Audioholics
Guest
I Love When People Plagiarize The Whole Article....
"Let our rigorous testing and reviews be your guidelines to A/V equipment – not marketing slogans"
mtrycrafts
Seriously, I have no life.
One only has to go back in time and try to remember the history of VHS and DVD. They were expensive components for a time and of course were not selling well. As volume production increased, prices fell and more bought bringing the prices further.
I see the same with hi def. Money talks for a lot of folks. The A2 prices at around $200, stocks are depleted.
Exactly. But, thanks to the FCC, it is forced on us and soon, we all have to convert to at least the 720p TVs which are already disappearing in favor fro the 1080p models. So, these Tvs will drag the hi def DVDs with it, I bet.
Especially when the price is low.That is the only way forward. Stagnation is not in the marketplace. after all, DVD did replace VCRs.
F
fresno1232001
Enthusiast
And shoot movies on hard drives!
This is an addendum to my long rant up above. I don't know how I left this out: I say above to ditch the old tapes from the 70s in making DVD-A audio disks or new audio-only disks using the Dolby True HD or DTS Master Audio formats. (Dolby True HD is really the DVD-A standard, using Meridian Lossless Packing, only in 7.1 channels instead of DVD-A's 5.1 channels). Record everything live using hard drives, no tape for audio. BUT what I should also have said is that to fully exploit the potential of HD DVD, they should stop just putting movies shot on film on such disks and instead shoot new movies using HI DEF cameras recording the video directly onto hard drives too. Edit from hard drives and then put the final product on HD DVDs to sell. Now you really would give consumers a reason to buy HD players! Audio on the movie disks (and audio-only disks) recorded and edited on hard drives with no tape involved at all, and video recorded and edited on hard drives with no film involved for the movies. Now THAT would be a spectacular product. I saw at BB a $7,000 Pioneer Plasma displaying such content. It was a bicycle race, in England, I believe, and it was spectacular. You could count the bricks in a wall in a village a mile away. Why take 70 mm film, or even old 35 mm film (or even 16 mm film such as "Victory At Sea") and put it on HD disks, when you could fully exploit HD disk and player technology as I am suggesting here? Sure, more work for the studios and music houses to record and shoot all the new stuff using no tape or film, but sometimes you have to earn money to get it. And they'd get LOTS of money if they do what I've suggested here. I know that the millions of film buffs, and students of film, will be outraged since film does give a cool, altered version of reality, but I say keep doing film with some productions and also do what I'm suggesting here with other productions, depending on the effect desired and which is the more suitable medium.
This is an addendum to my long rant up above. I don't know how I left this out: I say above to ditch the old tapes from the 70s in making DVD-A audio disks or new audio-only disks using the Dolby True HD or DTS Master Audio formats. (Dolby True HD is really the DVD-A standard, using Meridian Lossless Packing, only in 7.1 channels instead of DVD-A's 5.1 channels). Record everything live using hard drives, no tape for audio. BUT what I should also have said is that to fully exploit the potential of HD DVD, they should stop just putting movies shot on film on such disks and instead shoot new movies using HI DEF cameras recording the video directly onto hard drives too. Edit from hard drives and then put the final product on HD DVDs to sell. Now you really would give consumers a reason to buy HD players! Audio on the movie disks (and audio-only disks) recorded and edited on hard drives with no tape involved at all, and video recorded and edited on hard drives with no film involved for the movies. Now THAT would be a spectacular product. I saw at BB a $7,000 Pioneer Plasma displaying such content. It was a bicycle race, in England, I believe, and it was spectacular. You could count the bricks in a wall in a village a mile away. Why take 70 mm film, or even old 35 mm film (or even 16 mm film such as "Victory At Sea") and put it on HD disks, when you could fully exploit HD disk and player technology as I am suggesting here? Sure, more work for the studios and music houses to record and shoot all the new stuff using no tape or film, but sometimes you have to earn money to get it. And they'd get LOTS of money if they do what I've suggested here. I know that the millions of film buffs, and students of film, will be outraged since film does give a cool, altered version of reality, but I say keep doing film with some productions and also do what I'm suggesting here with other productions, depending on the effect desired and which is the more suitable medium.
