slovell

slovell

Junior Audioholic
Did you ever try running the Marantz room correction and re-evaluate the corrected response?
Nope, returned it to Amazon for a refund. Good amp but not my cup of tea, I like my Adcoms better.
 
jinjuku

jinjuku

Moderator
I have to say then you failed to evaluate it properly. If you get the XPA or another amp it's imperative that you run the correction.
 
slovell

slovell

Junior Audioholic
I have to say then you failed to evaluate it properly. If you get the XPA or another amp it's imperative that you run the correction.
No disrespect intended but I could have evaluated it for months and I still wouldn't have bought three more of them to replace what I have. I don't use Audyssey for two channel stereo playback, I don't care for it's equalization, I do stereo in bypass with as little filtering as possible. I'm going to take my Adcoms in for service next week and keep them for a while longer.
 
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P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
No disrespect intended but I could have evaluated them for months and I still wouldn't have bought three more of them to replace what I have. I don't use Audyssey for two channel stereo playback, I don't care for it's equalization, I do stereo in bypass with as little filtering as possible. I'm going to take my Adcoms in for service next week and keep them for a while longer.
I used to feel the same about Audyssey though I always had it on for movies from day one. For music I thought pure direct was the way to go, until I became aware of the DEQ magic. Since then I started to give Audyssey, Audyssey flat and bypass a chance even for serious stereo music listening. I actually found in my room I can live with any of the three. In the end, we have to go with what sounds best to us, though I do believe Audyssey L/R bypass is best for those with a decent room and in bypass you still get the benefits of EQ's bass.
 
slovell

slovell

Junior Audioholic
:)
I used to feel the same about Audyssey though I always had it on for movies from day one. For music I thought pure direct was the way to go, until I became aware of the DEQ magic. Since then I started to give Audyssey, Audyssey flat and bypass a chance even for serious stereo music listening. I actually found in my room I can live with any of the three. In the end, we have to go with what sounds best to us, though I do believe Audyssey L/R bypass is best for those with a decent room and in bypass you still get the benefits of EQ's bass.
Whatever works best for you and your personal preferences, they just don't happen to be mine.
 
jinjuku

jinjuku

Moderator
No disrespect intended but I could have evaluated it for months and I still wouldn't have bought three more of them to replace what I have. I don't use Audyssey for two channel stereo playback, I don't care for it's equalization, I do stereo in bypass with as little filtering as possible. I'm going to take my Adcoms in for service next week and keep them for a while longer.
With that many channels it's safe to assume that you would be doing HT. By extension that would mean industry best practices dictate that the AVR room correction be ran.

You came here looking for help. Suggestions are being made, best practices recommended. I think it's all copacetic.

IMO you are doing yourself a disservice by purchasing gear that has any correction in it. Just wasted $$ if that isn't how you roll.
 
slovell

slovell

Junior Audioholic
With that many channels it's safe to assume that you would be doing HT. By extension that would mean industry best practices dictate that the AVR room correction be ran.

You came here looking for help. Suggestions are being made, best practices recommended. I think it's all copacetic.

IMO you are doing yourself a disservice by purchasing gear that has any correction in it. Just wasted $$ if that isn't how you roll.
Yes, I do home theater but it isn't my first priority. My first priority is music...analog music...in two channels...from my VPI Scout and Jolida tubed phono stage...which I don't want digitally corrected. I don't have the space for separate systems so I compromise. I've always had a problem with the word corrected, makes it seem like the artist didn't get his recording right. I don't care about industry best practices, I care about what sounds right to my ears. I took the appreciated suggestion for the Crown, tried it, decided against it because in my system with my speakers it was not a good fit. Is it so difficult to understand that I didn't jump up, yell "Yureka I've hit the affordable mother lode!" put my Adcoms on Audiogon, and immediately order three more of them? I would need three more if I kept my 5 channel 7000 and didn't want to try to blend the Crown's inherent sound with the Adcom. My Marantz, considering the way I choose to use it, serves me very well and is only wasted money in your opinion. In my opinion, in my system setup, my nearly 20 years old Adcom blew the Crown out of the rack in two channel. Sorry.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Whatever works best for you and your personal preferences, they just don't happen to be mine.
Dude, with due respect there is no argument about "whatever works best for you". I said basically the same in my post but I just wanted to share my own experience; and I know I am not the only one who changed my mind over time. If you are not interested in other's experience you are welcome to ignore them especially mine, but please don't assume I was trying to convince you as I definitively am not.
 
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jinjuku

jinjuku

Moderator
Yes, I do home theater but it isn't my first priority. My first priority is music...analog music...in two channels...from my VPI Scout and Jolida tubed phono stage...which I don't want digitally corrected. I don't have the space for separate systems so I compromise. I've always had a problem with the word corrected, makes it seem like the artist didn't get his recording right. I don't care about industry best practices, I care about what sounds right to my ears. I took the appreciated suggestion for the Crown, tried it, decided against it because in my system with my speakers it was not a good fit. Is it so difficult to understand that I didn't jump up, yell "Yureka I've hit the affordable mother lode!" put my Adcoms on Audiogon, and immediately order three more of them? I would need three more if I kept my 5 channel 7000 and didn't want to try to blend the Crown's inherent sound with the Adcom. My Marantz, considering the way I choose to use it, serves me very well and is only wasted money in your opinion. In my opinion, in my system setup, my nearly 20 years old Adcom blew the Crown out of the rack in two channel. Sorry.
You've come here to solicit advice. The Crown was just something to try, same as Emotiva, Outlaw, Marantz, others.... It's why I recommended Amazon since if you didn't like the Crown you could easily send it back.

The rest was based on information. Whether how much or how little was supplied. When multi-channel is mentioned then collectively we are going to go with what we know and that is multi channel.

