receiver for 90% music for less than $700??

[zumbo]

Using the Vegas as an example: They are 93dB efficient. That is an 8dB gain. Think about it.

Think about it?

I have Cerwins. Got them in 1985. Sh!**y speakers.

Have had them on a low power receiver. It's not pleasant.

So, I know for a 100% fact that recommending Cerwin Vega's to be crossed-over for the upper-end of the audio ran off of a low-end receiver is foolish.

 

[zumbo]

1) Subs don't do squat for anything except low bass.

2) From his posts, bass doesn't seem to be his problem.

3) Everything above that is dependent on the mains.

So, that still leads you to a more powerful receiver as the solution?

(When all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail)

The sub comment was in reply to the Cerwin recommendation. You certainly don't support that foolish suggestion, do you?

 

[GranteedEV]

His 363 is just 100W measured @1k. Positive that is just one channel.

It's rated 80w / 1khz / 2ch which roughly translates to around 60w / 20hz-20khz / 2ch which is a good bit of power.

He is trying to run 85dB speakers.

With a 5.25" woofer playing down to probably 80hz. Also considered slightly forward by some people who've heard them.

Receiver is running out of gas.

That's one presumption. Or maybe the speakers are running out of gas. Or maybe the room is too dry.

OP likes the sound of his speakers

Not sure if OP likes the sound of his speakers. He likes some aspects of their sound, at least.

If these are the facts, I see no reason why the Outlaw receiver will not do the job.

one reason, would be the speakers hitting Power Compression. Another would be that maybe he doesn't actually like all aspects of the sound of his speakers.

 

[GranteedEV]

Think about it?

I have Cerwins. Got them in 1985. Sh!**y speakers.

Have had them on a low power receiver. It's not pleasant.

So, I know for a 100% fact that recommending Cerwin Vega's to be crossed-over for the upper-end of the audio ran off of a low-end receiver is foolish.

I agree with you there.

 

[zumbo]

With no disrespect to the OP, we have a weak receiver driving weak speakers.

An improvement is desired.

I would not recommend trying to drop the OP's $700 on speakers to be ran by this low-end receiver.

If that $700 was spent on the Outlaw, the OP is well on his way to a much better system.

Recommending junk is foolish, and not very Audiohlic like.

 

[zumbo]

He would have a bad @$$ 2.1 receiver, and by what others say here, a bad @$$ sub.

 

[markw]

The sub comment was in reply to the Cerwin recommendation. You certainly don't support that foolish suggestion, do you?

I'm not a CV fan but, for this application, I think they, without a sub, would be a great solution. At least they would cleanly handle the volume levels desired.

 

[markw]

With no disrespect to the OP, we have a weak receiver driving weak speakers.

An improvement is desired.

I would not recommend trying to drop the OP's $700 on speakers to be ran by this low-end receiver.

If that $700 was spent on the Outlaw, the OP is well on his way to a much better system.

Recommending junk is foolish, and not very Audiohlic like.

So, you would recommend a powerful receiver driving weak speakers?

As you say in your timeline, he would still have to buy better speakers anyway.

By getting better speakers now, odds are that his current receiver would be more than adequate. If not, he's lost nothing.

And, who suggested he spend $700 on speakers. Are you resorting to the straw man style of trying to prove a foolish position? I thought this forum was above that.

 

[zumbo]

So, you would recommend a powerful receiver driving weak speakers?

Absolutely foolish!

He should just unplug his rythmic fv12, and invest in Cerwin to be ran off of a Yamaha 363?

Unbelievable!

 

[zumbo]

So, you would recommend a powerful receiver driving weak speakers?

Sure. The goal is upgrade!

I do it. You do it. We all do it.

But, who the heck buys old-school Cerwins?

With a limited budget, none of us can go buy it all in one day. Everyone has priorities.

 

[jinjuku]

Think about it?

I have Cerwins. Got them in 1985. Sh!**y speakers.

Have had them on a low power receiver. It's not pleasant.

