiling options like these...
Or, these...
But, I want to stay modular and am buying a new house in likely less then a year.

Yes, hard decision. No rush anyway as I am thinking spring for the purchase. I need more acoustic treatments and a second sub first anyway.

Yep, they are definitely at the top of the list thus far if Paradigm doesn't come through.

Thanks for all your help man and I appreciate you taking the time as it has helped me to consider more things and maybe to throw aside my anal ways lol.



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T

Tachead7075

Audioholic Intern
I haven't had an opportunity to listen to much from Paradigm, but have had a 5.0 Ultra setup for the last few years. I wouldn't have upgraded from them had I not heard better in the form of the Sierra 2 with the RAAL ribbon tweet. I would describe them as very clean, detailed and non fatiguing. In fact if anything they are just a touch of the laid back side. Capable of handling lots of power and maintain their composure very well at high spl.
Thanks for this info sir.

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T

Tachead7075

Audioholic Intern
But how will you access the port then?!
SVS might need to make a front port version with a rope ladder in conjunction with fleshlight for their more desperate and agile listeners.

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mazersteven

mazersteven

Audioholic Spartan
Reviews are all Opinions. Opinions are like Assholes. Everyone's got one.
More people have Favorites and have Blinders on to Other Options
 
ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Spartan
Reviews are all Opinions. Opinions are like Assholes. Everyone's got one.
More people have Favorites and have Blinders on to Other Options
True. Maintaining an open mind and objective view point is difficult for many [the few rotten million spoil it for the other 11!].
 
ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Spartan
@Tachead7075
To be clear, it is not my intention to convince you to do anything, rather to encourage you to see what others do and how they set up their systems. You will find people in both camps when it comes to mixing Surrounds and Atmos speakers, and again, all I can say is that to a large extent it comes down to your goals and usage. :)
As always, your system, your ears, your ducats... YMMV! :D

Cheers!
 
T

Tachead7075

Audioholic Intern
Reviews are all Opinions. Opinions are like Assholes. Everyone's got one.
More people have Favorites and have Blinders on to Other Options
Yes, it is sometimes hard to stray from the favorites and remove the blinders. I always try and remain objective though. At the same time, I sometimes find my way is best.

Seriously though, I wish more companies would allow in home trials as listening in your own environment really is the best test.

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T

Tachead7075

Audioholic Intern
@Tachead7075
To be clear, it is not my intention to convince you to do anything, rather to encourage you to see what others do and how they set up their systems. You will find people in both camps when it comes to mixing Surrounds and Atmos speakers, and again, all I can say is that to a large extent it comes down to your goals and usage. :)
As always, your system, your ears, your ducats... YMMV! :D

Cheers!
Yep, totally understand and it is much appreciated. That is why I come to forums a lot for help, reading, & learning. Sometimes I find an idea I have never read about or heard of before and it turns out to be great. It's really nice to have a community of people with shared interests to draw wisdom from and even just BS with as well.

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D

Danzilla31

Audioholic Ninja
Yep, totally understand and it is much appreciated. That is why I come to forums a lot for help, reading, & learning. Sometimes I find an idea I have never read about or heard of before and it turns out to be great. It's really nice to have a community of people with shared interests to draw wisdom from and even just BS with as well.

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I've owned the SVS prime towers and demoed the ultra bookshelves.

I've never heard the ultra towers. I have demoed the pinnacles.

The one thing I can say is they are all good measuring speakers not perfect but good very good at there respective price points

They also are good about doing most things good but nothing outstanding this is not intended as a put down rather as a compliment when I demoed them against other speakers in there price points or higher I noticed some speakers would just have serious strengths in ceartin areas midrange per say the strengths would stand out

The SVS would hold up well in all areas and compare well with even higher prices brands but they wouldn't stand out in ways some of the other brands can.

With any level of they're speakers whether it's prime or ultra what they are great at is soundstage imaging and except from what I've heard about the ultra towers there ability to be easy to place to achieve this the prime towers pinnacles and ultra bookshelves were all super placement easy and flexible with good sound even when sitting off axis

I didn't like there efficiency the prime towers are just not built for big rooms they don't like being pushed too hard.

Pinnacles were much better but the ultra's you can drive the crap out of them they can handle a lot of power with no distortion they will play clean very clean

They have a laid back character very smooth in midrange and highs a little pulled back in the high end which I like for the no sibilance issues but felt they just were a little too pulled back for my tastes I like a more forward sounding speaker.