T
Tex-amp
Senior Audioholic
I think one of the best point made, so far, is high def disc sales are dependent on HDTV sales/penetration first. DVD players worked with SD sets. CD players worked fine with existing stereo equipment. You need a HD display for the HD media. So, the cost is more than just the high def player. For most people the cost of moving to hi def disc players includes buying a HDTV.
AjaxComp
Audiophyte
we disagree.
hello........how are all of you?.........yes, yes we disagree and of course we can only convey our personal experience with this new (to consumers) technology...........we have been making a bundle in SD to HD conversions ever since the first reasonably priced player and media appeared.......in actuality, to us, the format war means nothing.........they are both great & we know quite a few customers who have both........ but i think things will take an interesting turn when the new Toshiba HD player/recorder is available........ format wise.
However, since the advent of the microsoft HDDVD (xbox360) & the discovery that it can be used with any strong dual core computer; and the progressive lowering of HD DVD standalones (and the rather stubborn & whiny reduction in prices of bluray by sony as well)...............we have had to hire more people and we are rather fussy about who will work for us...........THAT has been a pain in the keester.............i'm sure its because i'm an old man and please don't hold it against me, that's just the way things are..............anyway, you have to remember that we are just one tiny company..........this is a big, big country and others must be having similiar experiences as well..........it's not possible that we are the only ones benefiting from all this ( is benefiting spelled correctly?)...............so the key element to transition here, as far as we can see, is cost & pricing (this IS the United States after all)..................we have been careful not to over-charge for our end & we (I) compel my boys to do the very best they are capable of, in order to ride the wave, as it were...................we don't think this is a passing fancy and as prices have dropped we have been servicing many more regular (not wealthy) clients.
so there; that is what we have seen in our personal life experience................wait for it........we think HD will eventually rule the planet...........it is even available in sub-saharan africa.........amazing!
hello........how are all of you?.........yes, yes we disagree and of course we can only convey our personal experience with this new (to consumers) technology...........we have been making a bundle in SD to HD conversions ever since the first reasonably priced player and media appeared.......in actuality, to us, the format war means nothing.........they are both great & we know quite a few customers who have both........ but i think things will take an interesting turn when the new Toshiba HD player/recorder is available........ format wise.
However, since the advent of the microsoft HDDVD (xbox360) & the discovery that it can be used with any strong dual core computer; and the progressive lowering of HD DVD standalones (and the rather stubborn & whiny reduction in prices of bluray by sony as well)...............we have had to hire more people and we are rather fussy about who will work for us...........THAT has been a pain in the keester.............i'm sure its because i'm an old man and please don't hold it against me, that's just the way things are..............anyway, you have to remember that we are just one tiny company..........this is a big, big country and others must be having similiar experiences as well..........it's not possible that we are the only ones benefiting from all this ( is benefiting spelled correctly?)...............so the key element to transition here, as far as we can see, is cost & pricing (this IS the United States after all)..................we have been careful not to over-charge for our end & we (I) compel my boys to do the very best they are capable of, in order to ride the wave, as it were...................we don't think this is a passing fancy and as prices have dropped we have been servicing many more regular (not wealthy) clients.
so there; that is what we have seen in our personal life experience................wait for it........we think HD will eventually rule the planet...........it is even available in sub-saharan africa.........amazing!
B
billnchristy
Senior Audioholic
I think one of the biggest "problems" is the fact that there is too little HD programming on tv.
If every channel you had on cable or satellite was HD and you went and popped in an SD-DVD it would look like crap and you would want a newer player.
Until you stop hearing..."Oh it doesnt look so bad" about SD-TV you wont be hearing how good HD format discs are.
Oh and for "Fake" media taking over physical discs, not gonna happen with me, I dont even rent movies, I prefer to have a physical real copy in my hands, the only media I stream off my PC are adult flicks and music.
If every channel you had on cable or satellite was HD and you went and popped in an SD-DVD it would look like crap and you would want a newer player.
Until you stop hearing..."Oh it doesnt look so bad" about SD-TV you wont be hearing how good HD format discs are.
Oh and for "Fake" media taking over physical discs, not gonna happen with me, I dont even rent movies, I prefer to have a physical real copy in my hands, the only media I stream off my PC are adult flicks and music.
