Andrew Jones MoFi Concentric Speaker breaks 90dB Sensitivity Barrier!

[gene]

Alas Andrew Jones has finally done it? He designed a concentric loudspeaker that can play loud?!?

Andrew Jones and MoFi have launched the SourcePoint 10 loudspeakers ($3700/pair). The SourcePoint 10 is a large 2-way stand-mount speaker featuring a 10-inch concentric driver and 91dB sensitivity rating.

Editorial Note about Driver Sensitivity by Gene DellaSala
The other often overlooked advantage of employing a larger driver is increased sensitivity. We finally see a concentric driver speaker design from Andrew Jones with a sensitivity rating of 91dB. Most of the concentric Elac speakers Andrew Jones designed in the past have had a mid 80dB sensitivity rating limiting just how loudly they could play without entering thermal compression. Seeing a high sensitivity design like the SourcePoint 10 is a very welcomed attribute.

Read: New Andrew Jones MoFi SourcePoint 10 Concentric Loudspeakers

 

[MrBoat]

Funny to hear a design based on essentially what I have always experienced with larger paper mid-woofers and why I tend to choose them. The woofer sharing mid-range and bass wasn't 'that much' of an issue until tiny speakers with way too much excursion started becoming popular, and all of the cheated bass with trying to get designs that. . ."Sound much larger than they actually are" bs.

 

[everettT]

Funny to hear a design based on essentially what I have always experienced with larger paper mid-woofers and why I tend to choose them. The woofer sharing mid-range and bass wasn't 'that much' of an issue until tiny speakers with way too much excursion started becoming popular, and all of the cheated bass with trying to get designs that. . ."Sound much larger than they actually are" bs.

Here is the White Paper with Jones addressing that.

https://www.mofielectronics.com/s/SourcePoint-10-White-Paper-11-10-22.pdf

 

[MrBoat]

Here is the White Paper with Jones addressing that.

https://www.mofielectronics.com/s/SourcePoint-10-White-Paper-11-10-22.pdf

Diysoundgroup was working with larger concentric drivers that utilized a CD. I believe they were made by Eminence. I almost bought a pair just to play with.

ETA: I see PE carries a lot of different ones as well.

 

[ski2xblack]

Unlike the conical shape of some coax drivers such the Eminence, that woofer appears to be much more of a contoured waveguide. Has that resulted in a good directivity match, a typical challenge in large diameter woofer two ways?

So when will shady get them in for a full review? These look quite interesting.

 

[TLS Guy]

Alas Andrew Jones has finally done it? He designed a concentric loudspeaker that can play loud?!?

Andrew Jones and MoFi have launched the SourcePoint 10 loudspeakers ($3700/pair). The SourcePoint 10 is a large 2-way stand-mount speaker featuring a 10-inch concentric driver and 91dB sensitivity rating.


View attachment 59958
Read: New Andrew Jones MoFi SourcePoint 10 Concentric Loudspeakers

Sorry Gene, but the Tannoy dual concentric drivers broke that barrier at least 65 years ago! The sensitivity of the old Monitor Golds was 92 db. The current descendent has a sensitivity of 97 db. So no sonic sound barriers broken with that design. So those drivers would have to stack up with the current Tannoy drivers, which are excellent.

 

[-Jim-]

Time for a Contest Giveaway @gene ? Hint, Hint...

 

[gene]

Sorry Gene, but the Tannoy dual concentric drivers broke that barrier at least 65 years ago! The sensitivity of the old Monitor Golds was 92 db. The current descendent has a sensitivity of 97 db. So no sonic sound barriers broken with that design. So those drivers would have to stack up with the current Tannoy drivers, which are excellent.

Re-read the title. I said Andrew Jones concentric speakers. I don't believe he designed the high-efficient Tannoy designs?

 

[shadyJ]

Sorry Gene, but the Tannoy dual concentric drivers broke that barrier at least 65 years ago! The sensitivity of the old Monitor Golds was 92 db. The current descendent has a sensitivity of 97 db. So no sonic sound barriers broken with that design. So those drivers would have to stack up with the current Tannoy drivers, which are excellent.

The Tannoys are very different. They are sensitive, but they probably won't be nearly as neutral as these coaxial drivers, if these are anything like Andrew Jones' previous drivers. The Tannoys have always been measured to have a pretty rough response in comparison. The reason is that they are using a throat in the waveguide whereas the Andrew Jones coaxials all have had shallow waveguides, which don't load the tweeter as much and are therefore less sensitive but don't incur as much diffraction and so can yield a smoother response.