Here's the main issue:

You may not know what you think you know. The reason I say that is you state that you have a problem with the word correction making it seem like the artist didn't get it 'right'.

Correction has to do with the room that sound is being reproduced in. The artist, mastering engineer, etc.... Have zero idea as to what room their material is going be played back in. Correction is intended to get the room as neutral as possible as a starting point. It's trying to level the playing field as no two rooms are quite alike.

Room correction, Gain staging if the amps have gain controls, etc... are all simply best practices. Sorry but I don't know any more competent way to go here.

It's how I have a $1900 setup that I ran A/B'd against a $22,000 setup. Ariel Acoustic L9's ($15,000) and Lexicon stack ($7,000) and the owner simply couldn't pick his jaw up off the floor for a few minutes.

What I'm trying to figure out as of your last post is that if you know so much already what are you doing here?
 
slovell

slovell

Junior Audioholic
Dude, with due respect there is no argument about "whatever works best for you". I said basically the same in my post but I just wanted to share my own experience; and I know I am not the only one who changed my mind over time. If you are not interested in other's experience you are welcome to ignore them especially mine, but please don't assume I was trying to convenience as I definitively am not.
Never thought that for a second. We're good.
 
slovell

slovell

Junior Audioholic
You've come here to solicit advice. The Crown was just something to try, same as Emotiva, Outlaw, Marantz, others.... It's why I recommended Amazon since if you didn't like the Crown you could easily send it back.

The rest was based on information. Whether how much or how little was supplied. When multi-channel is mentioned then collectively we are going to go with what we know and that is multi channel.

Here's the main issue:

You may not know what you think you know. The reason I say that is you state that you have a problem with the word correction making it seem like the artist didn't get it 'right'.

Correction has to do with the room that sound is being reproduced in. The artist, mastering engineer, etc.... Have zero idea as to what room their material is going be played back in. Correction is intended to get the room as neutral as possible as a starting point. It's trying to level the playing field as no two rooms are quite alike.

Room correction, Gain staging if the amps have gain controls, etc... are all simply best practices. Sorry but I don't know any more competent way to go here.

It's how I have a $1900 setup that I ran A/B'd against a $22,000 setup. Ariel Acoustic L9's ($15,000) and Lexicon stack ($7,000) and the owner simply couldn't pick his jaw up off the floor for a few minutes.

What I'm trying to figure out as of your last post is that if you know so much already what are you doing here?
One can never know enough and I'm enjoying our debate. If I'm coming across as arrogant, and I probably am, I do humbly apologize. In the end, there are no losers. Don't you think?
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Never thought that for a second. We're good.
That's great! I just noticed a major typo in my last sentence. Seem like you know what I meant to say but I corrected it now regardless.
 
jinjuku

jinjuku

Moderator
One can never know enough and I'm enjoying our debate. If I'm coming across as arrogant, and I probably am, I do humbly apologize. In the end, there are no losers. Don't you think?
I want you and anyone else to enjoy their setup. The advise that I'm going to give is going to be based on best practice/s.

It's simply the way I approach this and it comes from 7 years installing A/V and DAW suites.

When you mentioned the 'mis-match' with other channels the first thing that popped into Peng's and my mind is that the Marantz's trim levels weren't unitized across all outputs.

We just wanted you to utilize the function in the Marantz, a unit you most likely paid a good chunk of change for, to do the job it's designed to do.

Barring that you would want to pick up a measurement mic and set the levels in the Marantz and manually re-key in your seating distance at a minimum. I would urge you to do it with the refurbished Adcoms also.
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
I don't think I've even mentioned the word "Audyssey" or "DEQ" in this thread yet. :D

So I guess I can do it now.

Even if I were a billionaire, I would not buy anything without Audyssey XT32 Dynamic EQ (DEQ). I use Audyssey Bypass L/R + DEQ for EVERYTHING. It is my preference. I've tried Dolby Volume Leveler (which is supposed to be equivalent to DEQ), but the bass didn't sound as punchy and dynamic to me as Audyssey DEQ.

Maybe if DTS were to come out with their version of DTS-DEQ (or something like that), I may love it because I usually prefer anything-DTS over anything-Dolby. :D
 
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djreef

djreef

Audioholic Chief
I have Audyssey with the Onkyo in the living room. I have no idea how it works (big surprise there, huh?). I looked at the setup protocols in the manual and my eyes glazed over. I just tuned the system by ear.

DJ
 
slovell

slovell

Junior Audioholic
I have Audyssey with the Onkyo in the living room. I have no idea how it works (big surprise there, huh?). I looked at the setup protocols in the manual and my eyes glazed over. I just tuned the system by ear.

DJ
I feel the same. I understand how it works and all that, but set up your tripod here, then there, then move it again. If you don't like it do it all over again. Life's too short. I've got sound flying over my head, from the sides, my sub's trying to shake the room apart and that's by ear, well , I do use a decibel meter and test tones. I'm good with that.
 
slovell

slovell

Junior Audioholic
:)
I don't think I've even mentioned the word "Audyssey" or "DEQ" in this thread yet. :D

So I guess I can do it now.

Even if I were a billionaire, I would not buy anything without Audyssey XT32 Dynamic EQ (DEQ). I use Audyssey Bypass L/R + DEQ for EVERYTHING. It is my preference. I've tried Dolby Volume Leveler (which is supposed to be equivalent to DEQ), but the bass didn't sound as punchy and dynamic to me as Audyssey DEQ.

Maybe if DTS were to come out with their version of DTS-DEQ (or something like that), I may love it because I usually prefer anything-DTS over anything-Dolby. :D
If I were a billionaire I'd have a crew doing it all for me.
 

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