Philharmonic Audio - 3-way open back ML-TQWTs designed by Dennis Murphy

[DenPureSound]

One thing we can all count on with DM is his honesty, sincere desire to give us the truth with a little humor, conforming to facts and therefore worthy of belief and trust. Not that there is any doubt in this forum, though. (He will probably question some of this).

And, speaking of shipping, I took a 24 lb package to UPS and they said 75.00, I about croaked, so I marched myself to the USPS and it was 30.00. The box hasn't arrived yet? ):

Speaking of the Philharmonics.....Dennis is not too far from me so I will looking forward to driving up and pick up my Philly IIs, and I am hoping very, very soon, He He!!

Very anxious to hear the RAAL in my setting. Both the Fountek and the RAAL were winners in my ears at the CAF. I have certainly enjoyed the CAOW1 bookshelves he built for me, they are true winners as well.

Rob

Rob, when you get those PH2's there, we expect a Full and Detailed review of the Sound Quality with the B&G Corp. Neo8 Mid, and the RAAL Ribbon Tweeter -- Don't laugh, but I listened to Youtube yesterday, and heard the sound out of the Salk SoundScape 10's -- even w/ all those variables in the loop per sey -- they are some of the best sounding speakers I have ever heard. In fact, I keep listening to this demo audio over and over, it just wraps the sound around me and is mesmerizing to my ears -- if the Phils sound like the SS's, then the PHIL's will be WINNERS !!

For SoundScape 10 on YouTube goto:

Salk SoundScape 10 Preview - YouTube

Yes, nothing like being in front of them, but better than just guessing at nothing but Text writeups, and FR Plots.

Dennis Murphy, did you design the Xover Ccts. for both the Salk SS 10 and 12's? Love the Snare Drum brightness/Crispness, what frequency is the Snare Drum?

I believe in Dennis Murphy also, and we all here need some Humor from time to time -- while the music is Playing of course.

Dennis

 

[woodsart]

HA HA...... already heard them ( I and III and Soundscapes)!!!!


My review..........................GREAT SPEAKERS....GREAT PRICE!!!!!

Rob

 

[woodsart]

Humor aside.....

I have also heard the Neo3s, they are great tweets, too. Anxious to compare all of them, however, most of the sounds i heard will certainly vary somewhat in my own home, can't wait!!!!!

I only have the improved version of the Hiquphon Ow2. Very nice, airy sweet tweet.

I will probably be estatic when I make it to Bethesda and back. There will be a lot said in the review, just joking above. The only problem is I am not well versed on charts and graphs as you and others are, so my review will be different as we all know listening is subjective. Seems to me DM's crossover/speaker/cabinet designs are what makes me love them.

Rob

Oh, I will check out the video. And on the soundscapes, knowing Dennis, he is probably still working and improving on the SS10/12s as well as all of his creations.

Don't know about the Songtowers, but I think they were the most impressive speaker I had heard at that time. Amazing piece of creativity.

 

[DenPureSound]

Humor aside.....

I have also heard the Neo3s, they are great tweets, too. Anxious to compare all of them, however, most of the sounds i heard will certainly vary somewhat in my own home, can't wait!!!!!

I only have the improved version of the Hiquphon Ow2. Very nice, airy sweet tweet.

I will probably be estatic when I make it to Bethesda and back. There will be a lot said in the review, just joking above. The only problem is I am not well versed on charts and graphs as you and others are, so my review will be different as we all know listening is subjective. Seems to me DM's crossover/speaker/cabinet designs are what makes me love them.

Rob

Oh, I will check out the video. And on the soundscapes, knowing Dennis, he is probably still working and improving on the SS10/12s as well as all of his creations.

Don't know about the Songtowers, but I think they were the most impressive speaker I had heard at that time. Amazing piece of creativity.

Now your stating the Neo3's were great tweets also, but DM uses the Neo's High Performance Wideband, Planar Magnetic Transducer for the Mid-Range, and the RAAL Ribbon for the Tweet so it seems to me, am I missing something?

Let's put aside the specs for a moment, as ADTG loves the On/Off Axis specs... but I know that every speaker sounds different, even if their specs are identical.

In the end, what counts is do we think they are just OK/GOOD or GREAT, and the sound envelopes us into wanting more of that sound. Many speakers are just down right tiring, and boring. I am sure that is not the case with the PH's if they have that Salk SoundScape Signature of Sound, they will be GREAT!!

