A Salk fan-boy takes action

H

herbu

Audioholic Samurai
It makes no sense for poor Jim to measure every component as it comes in when 99.99% will be within a satisfactory tolerance.
I understand and can accept that. In my old job we did millions a year, so prevention was important. And your point about parameters in addition to impedance is also good. Building a process to test/verify everything before assembly could be a slippery slope.

I say the proof is in the pudding... and trust the experts. Both of these platitudes confirm Jim is top shelf and in control of his operation. I shouldn't have presumed to know more about his business than he does, (which is the case when one makes suggestions).

BTW, Richard, your speakers are gorgeous!!!
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
We can try and hear differences between the new Veracity ST and my highly-valued, rare, VINTAGE dome STs,.
From my experience, the difference will be there for a simple triangle, but you really appreciate the difference when you hear chimes being played - the fullness and clarity of the upper harmonics is compelling!
I listen to Ed Palermo Big Band for this, but he is a little difficult to find and knowing Dennis has a penchant for classical, he might know of better content to hear this (if you don't already have something in mind).
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Spartan
From my experience, the difference will be there for a simple triangle, but you really appreciate the difference when you hear chimes being played - the fullness and clarity of the upper harmonics is compelling!
I listen to Ed Palermo Big Band for this, but he is a little difficult to find and knowing Dennis has a penchant for classical, he might know of better content to hear this (if you don't already have something in mind).
Dennis has always said he listens to brass and French horns in particular to reveal the lower treble range. I have just the thing.

Dennis also wants to see & hear them. Once I have the speakers, I'll invite him to come over, ask him to bring some suitable demo music, and offer him dinner. I hope he has the time. Ever since he retired and went into the speaker business, he's been much busier than before :eek:.
 
D

Dennis Murphy

Audioholic General
I understand and can accept that. In my old job we did millions a year, so prevention was important. And your point about parameters in addition to impedance is also good. Building a process to test/verify everything before assembly could be a slippery slope.

I say the proof is in the pudding... and trust the experts. Both of these platitudes confirm Jim is top shelf and in control of his operation. I shouldn't have presumed to know more about his business than he does, (which is the case when one makes suggestions).

BTW, Richard, your speakers are gorgeous!!!
Right--what makes sense in mass production doesn't always carry over to small operations like Jim's, and vanishingly small operations like mine. Cheers
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Spartan
Right--what makes sense in mass production doesn't always carry over to small operations like Jim's, and vanishingly small operations like mine. Cheers
To keep to your one-man-operation business plan, you would have to put your soldering iron down, get a lab coat, hard hat, & clip board, and become Dennis the Irritating QA Inspector.
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Dennis has always said he listens to brass and French horns in particular to reveal the lower treble range. I have just the thing.
I think the difference is not so much in the lower treble range as in the upper treble range. According to the IRN Musical Audio Frequency Spectrum chart, the uppermost harmonics of the French Horn do not make it to 6kHz! The trumpet makes it to 9kHz (again, uppermost harmonics).
http://www.independentrecording.net/irn/resources/freqchart/main_display.htm

I'm certain that the harmonics from chimes go well beyond 20kHz (my own hearing falls off before 15kHz). The fundamental notes are not that high, but the fullness of the sound involves those overtones. More importantly, many tweeters make the sound offensive because they are unable to cleanly reproduce those pitches.
 
D

Dennis Murphy

Audioholic General
I think the difference is not so much in the lower treble range as in the upper treble range. According to the IRN Musical Audio Frequency Spectrum chart, the uppermost harmonics of the French Horn do not make it to 6kHz! The trumpet makes it to 9kHz (again, uppermost harmonics).
http://www.independentrecording.net/irn/resources/freqchart/main_display.htm

I'm certain that the harmonics from chimes go well beyond 20kHz (my own hearing falls off before 15kHz). The fundamental notes are not that high, but the fullness of the sound involves those overtones. More importantly, many tweeters make the sound offensive because they are unable to cleanly reproduce those pitches.
I'm sure that's true, but my (old) advice was aimed at judging the crossover execution, not distinguishing between a dome and a ribbon. For that, I agree that triangles and the like are the best source material.
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Spartan
I'll have to look to see what music I have with triangles. Would that be alto or soprano triangles? Would cow bell substitute?

When all else fails, I wonder if cymbals would do.
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
I'll have to look to see what music I have with triangles. Would that be alto or soprano triangles? Would cow bell substitute?

When all else fails, I wonder if cymbals would do.
That was the point of my earlier post.
Triangles and cymbals will work, but symphonic/concert chimes (AKA tubular bells) is where you really appreciate how much content was lost.
Triangles and cymbals will differentiate between soft domes and ribbons IME, but it takes chimes to evaluate between Ribbon tweeters, IME. Using Chimes for comparing soft dome to RAAL will make you feel good about the coin you dropped on those pretty boxes!
Triangle will sound muted on soft domes and mostly louder on RAALs. (Well recorded) Chime will sound gloriously clean and resonant on the RAAL and comparatively like a toy piano on the soft dome (IME)!
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Spartan
That was the point of my earlier post.
Triangles and cymbals will work, but symphonic/concert chimes (AKA tubular bells) is where you really appreciate how much content was lost. Triangles and cymbals will differentiate between soft domes and ribbons IME, but it takes chimes to evaluate between Ribbon tweeters, IME. Using Chimes for comparing soft dome to RAAL will make you feel good about the coin you dropped on those pretty boxes! Triangle will sound muted on soft domes and mostly louder on RAALs. (Well recorded) Chime will sound gloriously clean and resonant on the RAAL and comparatively like a toy piano on the soft dome (IME)!
Thanks Kurt, that insight about the chimes is interesting.

The photos of the new pretty boxes have not gotten old yet. It will be interesting to get side-by-side photos of the 2007 SongTowers and the 2106 Veracity ST, with one camera and identical lighting.
 
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D

desertrider

Audioholic Intern
Thanks Kurt, that insight about the chimes is interesting.

The photos of the new pretty boxes have not gotten old yet. It will be interesting to get side-by-side photos of the 2007 SongTowers and the 2106 Veracity ST, with one camera and identical lighting.
You have to position them PERFECTLY like Jim does with all his speaker pics ;)
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Spartan
In an effort to spare no details :p, my new speakers have moved on from the manufacturing phase to the shipping phase.

FedEx reports they were picked up from Salk (Pontiac, MI) on Thursday afternoon, departed Perrysburg, OH Friday morning, and arrived in Hagerstown, MD by 5 pm.

Delivery may be as early as the end of Monday :D.
 
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D

desertrider

Audioholic Intern
In an effort to spare no details :p, my new speakers have moved on from the manufacturing phase to the shipping phase.

FedEx reports they were picked up from Salk (Pontiac, MI) on Thursday afternoon, departed Perrysburg, OH Friday morning, and arrived in Hagerstown, MD by 5 pm.

Delivery may be as early as the end of Monday :D.
Guess youre calling in sick Monday? LOL I will be when mine come ;)
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Spartan
Guess youre calling in sick Monday? LOL I will be when mine come ;)
The thought has crossed my mind. I actually have a doctor's appointment earlier on Monday. It just might take so long that it wouldn't be worth going back to work that day :cool:.

There are two boxes, each weighs 89 lbs :eek:! I couldn't let my wife sign for those alone :rolleyes:.

This morning, Saturday, FedEx says the speakers have arrived at their local DC area warehouse in Beltsville, Md. They're on trucks for delivery the next business day, Monday!
 
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