Crap....

[tmurnin]

Since my trusty Jamo DSUB6 apparently has died, it's time for a new sub. Room is 23 X 18 X 9 (3 walls enclosure, open to the kitchen/stairway on the 4th, wall-to-wall carpet but probably moving to hardwoods + area rug next year), and I'd like to stay under $1k. Two subs not an option in this room due to WAF. Sub will be placed on the front wall to the left of the tv and front speakers. Fronts are Totem Rainmaker bookshelves. I'm considering the following options:

HSU VTF-2, 3 or 15H. I have a VTF2 in my basement and am very happy, but this room is a lot different than that one.

SVS PB-12NSD. I'm also open to the cylinder model, but I don't know much about that design.

Rhythmik LV12/F-12 (not very familiar with Rhythmik but have heard good things)

PSA XV-15 (another company I'm not that familiar with but have heard good things)

Doubt it matters, but AVR is Anthem MRX-700

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Stick with HSU, Rythmik, SVS, PSA, Outlaw for under $1K.

You are in the right direction.

 

[Ponzio]

I own a SVS PB-12NSD to go along with my Focal 1027Be's in a 20'x20' room and couldn't be happier; fantastic for HT and even better for music.

 

[tmurnin]

AcuDef - thanks - any suggestions on the specific models?

 

[shadyJ]

One nice looking $1k sub is the Dayton dual woofer kit. It needs a little bit of assembly and its pretty heavy, but the design suggests a high level of sound quality. Two heavy duty drivers made for low distortion in an inert, sealed cabinet with plenty of power should give you a very clean and tight sound with zero overhang. It doesn't have much in the way of bass below 25 Hz but its sound quality may be the best at its price, and the output ought to be pretty good too. The sub with the most output will be the VTF15h. If you need all out loudness with decent extension, that is the one to get. I think the VTF3 could possibly be a bit better with respect to sound quality given its more substantial looking driver.

 

[tmurnin]

Appreciate the suggestion on the Dayton, but no time for me to build a box and I'm not that ambitious to do it. I don't need to just thump the bass - more concerned with sound quality than sound volume, but didn't want a smaller sub to just get lost in that room, either. I'll take another look at the VTF-3 vs 15

 

[j_garcia]

Any of those would be great choices. PSA, SVS and HSU might be my top picks there. Rythmik typically has some good selections in their lineup in that price range however they are in the middle of updates to what seems to be a big chunk of the middle of their lineup.

PSA is run by a former founder of SVS, so I have no doubt you won't be disappointed there if there are any concerns about their lineage.

Outlaw offers the Outlaw Audio LFM-1 EX Powered Subwoofer which is a HSU design and has gotten really good AH reviews. It is typically on sale around Black Friday.

 

[macddmac]

The VTF-15H is the perfect size for a sofa side table as well

 

[shadyJ]

Appreciate the suggestion on the Dayton, but no time for me to build a box and I'm not that ambitious to do it. I don't need to just thump the bass - more concerned with sound quality than sound volume, but didn't want a smaller sub to just get lost in that room, either. I'll take another look at the VTF-3 vs 15

Lol that's the thing, the cabinet is already built for you. All you have to do is glue in the damping and screw in the driver and amp. It is not a big project and can't really be considered DIY. It's an unassembled version of this sub. Assembly would take no longer than an hour and you save $150. And it is about sound quality first. You get drivers built expressly for lower distortion, and by going with two drivers you get half the distortion of a single driver for the same listening level. With a very heavy cabinet in a dual opposed configuration you will have absolutely no contribution of noise from the enclosure. From what I can see, the Dayton dual driver kit will have the highest sound quality. For the loudest sub, I am sure that would be the VTF15h.

 

[tmurnin]

Also had someone recommend Paradigm's DSP series, but that seems pretty small for this size room. Anyone have any experience with that? As of now, I'm leaning towards the VTF-3....

 

[j_garcia]

I've heard the VTF-3 MkIII a few times, not the IV, but I think it is a very nice sub and should have no problem handling that space.

 

[tmurnin]

Any concern with the lack of full phase control on the Hsu? I can really only put it in one place in the room

 

[j_garcia]

If that place is on the same side of the room as the mains, it should not be a problem. More often than not 0/180 is sufficient unless you have major room mode issues.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

AcuDef - thanks - any suggestions on the specific models?