Still in my home theater room I came close to getting them seven ultra towers would be pretty hard to top and I have the space in the theater to make it work. But I don't like ironically the fact the tweeter is slung in the middle. That's perfect for one row but problematic for the 2nd row in my room Id have to elevate them and I don't have the room for that until I build a platform for the front and go full acoustic transperant

Those are some of my experiences with the SVS speaker lines
 
T

Tachead7075

Audioholic Intern
I've owned the SVS prime towers and demoed the ultra bookshelves.

I've never heard the ultra towers. I have demoed the pinnacles.

The one thing I can say is they are all good measuring speakers not perfect but good very good at there respective price points

They also are good about doing most things good but nothing outstanding this is not intended as a put down rather as a compliment when I demoed them against other speakers in there price points or higher I noticed some speakers would just have serious strengths in ceartin areas midrange per say the strengths would stand out

The SVS would hold up well in all areas and compare well with even higher prices brands but they wouldn't stand out in ways some of the other brands can.

With any level of they're speakers whether it's prime or ultra what they are great at is soundstage imaging and except from what I've heard about the ultra towers there ability to be easy to place to achieve this the prime towers pinnacles and ultra bookshelves were all super placement easy and flexible with good sound even when sitting off axis

I didn't like there efficiency the prime towers are just not built for big rooms they don't like being pushed too hard.

Pinnacles were much better but the ultra's you can drive the crap out of them they can handle a lot of power with no distortion they will play clean very clean

They have a laid back character very smooth in midrange and highs a little pulled back in the high end which I like for the no sibilance issues but felt they just were a little too pulled back for my tastes I like a more forward sounding speaker.

Still in my home theater room I came close to getting them seven ultra towers would be pretty hard to top and I have the space in the theater to make it work. But I don't like ironically the fact the tweeter is slung in the middle. That's perfect for one row but problematic for the 2nd row in my room Id have to elevate them and I don't have the room for that until I build a platform for the front and go full acoustic transperant

Those are some of my experiences with the SVS speaker lines
Thank you sir, that was a very detailed response and quite helpful as I haven't heard any of SVS's offerings.

I considered going SVS for my whole setup(Prime Pinnacle Surround System with 2 x PB-2000 Pros). But, decided to go with Paradigm as they are made right in the same province as me, I have followed them for years, and I love their sound fof the most part(from what I have heard anyway). Although I haven't heard the Pinnacle's I do not regret my decision and my Premier system sounds amazing and I am not even done setup.

I also did not like the tweeter location on the SVS Towers although I only have one row so maybe they would have been ok. I know what you mean though as I have my Surrounds at 36"(shelf height) so that the tweets clear the peoples heads sitting next to me.

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mazersteven

mazersteven

Audioholic Spartan
To sum it up - SVS is IMO a safe bet. Good Quality, Good Customer Service (above a lot of others), and Good Sound Quality (Neutral to me)
 
D

D Murphy

Junior Audioholic
*blushes
Wait! No, we are supposed to focus on the topic! SVS, not S-E-X with SVS. :rolleyes: :p :p

Lets try this...

Based on everything I've seen, and the moderate amount of experiences I've had, most everything else in the pricepoint categories that the SVS Speakers live in share similar weaknesses in that every speaker will have some balance of strength against the trade off of possible poor (less-than-optimal) performance somewhere else.
Consider that the main complaint about the Ultra Towers is that placement is challenging. @Pogre says they may be a bit laid back...
This is the story with everything though.
The best part of familiarizing ourselves with even the BS reviews is that they do tend to call out the aspects that may be troubling, even if only in an oblique manner. A great example is the Stereophile B&W 700Series Tower review where the review is pretty glowing, but the measurements show a different picture with SA remarking that since his colleague didn't comment on an audible issue maybe it isn't a problem...
I don't think Martin Logan and Monitor Audio are without problems, I just found their issues to not be noticeable to me. Conversely, Def Tech, B&W, and even KEF all had issues that would have made me a very unhappy owner.
Just as another example, consider @KEW and his comparison threads about different speakers, different drivers, etc... It all points to the same thing: what works and why and how do we interpret it for individual taste. :)

At the end of the day, I think SVS has earned a valid reputation for quality gear and exceptional CS. If I were to give up on building speakers, I would easily consider their Prime Pinnacles and Ultra Standmounts for the GreatRoom.

Ok... now back to the S-E-X!
:oops:

:p :D :cool:
Well, the Ultras are in da house. I'll work with them this week and see whether a reworked crossover would improve things significantly. The drivers themselves certainly appear to be of solid quality.
 

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