Buckeyefan 1
Audioholic Ninja
I was watching the US Open today in HD, then went to my cousin's graduation party. Her father (my uncle) is a wealthy dentist. He just put in a boatload of money in his kitchen and family room. He even purchased a 40" Sony LCD for his dental office so his patients can watch while getting a root canal. I told him to get a set with a built in tuner so he could get free programming. It's a neat setup.
Anyhow, he still has a 32" (might I say high end) JVC SD tube set in his remodeled family room. He's stuck with it because his expensive oak entertainment unit (only a few years old) can only fit a 32" 4:3 tv and he refuses to get rid of the entertainment center. His brother has the same issue. The opening in his expensive entertainment center only fits the larger 4:3 sets. I tried to tell both of them they could do drop down screens and projectors, but mounting a projector was out of the question. A 32" LCD would work, but the they both said the height of the LCD and overall pic is a lot smaller. They are correct. Both realize the clarity of HD. It's just a sad situation for those who have high end entertainment centers built around 4:3 sets.
By the way, the US Open was horribly in SD compared to in HD.
I will give him some credit for the music being piped outside for the party. He had two Klipsch PC speakers with a ton of music. It actually didn't sound too bad for a patio. I couldn't figure out how he got a line from his pc to the back yard (would have been 50' +). Then I saw the MP3 player. It was so simple. Technology - it works with MP3, but with HD, it's a pain in the asss. All the money in the world, and he opts for opposite of lossless music, but refuses to go HD because of furniture issues.
I will say when I got my entertainment center, I wanted something flexible. I had a 36" CRT Toshiba that weighed 200lbs. I am able to get a 40" LCD in there, but nothing larger unless I take out the stand. The top slides for floor type sets. Furniture really limits you in this hobby.
I told him to get a set with a built in tuner so he could get free programming. It's a neat setup. Anyhow, he still has a 32" (might I say high end) JVC SD tube set in his remodeled family room. He's stuck with it because his expensive oak entertainment unit (only a few years old) can only fit a 32" 4:3 tv and he refuses to get rid of the entertainment center. His brother has the same issue. The opening in his expensive entertainment center only fits the larger 4:3 sets. I tried to tell both of them they could do drop down screens and projectors, but mounting a projector was out of the question. A 32" LCD would work, but the they both said the height of the LCD and overall pic is a lot smaller. They are correct. Both realize the clarity of HD. It's just a sad situation for those who have high end entertainment centers built around 4:3 sets.
By the way, the US Open was horribly in SD compared to in HD.
I will give him some credit for the music being piped outside for the party. He had two Klipsch PC speakers with a ton of music. It actually didn't sound too bad for a patio. I couldn't figure out how he got a line from his pc to the back yard (would have been 50' +). Then I saw the MP3 player. It was so simple. Technology - it works with MP3, but with HD, it's a pain in the asss. All the money in the world, and he opts for opposite of lossless music, but refuses to go HD because of furniture issues.
I will say when I got my entertainment center, I wanted something flexible. I had a 36" CRT Toshiba that weighed 200lbs. I am able to get a 40" LCD in there, but nothing larger unless I take out the stand. The top slides for floor type sets. Furniture really limits you in this hobby.
A
awesomebase
Audioholic
Yes, you did mention it as the 10th reason in your latest article (albeit with a question mark -- an indication that it may or may not have the impact you thought it would), so my bad on that! I guess I was looking at it with more emphasis and possibly the real reason the formats aren't taking hold.
BTW, no worries on getting PS3 owners peeved -- while Sony was more concerned with higher video resolution, more processing power, and getting their own media/format firmly entrenched in the marketplace, Nintendo was more concerned with making a better and more fun gaming experience. I don't own any of the consoles (though my friends seem to get all of them).
Let them complain about your reasons for the PS3 Blu-Ray push -- the market so far has largely backed up the notion that high def movies are slow to catch on...
pikers
Audioholic
I seriously, honestly, can't wait until SD goes black. One, the looks on the faces of those that said it would never happen, and two, HD towers at 100% finally.
D
digital_dilemma
Audiophyte
The problem is manifested across the vast majority of our society. When the VCR came out what was the two biggest complaints? 1. The damn clock keeps flashing (people didn't or wouldn't take the time to learn how to use it) and 2. the damn red, white and yellow connection thingy-bobs were confusing. Worse, along came s-video and more confusion. All EVERYBODY wanted was the"good old days" when you connected your antenna or cable to the RF connector.
