B&W 802D: 3rd Time's a Charm on Friday the 13th

[Irvrobinson]

IMO the diamond tweeter does not sound any better than the RAAL or SEAS or Titanium or Beryllium or aluminum tweeters.

Just like Dennis will tell you the BG Neo8 sounds at least as great as the much more expensive Accuton midrange in the $16,000 Soundscape.

And the dual $400 B&W bass woofers do not sound better than the single ScanSpeak woofer in the Phil3.

And the $300 B&W midrange does not sound better than the $80 Neo8 midrange either IMO.

Sex appeal. Exotic appeal. Coolness factor. Something like that.

I'm sorry, ADTG, but I'm not buying it. I've heard the Seas tweeter in multiple speakers, the Orion and one from Joseph, and IMO the B&W tweeter sounds noticeably better. I've never heard a Ti or Al tweeter that impressed me, though the two Be tweeters I've heard (Revel and Focal) strike me as the best I've experienced. I haven't heard the RAAL, unfortunately. Frankly, I think that B&W tweeter is pretty damned impressive.

As for the dual B&W drivers not sounding better than the single ScanSpeak, don't forget that the 802D is rated to be about 6db more sensitive than the Phil 3.

While I don't care for what B&W has done with frequency balance, I do admire the technology and their results, and I can't agree that it's just for sex appeal.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

From the auditions I've done, I would take ribbon tweeters over diamonds any day of the week.

Are we sure?

What if Dennis Murphy used these Chemical Vapour Deposition Diamond Dome tweeters and $300 midrange and $800 woofers with his crossover?

Buying retail aftermarket JANTZEN or Accuton CVD Diamonds would be quite expensive, but what if Dennis worked his magic with his crossovers?

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I'm sorry, ADTG, but I'm not buying it. I've heard the Seas tweeter in multiple speakers, the Orion and one from Joseph, and IMO the B&W tweeter sounds noticeably better. I've never heard a Ti or Al tweeter that impressed me, though the two Be tweeters I've heard (Revel and Focal) strike me as the best I've experienced. I haven't heard the RAAL, unfortunately. Frankly, I think that B&W tweeter is pretty damned impressive.

As for the dual B&W drivers not sounding better than the single ScanSpeak, don't forget that the 802D is rated to be about 6db more sensitive than the Phil 3.

While I don't care for what B&W has done with frequency balance, I do admire the technology and their results, and I can't agree that it's just for sex appeal.

I admire the 802D technology greatly as well. I think it's a lot of things, not just one thing. Not just technology. Craftsmanship. The crossover could improve along with off-axis response. But the technology is awesome.

I think these diamond tweeters could be more special with the right crossover balance. They could be the end-all tweeters. But the way they sound now, I don't think they wow me. They can sound great now, but not any better than the others.

Of course, we are all talking about our very subjective opinions, not a double-blinded test. So we may all disagree.

I'm sure Jim Salk thinks the Accuton sounds better than the Neo8. I believe he feels that way. But that's his opinion. Dennis thinks the Neo8 sounds every bit as good as the Accuton. His opinion.

So some will think the diamond tweeters sound better than all other metal tweeters, some don't think so.

Regarding the bass, the Phil3 goes down to 25Hz @ -2dB, and the 802D goes to 34Hz @ -3dB. So the Phil3 is definitely deeper and more output. Again, the "quality" is debatable and everyone has a different opinion.

But I agree the 802D technology is awesome. The cabinets are exquisite. They could have worked the $800 crossover for more balance and achieve a better on-axis and polar response. Then it could be the end-all.

Many people talk markups. But in this example, I see the cost is mainly due to the technology and craftsmanship.

Again, I think the B&W 802D can sound great with a great subwoofer. The technology fueled the cost here, not hot air.

 

[slipperybidness]

Are we sure?

What if Dennis Murphy used these Chemical Vapour Deposition Diamond Dome tweeters and $300 midrange and $800 woofers with his crossover?