CEA Standard (THD <10%, 2 Meters) SPL @ 20/32/40/50/63 Hz:

$769 SVS PB12-NSD: 103.2/105.9/106.5/107.3/108.0
$4000 Velodyne DD15+: 97.0/102.0/109.0/109.0/112.0
$900 Aperion Bravus II 12D: 87.0/105.3/109.8/112.6/112.2
$879 Velodyne EQ-MAX15: 84.8/104.2/110.0/114.2/114.8
$1,200 RBH SX-12: 87.7/108.0/111.1/113.7/112.7
$740 Outlaw LFM-1EX: 101.0/110.7/112.3/113.7/113.8
$800 Power Sound XV15: 102.7/109.6/113.7/116.6/114.7
$2200 JL Audio F112: 92.8/112.4/116.2/113.3/117.6
$1400 SVS PB12+: 107.0/111.5/114.3/115.3/115.3
$9,000 Paradigm Sig Sub2: 106.4/109.9/113.2/116.9/120.2
$1022 Hsu VTF-15H: 103.9/113.0/115.7/115.7/115.6
$5,000 Velodyne DD18+: 103.4/113.0/115.8/116.8/115.3
$2,000 SVS PB13 Ultra: 110.6/115.5/117.5/117.8/116.6
$1,400 Rythmik FV15HP: 108.1/117.0/119.5/119.1/118.8

So for $740, the Outlaw LFM-1EX can output 110+ dB from 30Hz on up.

It would be interesting to see how the $589 Rythmik LV12 performs, though. Who knows? It might perform as well but cost significantly less. We'll have to wait for the CEA measurements.

 

[tmurnin]

Pulled the trigger on a VTF-3 tonight. Decided it was the best performer for the price. Really liked the SVS PB12-Plus (called SVS and they said the PB12-NSD would be too small for the room), but it was almost double the cost of the HSU and doubt I'll notice that level of difference.

 

[shadyJ]

I don't know about other room correction EQs, but Audyssey takes care of phase, so it might not matter what you set it to. I wouldn't worry about it. The VTF3 is a great sub, you'll enjoy it.

 

[3db]

CEA Standard (THD <10%, 2 Meters) SPL @ 20/32/40/50/63 Hz:

$769 SVS PB12-NSD: 103.2/105.9/106.5/107.3/108.0
$4000 Velodyne DD15+: 97.0/102.0/109.0/109.0/112.0
$900 Aperion Bravus II 12D: 87.0/105.3/109.8/112.6/112.2
$879 Velodyne EQ-MAX15: 84.8/104.2/110.0/114.2/114.8
$1,200 RBH SX-12: 87.7/108.0/111.1/113.7/112.7
$740 Outlaw LFM-1EX: 101.0/110.7/112.3/113.7/113.8
$800 Power Sound XV15: 102.7/109.6/113.7/116.6/114.7
$2200 JL Audio F112: 92.8/112.4/116.2/113.3/117.6
$1400 SVS PB12+: 107.0/111.5/114.3/115.3/115.3
$9,000 Paradigm Sig Sub2: 106.4/109.9/113.2/116.9/120.2
$1022 Hsu VTF-15H: 103.9/113.0/115.7/115.7/115.6
$5,000 Velodyne DD18+: 103.4/113.0/115.8/116.8/115.3
$2,000 SVS PB13 Ultra: 110.6/115.5/117.5/117.8/116.6
$1,400 Rythmik FV15HP: 108.1/117.0/119.5/119.1/118.8

So for $740, the Outlaw LFM-1EX can output 110+ dB from 30Hz on up.



It would be interesting to see how the $589 Rythmik LV12 performs, though. Who knows? It might perform as well but cost significantly less. We'll have to wait for the CEA measurements.

I'm really impressed with the Rythmik FV15HP

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I'm really impressed with the Rythmik FV15HP

Yeah. It's funny how when Rythmik first came on the scene, most people were saying it was a "musical" sub, but not as much a "movie" sub because it was more tight and accurate, and not as much output.

As it turns outs, the FV15HP has a Q-value of 0.5 (tighter than most subs) and outputs more than any sub in it's class and many subs more expensive.

That's why I am curious to see how the $589 LV12 would do in CEA fashion. Will it better all the subs in the class and some above?

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Pulled the trigger on a VTF-3 tonight. Decided it was the best performer for the price. Really liked the SVS PB12-Plus (called SVS and they said the PB12-NSD would be too small for the room), but it was almost double the cost of the HSU and doubt I'll notice that level of difference.

Congrats!

I bet it is a great sub.
<O</O

 

[3db]

Yeah. It's funny how when Rythmik first came on the scene, most people were saying it was a "musical" sub, but not as much a "movie" sub because it was more tight and accurate, and not as much output.

As it turns outs, the FV15HP has a Q-value of 0.5 (tighter than most subs) and outputs more than any sub in it's class and many subs more expensive.

That's why I am curious to see how the $589 LV12 would do in CEA fashion. Will it better all the subs in the class and some above?

I would love to see it tested too. Having one, I can tell you that it has rock solid output down to 20 Hz with real authority.