 

[shadyJ]

So when will shady get them in for a full review? These look quite interesting.

There haven't been any talks of having me review these so far, sorry.

 

[MrBoat]

I'm too old fashioned and crude to find $3800 worth of value in them, regardless. Maybe $2k if I really felt like splashing out, but I can still exceed the capabilities of the record quality available and fitting to me, for much less.

I am a fan of his approach with these, and hope he keeps at it with his designs, regardless.

 

[TLS Guy]

The Tannoys are very different. They are sensitive, but they probably won't be nearly as neutral as these coaxial drivers, if these are anything like Andrew Jones' previous drivers. The Tannoys have always been measured to have a pretty rough response in comparison. The reason is that they are using a throat in the waveguide whereas the Andrew Jones coaxials all have had shallow waveguides, which don't load the tweeter as much and are therefore less sensitive but don't incur as much diffraction and so can yield a smoother response.

I have not heard a Tannoy dual concentric for quite some time, but they do have a "presence" about them. They are a very potent speaker. The FR is not that pretty, but better than you might expect.

The above is from Audio Science review.

They certainly don't need a huge amp to power them! They have always been loud, very loud.

 

[TLS Guy]

Re-read the title. I said Andrew Jones concentric speakers. I don't believe he designed the high-efficient Tannoy designs?

Forgive me. I see what you meant now, but on first reading it was open to interpretation, and I thought you were implying that Andrew Jones had broken the 90 db. sensitivity barrier and not just for his design, but for anyone. I do think in the AV realm coaxial drivers have a lot to recommend them, especially center speakers. There are a couple of Italian companies that seem to be making some very good coaxial drivers.

 

[John Parks]

MoFi Electronics SourcePoint 10 loudspeaker | Stereophile.com

 

[TLS Guy]

MoFi Electronics SourcePoint 10 loudspeaker | Stereophile.com

It is too bad it has that slight rise in the top end. I would have thought that could be easily corrected by a small crossover change. Otherwise it looks excellent. I suspect that tip up at the top end would irritate me.

 

[D Murphy]

It is too bad it has that slight rise in the top end. I would have thought that could be easily corrected by a small crossover change. Otherwise it looks excellent. I suspect that tip up at the top end would irritate me.

I had a pair here for a demo. And, of course i measured them. My plots were identical to Stereophile's--not too pretty and bright on axis, but very smooth off-axis. I listened with no toe-in, so the first arrival information was off-axis. But what I heard conformed to the on-axis plot more than the off. The actual sensitivity is 90 dB according to Stereophile and my plot. Still pretty good.

 

[TLS Guy]

I had a pair here for a demo. And, of course i measured them. My plots were identical to Stereophile's--not too pretty and bright on axis, but very smooth off-axis. I listened with no toe-in, so the first arrival information was off-axis. But what I heard conformed to the on-axis plot more than the off. The actual sensitivity is 90 dB according to Stereophile and my plot. Still pretty good.

Actually that makes sense. I have found one of the issues when working with coaxial speakers is differences in the on axis and off axis response die to cone reflections from the tweeter output causing peaks and nulls. So yes, it is not surprising to me the off axis response would be best.

Paul Klipsch published a research paper on this years ago, I think in AES, where he investigated all this, and also the doppler distortion that arises in these reflection due to cone motion of the bass driver.

 

[D Murphy]

Actually that makes sense. I have found one of the issues when working with coaxial speakers is differences in the on axis and off axis response die to cone reflections from the tweeter output causing peaks and nulls. So yes, it is not surprising to me the off axis response would be best.

Paul Klipsch published a research paper on this years ago, I think in AES, where he investigated all this, and also the doppler distortion that arises in these reflection due to cone motion of the bass driver.

I was just a little surprised the brightness and mid-treble variation came through so clearly given that the direct sound and first reflections would have been smoother.

 

[Eppie]

Erin's Audio Corner just published some measurements on the Mofi SourcePoint 10. His comments echo those about the highs being lifted on axis but Erin also takes the time to explain why the speaker was designed that way and how to correct for it. Overall gets a good rating.

 

[gene]

Andrew Jones MoFi SourcePoint 8 Concentric Speaker, Compact Form Factor

Andrew Jones revealed the new MoFi Electronics SourcePoint 8 ($2,750/pair). It features an 8" concentric driver and a design nearly identical to the SourcePoint 10, but in a more compact package.

www.audioholics.com