Buying retail aftermarket JANTZEN or Accuton CVD Diamonds would be quite expensive, but what if Dennis worked his magic with his crossovers?

True enough.

However, I did qualify my statement with "from the auditions I've done".

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

True enough.

However, I did qualify my statement with "from the auditions I've done".

Tis true.

 

[PENG]

I admire the 802D technology greatly as well. I think it's a lot of things, not just one thing. Not just technology. Craftsmanship. The crossover could improve along with off-axis response. But the technology is awesome.

I think these diamond tweeters could be more special with the right crossover balance. They could be the end-all tweeters. But the way they sound now, I don't think they wow me. They can sound great now, but not any better than the others.

Of course, we are all talking about our very subjective opinions, not a double-blinded test. So we may all disagree.

I'm sure Jim Salk thinks the Accuton sounds better than the Neo8. I believe he feels that way. But that's his opinion. Dennis thinks the Neo8 sounds every bit as good as the Accuton. His opinion.

So some will think the diamond tweeters sound better than all other metal tweeters, some don't think so.

Regarding the bass, the Phil3 goes down to 25Hz @ -2dB, and the 802D goes to 34Hz @ -3dB. So the Phil3 is definitely deeper and more output. Again, the "quality" is debatable and everyone has a different opinion.

But I agree the 802D technology is awesome. The cabinets are exquisite. They could have worked the $800 crossover for more balance and achieve a better on-axis and polar response. Then it could be the end-all.

Many people talk markups. But in this example, I see the cost is mainly due to the technology and craftsmanship.

Again, I think the B&W 802D can sound great with a great subwoofer. The technology fueled the cost here, not hot air.

Screw those highly/purely opinionated remarks about tonal balance, and off axis craps. They are the best sounding speaker I have ever heard, and that is my opinion = facts.

Next time you go there bring Miss anne-sophie mutter (in SACD or BR form) with you and get intoxicated with her violin through those Marlan Heads and file a full report back here. I wonder if you can special order those heads in blonde.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Screw those highly/purely opinionated remarks about tonal balance, and off axis craps. They are the best sounding speaker I have ever heard, and that is my opinion = facts.

Next time you go there bring Miss anne-sophie mutter (in SACD or BR form) with you and get intoxicated with her violin through those Marlan Heads and file a full report back here. I wonder if you can special order those heads in blonde.

Off-axis might only suggests that these Diamonds may be finicky with some rooms.

Speakers tend to sound better in my room than at the dealers. So the 802D may sound just as great as any speakers to my ears as well in my room, instead of at the dealer.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Update:

I just transferred some money to my local bank to purchase a new pair of 802D from my dealer, which includes home delivery and 5 yr factory warranty.

The transfer will probably take 4 days, so ETA should next week.

 

[cpp]

Update:

I just transferred some money to my local bank to purchase a new pair of 802D from my dealer, which includes home delivery and 5 yr factory warranty.

The transfer will probably take 4 days, so ETA should next week.

 

[Matt34]

Update:

I just transferred some money to my local bank to purchase a new pair of 802D from my dealer, which includes home delivery and 5 yr factory warranty.

The transfer will probably take 4 days, so ETA should next week.

I'm jelly.

So....what subs are going with this pair?

 

[templemaners]

Update:

I just transferred some money to my local bank to purchase a new pair of 802D from my dealer, which includes home delivery and 5 yr factory warranty.

The transfer will probably take 4 days, so ETA should next week.

Did the dealer ever come down in price from when you went in there last time?

And if not, did you pound on the counter and yell "DON'T YOU KNOW WHO I AM?!" That would have been the move...

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I'm jelly.

So....what subs are going with this pair?

I'm going to get an ear-full and will never hear the end of it (lord have mercy ), but my beloved red Phil3 will be moving to the family room (until I get a bigger house ).