Can not wait for more reviews surely coming soon on the Phil's.

My dilemma is replacing my Klipsch RF-82II's for Front Left and Rights with the Phil 3's, am I getting that "DREAM SPEAKER" with the sound that fits right for me.

The Klipsch's are no slouches, just that I know something is missing as they use that horn for reaching down into the mid-range, and also the higher end of the spectrum. Basically, two way with no separate Mid Driver, and that Snare Drum is barely alive with my Klipsch's... not like what I have heard in the SoundScapes, and if DM can reproduce the SoundScapes Sonic Signature in his Phil's we all will have a BIG WINNER!!

 

[woodsart]

Now your stating the Neo3's were great tweets also, but DM uses the Neo's High Performance Wideband, Planar Magnetic Transducer for the Mid-Range, and the RAAL Ribbon for the Tweet so it seems to me, am I missing something?

Let's put aside the specs for a moment, as ADTG loves the On/Off Axis specs... but I know that every speaker sounds different, even if their specs are identical.

In the end, what counts is do we think they are just OK/GOOD or GREAT, and the sound envelopes us into wanting more of that sound. Many speakers are just down right tiring, and boring. I am sure that is not the case with the PH's if they have that Salk SoundScape Signature of Sound, they will be GREAT!!

Can not wait for more reviews surely coming soon on the Phil's.

My dilemma is replacing my Klipsch RF-82II's for Front Left and Rights with the Phil 3's, am I getting that "DREAM SPEAKER" with the sound that fits right for me.

The Klipsch's are no slouches, just that I know something is missing as they use that horn for reaching down into the mid-range, and also the higher end of the spectrum. Basically, two way with no separate Mid Driver, and that Snare Drum is barely alive with my Klipsch's... not like what I have heard in the SoundScapes, and if DM can reproduce the SoundScapes Sonic Signature in his Phil's we all will have a BIG WINNER!!

Yes, I am stating that as Danny Richie uses them in his designs and no you are not missing anything. I also have a friend who thinks they are fantastic in the N3s he built. I have heard them with the N2X and the N3s on my speaker journey. They really were nice speakers.

Seems each designer has their own likes and dislikes in drivers or rather just a choice as each has their own tast in manufacturers.

Dennis uses the GR Research M130 woofers with the MBOW1 bookshelf speaker design similar, if not the same in the N3/N2X speakers. Not exactly positive on that, though.

I am no audiophile, but the Phillys and the soundscapes are both great speakers, and the purchase of either, to me, would be determined by the wallet. I have heard the SS on 2 occasions and they are something and I try to avoid prolong listening.....I spoil easy!

And, FYI, Dennis concentrates on the midrange as he thinks it makes up 80% of the sound, but DON'T quote me, please, Dennis will chime in, if necessary.

The SS just go further in every area........bigger...... better.....faster, this is what my wife says about our youngest son, who upgrades to every new electronic out there.

Oh, I forgot the SS video, I will check it out now.....one moment......Well.....maybe it could be just me, but, well I heard my CAOW1s (a very close relative), somewhere in there, that is all I can say. Watched in 1080p.

Guys, this IS DM, so be very surprised when and if you get to hear the Phillys!!!

Rob

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

The only problem is I am not well versed on charts and graphs as you and others are, so my review will be different as we all know listening is subjective.

Comparative subjective reviews are also important.

We know that price doesn't always determine the "best" speakers.

We are not saying these speakers are competing with other speakers.

But how will these speakers compare to other speakers?

How do they compare to the Soundscapes, Salons, KEFs, B&Ws, Orions, etc.

Perhaps it's impossible to answer that.

Perhaps the only question we can ask is do they sound accurate? Do they preserve all the details in the recording faithfully and project a convincing soundstage?

I mean what more can we ask for?

 

[GranteedEV]

Perhaps it's impossible to answer that.

It's possible, but ya'd need to find some person who owns Salons, KEFs, and Orions and has auditioned B&Ws multiple times.

 

[woodsart]

Perhaps you are right, but, comparing all of the ones mentioned might put you into the next year or two making speaker decisions.

I remember when I was on the journey for a reasonable entry level 7.1 for theater system as I had an onkyo and was ready to move up somewhat.

In my research i got hooked on the Infinity Primus Thread and for the money one cannot find anything that would compare with them IMHO. I still regard them as a high end entry level speaker....P362 towers and P350 center. I never got a chance to hear them before I purchased, just read the reviews over and over and took the leap.