My parents are a great example of what the problem is. They purchased an HD television on my recommendation. DirectTV came out and set up satellite and voila! HD right? Wrong!! But they believe they have HD and well, "if this is as good as it looks, what's all the hub-bub, Bub?" I schedule a visit and sure enough, the HD from the technician is an S-Video cable. The STB isn't even set to output greater than 480i and certainly not in widescreen. I fix that with an HDMI cable and provide the setup.
Next, I get them an HD-DVD. They don't understand why I have to get them a special cable when they've got a drawer full of those damn red, white and yellow video cables in the drawer!! I have to go into full explanation mode.
Next, they get a sound system I recommend and once again, there's those pesky different digital connections. Again, "what do you need a special cable for when I have a drawer full of those damn red, white and yellow cables?"
Now, finally, they're all set up. But wait, there's a remote for the TV, the STB, the HD-DVD, the VCR (still has to have tapes!!) and the receiver. They can't use anything (they're so confused and exasperated!) , so I get them a Logitech remote and program it for them. They're happy they have such a technically adept son. However, I come to visit them and they're watching the low def analog channels. Why? The OTA antenna from DirectTV was never installed, so another call to those guys for scheduling this. Finally, it gets put in place and now they have the local HD channels, right? Well, no. The program guide information shows up for the locals only on the analog feeds, so when they scan through the guide, they see what they want and press okay. So now they are watching the analog feed totally unaware that the same programming is a click up or down in HD.
Sigh!!!
So, what we have are connectivity and ease of use issues that are an impediment. Components should all talk to each other, have a handshake and an agreement about what is the best settings for the attached equipment and then everything adjusts itself accordingly. Total ease of use. Dummy-proof. That's not going to happen, though, and moms and dads, grandmothers and grandfathers all across the country are blithley going through this world in complete ignorance of everything that needs to be done to get great sound and a great picture and for all that, they just really don't give a hoot, and THAT, my friends, is what is going to keep HD as an enthusiast level product. At least until HD is force fed upon all of us and connectivity and simplicity are synonymous.
My parents are a great example of what the problem is. They purchased an HD television on my recommendation. DirectTV came out and set up satellite and voila! HD right? Wrong!! But they believe they have HD and well, "if this is as good as it looks, what's all the hub-bub, Bub?" I schedule a visit and sure enough, the HD from the technician is an S-Video cable. The STB isn't even set to output greater than 480i and certainly not in widescreen. I fix that with an HDMI cable and provide the setup.
Next, I get them an HD-DVD. They don't understand why I have to get them a special cable when they've got a drawer full of those damn red, white and yellow video cables in the drawer!! I have to go into full explanation mode.
Next, they get a sound system I recommend and once again, there's those pesky different digital connections. Again, "what do you need a special cable for when I have a drawer full of those damn red, white and yellow cables?"
Now, finally, they're all set up. But wait, there's a remote for the TV, the STB, the HD-DVD, the VCR (still has to have tapes!!) and the receiver. They can't use anything (they're so confused and exasperated!) , so I get them a Logitech remote and program it for them. They're happy they have such a technically adept son. However, I come to visit them and they're watching the low def analog channels. Why? The OTA antenna from DirectTV was never installed, so another call to those guys for scheduling this. Finally, it gets put in place and now they have the local HD channels, right? Well, no. The program guide information shows up for the locals only on the analog feeds, so when they scan through the guide, they see what they want and press okay. So now they are watching the analog feed totally unaware that the same programming is a click up or down in HD.
Sigh!!!
So, what we have are connectivity and ease of use issues that are an impediment. Components should all talk to each other, have a handshake and an agreement about what is the best settings for the attached equipment and then everything adjusts itself accordingly. Total ease of use. Dummy-proof. That's not going to happen, though, and moms and dads, grandmothers and grandfathers all across the country are blithley going through this world in complete ignorance of everything that needs to be done to get great sound and a great picture and for all that, they just really don't give a hoot, and THAT, my friends, is what is going to keep HD as an enthusiast level product. At least until HD is force fed upon all of us and connectivity and simplicity are synonymous.
Sitemap
Site Information
Site Information
HTML