New configurations will be:

Salon2 + dual Funk 18.0 + AT3002 + AVR-5308CI

802D + dual RBH SX-1010N + AT2004 + AVR-3310CI

201/2 (x 5) + dual Rythmik D15SE + AT3005 + AVP-A1HDCI

Orion3 + dual Rythmik D15SE (share w/ KEF) + AT6012 + AVR-3310CI

Phil3 + dual Velodyne SC-600 + AVR-990

P362 + single Velodyne SC-600 + AVR-3312CI

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Did the dealer ever come down in price from when you went in there last time?

And if not, did you pound on the counter and yell "DON'T YOU KNOW WHO I AM?!" That would have been the move...

I pounded on the counter and said "I am AcuDefTechGuy...hear me roar!"

Well, they originally asked for $12,000 + tax = $13,000.

I got them to go down to.................I'll tell you after I actually have the 802D at home.

 

[Irvrobinson]

I'm going to get an ear-full and will never hear the end of it (lord have mercy ), but my beloved red Phil3 will be moving to the family room (until I get a bigger house ).

New configurations will be:

Salon2 + dual Funk 18.0 + AT3002 + AVR-5308CI

802D + dual RBH SX-1010N + AT2004 + AVR-3310CI

201/2 (x 5) + dual Rythmik D15SE + AT3005 + AVP-A1HDCI

Orion3 + dual Rythmik D15SE (share w/ KEF) + AT6012 + AVR-3310CI

Phil3 + dual Velodyne SC-600 + AVR-990

P362 + single Velodyne SC-600 + AVR-3312CI

I think you individually constitute an entire market segment.

Congrats on the new speakers.

 

[Swerd]

New configurations will be:

Salon2 + dual Funk 18.0 + AT3002 + AVR-5308CI

802D + dual RBH SX-1010N + AT2004 + AVR-3310CI

201/2 (x 5) + dual Rythmik D15SE + AT3005 + AVP-A1HDCI

Orion3 + dual Rythmik D15SE (share w/ KEF) + AT6012 + AVR-3310CI

Phil3 + dual Velodyne SC-600 + AVR-990

P362 + single Velodyne SC-600 + AVR-3312CI

Audio by Van Alstine has made a switch box that allows you to connect two preamplifiers, two power amplifiers, three speaker system pairs, and a subwoofer (with both in and out connections). You can mix and match any pair of components and speakers (with or without subwoofers), and control the selections from the supplied remote control.

New ABX test box that really works

I saw this in action last weekend at the CAF. Dennis Murphy used it to switch between the Phil 2 and 3 while using a single set of electronic gear: CD player, DAC, preamp, and amp. It worked well.

If ever there was a customer for this item, it has to be you!

 

[KEW]

201/2 (x 5) + dual Rythmik D15SE + AT3005 + AVP-A1HDCI

Orion3 + dual Rythmik D15SE (share w/ KEF) + AT6012 + AVR-3310CI

Sharing subs! How ... pedestrian!

Seriously, I can't believe you have dedicated pairs of subs for the others.
Those P362's must feel kind of lonely with just one!

 

[KEW]

Audio by Van Alstine has made a switch box that allows you to connect two preamplifiers, two power amplifiers, three speaker system pairs, and a subwoofer (with both in and out connections). You can mix and match any pair of components and speakers (with or without subwoofers), and control the selections from the supplied remote control.

Was this a loaner for Dennis or does he get to keep it?

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I think you individually constitute an entire market segment.

Congrats on the new speakers.

Well, thanks. However, better save the Congrats until I actually have them inside my house.

 

[cpp]

I think you need a new amp and processor for these speakers... It, well wouldn't be right you know for them to use "used stuff"

 

[Swerd]

Was this a loaner for Dennis or does he get to keep it?

That was a loaner from Frank Van Alstine.

Dennis does have a different switch box in his home that switches among pairs of speakers and allows you to compare them while playing at the same volume. Frank's new switch box allows you to compare amps or preamps, as well as speakers.

I think ADTG may need at least two of them .