Several years later I still have the 3 mains, can't seem to part with them. In this case the reviews told it all and honestly everything said was very true about this line and from what I understand the 3rd generation, (I think), is doing well too.

It is ashame you guys are not close proximity to Dennis, or at a RMAF or CAF that Dennis will be showing the Phillys. Jim is usually at all the big ones with the SS.

You asked........

[Perhaps the only question we can ask is do they sound accurate? Do they preserve all the details in the recording faithfully and project a convincing soundstage?]

I believe I can say without a doubt that DM's primary goal in speaker design is to achieve this and more. These speakers have all of these attributes. Dennis works toward accuracy, but that means little to me as my ears are my deciding factor and isn't that what really matters in the end. Not how much you spend, but how much you enjoy!! Spending less and getting more works for me!

I know this....airy prestine highs, instrument/voice separation, broad, bold sound stage, low distortion, live on stage sound....when I hear that, then I am home.

I think I would have bought the Phillys unheard if I hadn't heard Dennis' signature sound. And as I mentioned before given his background and reputation, why wouldn't I trust a member of the Washington Metropolitan Philharmonic to be accurate in producing the actual detail sound of the instrument as much as a box can!!

However, it is my conclusion thus far that..... great speakers with great equipment make great sound.

The Phillys actually sound great with mediocre equipment.

Wish I could add more or direct you somewhere you could have an audition. I live near Richmond, Va. If you are in the area or just passing through you take a listen. I am retired and have the time!

I should have the Philly IIs in a few weeks as the cabinets are about to land. From what I understand the IIs are like the IIIs, except for the deeper bass in the IIIs.

I know how frustrating this can be when you just want to hear some great speakers.

 

[Matt34]

Had an interesting chat with Jim Salk about the PH's. In short, he thinks it's crazy what Dennis is asking for them for the performance you get.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

It's possible, but ya'd need to find some person who owns Salons, KEFs, and Orions and has auditioned B&Ws multiple times.

Next time I audition the 800Ds I'm bringing another AH member along - maybe our friend in Norman who lives 30 miles from me.

Except this time I'll bring my red mahogany Philharmonic3.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Had an interesting chat with Jim Salk about the PH's. In short, he thinks it's crazy what Dennis is asking for them for the performance you get.

I think DenPureSound is mad @ U right now.

He is thinking "R U trying to get DM to increase some more?"

FYI Del already got my $910 check last Thursday via Priority Mail.

 

[Dennis Murphy]

Had an interesting chat with Jim Salk about the PH's. In short, he thinks it's crazy what Dennis is asking for them for the performance you get.

Wacko. Blip. They're CRAZY low. And, if you order today, I'll throw in pin striping and a moon roof.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Had an interesting chat with Jim Salk about the PH's. In short, he thinks it's crazy what Dennis is asking for them for the performance you get.

I don't think Dennis is crazy @ all for his pricing. I would do the same. Sure he can't take a loss & needs to make some money to stay afloat in this business. But IMO there is no need to charge $15K for the Soundscape or Orion. I don't like the prices on the Salk speakers @ all.

We can argue about SQ all day. But IMO Salk, Linkwitz, Seaton, JTR, etc., will never be in the same boat as Revel, KEF, B&W, ect.

It doesn't matter if 100 guys on AH or AVS love the sound of Salk or Seaton.

They are different animals, & they need to realize it.

As dirty Harry would say, "A man's gotta know his limitations."

I can get the Salon2 brand new shipped to my front porch for $14K. So why would anyone spend $15K for the Orions or Soundscapes? That is crazy.

Or $10K for used Salon2s.

I think DM is reasonable.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Wacko. Blip. They're CRAZY low. And, if you order today, I'll throw in pin striping and a moon roof.

Retractable moon roof?

 

[Dennis Murphy]

I don't think Dennis is crazy @ all for his pricing. I would do the same. Sure he can't take a loss & needs to make some money to stay afloat in this business. But IMO there is no need to charge $15K for the Soundscape or Orion. I don't like the prices on the Salk speakers @ all.

We can argue about SQ all day. But IMO Salk, Linkwitz, Seaton, JTR, etc., will never be in the same boat as Revel, KEF, B&W, ect.

It doesn't matter if 100 guys on AH or AVS love the sound of Salk or Seaton.