So, I know for a 100% fact that recommending Cerwin Vega's to be crossed-over for the upper-end of the audio ran off of a low-end receiver is foolish.

Compare almost any 1985 speaker to something 26 years later. What a dumb statement.

 

[zumbo]

If I were going to go as far as to recommend Cerwin, I would at least have the decency to recommend the new ones.

CERWIN-VEGA CMX Series HOME THEATER SPEAKER SYSTEM

 

[zumbo]

Compare almost any 1985 speaker to something 26 years later. What a dumb statement.

The speakers that were posted are the exact same design as 26 years ago!

Needs bigger speakers IMO. If this is really a work out room and not critical listening and he can fit them:

Shop Cerwin-Vega - 12" 3-Way Tower Speaker

 

[jinjuku]

I'm not a CV fan but, for this application, I think they, without a sub, would be a great solution. At least they would cleanly handle the volume levels desired.

Did IQ's suddenly plummet around here? The CV's are simply a recommendation for a work out room. You know clanging weights, running on a treadmill etc...

 

[jinjuku]

The speakers that were posted are the exact same design as 26 years ago!

Not sure if the materials are the same. The only ding I have against Cerwins of yore are the foam surrounds.

 

[sholling]

As someone else suggested you're going to have to at least double your effective power to get 3db more output from those speakers. Unless you're married to them I'd save a ton of money and replace the speakers. It simply makes no sense to spend $700 to salvage a $150 speaker investment. A pair of $170/pr Infinity P163 bookshelves will give you another 5db using your existing receiver. A pair of Ascend Acoustics CMB-170SE bookshelf speakers are a step up from the Infinities and 4db more sensitive than your pioneers - the equivalent of more than doubling your receiver's power. That's where I'd start before throwing $700 at a receiver. Then if you decide that you still want a more capable receiver I'd consider refurbished Onkyo TX-NR709 so that you can take advantage of it's Audyssey MultiEQ XT room correction.

One possible problem that you might be experiencing at high volumes in a small room may be reflections muddying the sound. If so you may want to save up for a few room treatment panels.

 

[GranteedEV]

I would not recommend trying to drop the OP's $700 on speakers to be ran by this low-end receiver.

If that $700 was spent on the Outlaw, the OP is well on his way to a much better system.

so you recommend $700 on an amp to drive $200 on speakers? Especially when he could get something like a pair of Ascend CMT-320 (6db more sensitive - the equivalent of going from a 60w amp to 250w amp, except less heat, twice the radiating surrace area, more wide dispersion profile, and presumably higher thermal power handling)

heck why not the pioneer fs51s.

But before that i'd appreciate if OP would do the tweaks I asked. It's possible he has all the tools to be satisfied without spending a dime.

 

[jinjuku]

Sure. The goal is upgrade!

I do it. You do it. We all do it.

But, who the heck buys old-school Cerwins?

With a limited budget, none of us can go buy it all in one day. Everyone has priorities.

It's a work out room... And obviously people are still buying Cerwins because Cerwin is still selling em'. BTW find any post here where I have previously recommended CV's. The suggestion is application driven. He could possibly get one of the new Cinema designs from CHT or eDesign audio.

The receiver should be the 2nd upgrade. Speakers first.

 

[zumbo]

Not sure if the materials are the same. The only ding I have against Cerwins of yore are the foam surrounds.

Foam surrounds, particle board, untreated paper cones, poor crossover networks......

Big, honking, orange surrounds. Same as in 1985!

Needs bigger speakers IMO. If this is really a work out room and not critical listening and he can fit them:

Shop Cerwin-Vega - 12" 3-Way Tower Speaker

 

[markw]

But, who the heck buys old-school Cerwins?

Well, you did. Most of knew even back then that they, well, "lacked".

Besuides, who said go buy 'em. As far as most of us here realize, they were just thrown up as an example. ...at least ot was until you tried to make a straw man out of it.

With a limited budget, none of us can go buy it all in one day. Everyone has priorities.

True, but as you're showing here, yours are totally skewed against all logic.