Questions About Upgrading a Polk PSW350 to an SVS PB-1000

[John Lohmann]

I think it certainly will. I am sure you will be able to turn it up louder than it should be.

Slam is produced by factors other than raw power. Slam is not just a function of a sub, this is massive misconception. Slam requires a really good integration of sub with the other speakers and the quality of the rest of the system is crucial here, probably more so than the sub. So the slam very much depends on the power and transient quality of the speakers to well above sub range.

If you don't believe me, then play a sub by itself and I can assure you it will not in any way hear slam.

What a bad sub can do that is "muddy the waters" though. Far too many do from what I have heard.

If you want to hear the realistic crack of those tymps in Beethoven's 9th symphony, then you need a lot more than good subs. There is a renowned passage in that symphony that will tell you if your system can slam in a hurry!

I personally believe on a truly integrated and well designed full range speaker can deliver that edge of your seat excitement and realism.

Thanks; it's not that I wouldn't believe you -- or anyone here -- was just expressing my concerns.

This new sub will be used strictly for HT, while the older Polk is going to get moved into the two-channel system.

 

[ski2xblack]

I think your concerns about the SVS is colored by some of us apparently contradicting the recommendation you recieved prior to posting, but nobody has said the SVS is a bad sub. Any of the options would be a step up.

Whatever you choose, while you're waiting for it to arrive, peruse the articles and forum threads here on Audioholics concerning sub integration. TLS spoke the truth when he pointed out that slam depends on very good integration of the sub with your mains, so give that the attention it's due and your ears will thank you.

 

[j_garcia]

Thats a misconception. The sub's lpf is always in the circuit, and downstream of the line input, so it most certainly will work in conjunction with the receiver's sub out connection. The sub preout on that stereo receiver is either not filtered (full range signal) or might have a fixed lpf but at a higher frequency that you likely need, so you'll have to rely on the sub's lpf.

The phase swich has nothing to do with the plane of the speakers. It's there so you can better dial in the crossover between your mains and sub. I encourage you to try both settings of the phase switch and choose what works best.

If you're doing the calibration by ear, it will be a shot in the dark. If you have REW or Dayton Omnimic, you could dial it in more precisely.

The Polk has a separate LFE input, which I take to mean it IS fully bypassed, otherwise there is no reason for that input. That is different from what is likely common now.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

I think your concerns about the SVS is colored by some of us apparently contradicting the recommendation you recieved prior to posting, but nobody has said the SVS is a bad sub. Any of the options would be a step up.

Whatever you choose, while you're waiting for it to arrive, peruse the articles and forum threads here on Audioholics concerning sub integration. TLS spoke the truth when he pointed out that slam depends on very good integration of the sub with your mains, so give that the attention it's due and your ears will thank you.

I’d only add to this that while slam depends on good integration, it’s also a function of spl. Nobody is getting slammed at 75db lol.

 

[lovinthehd]

The Polk has a separate LFE input, which I take to mean it IS fully bypassed, otherwise there is no reason for that input. That is different from what is likely common now.

While that might be nice, the very term LFE is often abused, as it is with labeling an input on a sub. I have seen reports of subs with an input labeled "lfe" but still not bypassing the lpf. Many subs label a mere lpf as crossover, too. Marketing.

 

[TLS Guy]

I’d only add to this that while slam depends on good integration, it’s also a function of spl. Nobody is getting slammed at 75db lol.

Yes, but where really is the major power demand. It is above sub range. Most subs are very inefficient and so require large amps. However on my rig I can look at the power demand in real time on a continuous basis. The major power bands of all program are above sub range.

So yes, you need to be able to reproduce concert levels, but very, very few rigs can. The speakers and drivers are just too darn small. Overdriving subs in not the correct substitute.

 

[ski2xblack]

I’d only add to this that while slam depends on good integration, it’s also a function of spl. Nobody is getting slammed at 75db lol.

Agree.

However, a poorly blended sub will result in distracting audible tells regardless of the volume. Loudness eq can restore some tactility and rumble for low spl listening.

I hate to confuse the OP further, but he hasn't said much about his room size. His Polk mains should be capable of "slam" above the sub's range with all those drivers. Something bigger than the SVS sub may be warranted for his room and to keep up with his mains.

 

[John Lohmann]

Agree.

However, a poorly blended sub will result in distracting audible tells regardless of the volume. Loudness eq can restore some tactility and rumble for low spl listening.

I hate to confuse the OP further, but he hasn't said much about his room size. His Polk mains should be capable of "slam" above the sub's range with all those drivers. Something bigger than the SVS sub may be warranted for his room and to keep up with his mains.

I believe I reported on room size in the original post, but if not, it is an average-sized living room without vaulted or high ceilings, and we sit about 12 feet from the display and front stage. The RTi12 mains indeed dig pretty deep, which is why I am rolling them off at 60Hz; this has worked well thus far, allowing them to "flex some of their muscles" while also offloading all stuff under that to the sub.

The room we're in doesn't require that much bass pressurization, if that helps answer the question -- but I'd like something that just slams harder than this current Polk.

 

[j_garcia]

A smaller room tends to be more difficult for bass, especially if the room is closer to square. The more square, the more standing waves at more frequencies. If your room isn't square-ish, you should be OK.

 

[John Lohmann]

A smaller room tends to be more difficult for bass, especially if the room is closer to square. The more square, the more standing waves at more frequencies. If your room isn't square-ish, you should be OK.

Well, I mean, it's not a TINY room, but an average sized American living room that opens to a dining room and kitchen behind it (there's a one-step drop-down to get into the living room from those areas).

It's not square, per se, but I'd say a long rectangle; at any rate, I just need to be assured that another sub LIKE the PB-1000 is going to make SOME kind of improvement. It's not like we get zero bass now with the Polk, it's just that I'd like it a bit cleaner and louder.

 

[j_garcia]

For sure you will get cleaner, probably louder as well. Rectangular is good.

 

[John Lohmann]

Thanks brother J.

 

[ski2xblack]

You should be ok then. Open floorplans are far less bedeviled with modal issues. And any of the subs mentioned would be a step up. If I were in your shoes, keeping within a reasonable budget, I would go for the biggest, best performing sub possible. Fhe Hsu TN1 would be at the top of the short list, above the SVS pb1000 pro.

 

[lovinthehd]

I was just looking at the spec for the PSW350, it indicates it has an f3 of 38hz. The PB1000 pro indicates f3 is 17Hz. Clearly the SVS has better extension. Can't find any measurements of the PSW350 but can't imagine that it will compare well in other respects.

$500 used to be entry level a few years ago but it is more like 700-800 now (altho the two RSL 10" are pretty dang good for the money, but I'd still rather have their 12S model. Flagship avrs are more in the $3-4k range these days.

 

[John Lohmann]

Thanks ski and Lovin.

 

[sopra4343]

It's hard for us tell what you're shooting for and why the Polk isn't working for you. IOW, YMMV. We can't make a decision for you.

My opinion is the 1k would be a very good upgrade. If it's not enough you can eventually add a second one. I can't imagine in a standard sized living room with standard ceilings you can go wrong. That's if you don't like one.

It's also probably more practical and economical going with two 1ks than it would be one large sub. Besides not having a large initial expenditure, two 1ks may be easier to place and have a better wife factor than one large sub. As @TLS Guy said, there are also other advantages to having two subs that shouldn't be underestimated. I don't miss having one large sub Asset Tokenization for many reasons. One being it was a piece of furniture!

Great and informative