They are different animals, & they need to realize it.

As dirty Harry would say, "A man's gotta know his limitations."

I can get the Salon2 brand new shipped to my front porch for $14K. So why would anyone spend $15K for the Orions or Soundscapes? That is crazy.

Or $10K for used Salon2s.

I think DM is reasonable.

There are some real differences between companies like Salk and me. First, I don't have to make a living at this--you tax payers have provided me with a very comfortable government pension. Speakers are a hobby. I don't have to meet a payroll or feed a family. Second, an awful lot of the price of a Salk speaker goes to the cabinetry. If you start charging shop time out at $50 an hour and figure how long a pair of those beautiful cabinets takes to make, you're into big bucks. Any fine furniture costs. I designed my speakers to appeal to a different market. They aren't fine furniture, and won't look like it if you plop one down next to a Salk speaker. I'm pretty sure that if you got hold of Salk's financial books, you would come away amazed at how little profit there is in this biz.

 

[DenPureSound]

It's possible, but ya'd need to find some person who owns Salons, KEFs, and Orions and has auditioned B&Ws multiple times.

That sounds like ADTG, he is going farther down the food chain w/ PH3's vs. those SALON 2's at $22,000 / pair !!

But I do know he wants some Planars and Ribbon Tweeters vs. ALL THOSE CONE Drivers he has now !!

 

[DenPureSound]

I think DenPureSound is mad @ U right now.

He is thinking "R U trying to get DM to increase some more?"

FYI Del already got my $910 check last Thursday via Priority Mail.

Hopefully, Dennis Murphy will HOLD CONSTANT now in pricing after the $200 increase until which time many are out there, and we all can hear a set of them, and read some reviews of them by our favorite AH and/or Stereophile Rag, and then buy a Pair, and pour some Ice Cold Beer and ENJOY the TUNES!!

 

[Matt34]

I don't think Dennis is crazy @ all for his pricing. I would do the same. Sure he can't take a loss & needs to make some money to stay afloat in this business. But IMO there is no need to charge $15K for the Soundscape or Orion. I don't like the prices on the Salk speakers @ all.

We can argue about SQ all day. But IMO Salk, Linkwitz, Seaton, JTR, etc., will never be in the same boat as Revel, KEF, B&W, ect.

It doesn't matter if 100 guys on AH or AVS love the sound of Salk or Seaton.

They are different animals, & they need to realize it.

As dirty Harry would say, "A man's gotta know his limitations."

I can get the Salon2 brand new shipped to my front porch for $14K. So why would anyone spend $15K for the Orions or Soundscapes? That is crazy.

Or $10K for used Salon2s.

I think DM is reasonable.

The finish on the soundscapes I saw yesterday is better than most any piece of fine furniture I've seen. That alone has to account for a significant chunk of the price. Never heard a speaker system that is so dynamic yet so smooth.

 

[DenPureSound]

There are some real differences between companies like Salk and me. First, I don't have to make a living at this--you tax payers have provided me with a very comfortable government pension. Speakers are a hobby. I don't have to meet a payroll or feed a family. Second, an awful lot of the price of a Salk speaker goes to the cabinetry. If you start charging shop time out at $50 an hour and figure how long a pair of those beautiful cabinets takes to make, you're into big bucks. Any fine furniture costs. I designed my speakers to appeal to a different market. They aren't fine furniture, and won't look like it if you plop one down next to a Salk speaker. I'm pretty sure that if you got hold of Salk's financial books, you would come away amazed at how little profit there is in this biz.

Dennis Murphy -- the Phil 3's show their specs. at 25Hz – 20kHz (+/- 2 dB). But, when I look at the FR Plots they end at 200Hz. on the low end. So you must have some data showing the Phil 3's playing down to 25Hz. staying within the +/- 2dB limit.

What do things look like below 200Hz. all the way down to 25Hz.?

 

[DenPureSound]

Dennis Murphy --

The SoundScape 10's have:

"To round out the design, dual horizontally-opposed passive radiators are used to provide bass tuning. This allows deep, impactful and musical bass while totally eliminating the “chuffing” inherent in a typical ported design".

Just curious why the Phil's use no passive radiators, and use the ML-TL terminus port design instead.

Did you get any "Chuffing" w/ the terminus port ML-TL design of the Phil's being at 0.8% of the Speed of Sound (~2.7 meters/sec.)?