Dayton SUB1200 vs JBL 550p on low budget system

[Dynatuber]

Hey folks.

I'm way out of my league in sophisticated audiophile forums like Audioholics and the AVS forums, so bear with me if I sound pretty uninformed. I've always been limited to low budget 'consumer' HiFi systems. But I've been lucky enough through the years to have a few friends point me to affordable equipment that sounds pretty sweet to my untrained ears.

What's sparked my interest in adding a subwoofer to my system was stumbling across a copy of Pink Floyd's 'Darkside Of The Moon' and Genesis' 'The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway' recently in 5.1 surround. I was revved up to hear some thundering bass passages. But though my old Klipsch kg4s do an admirable job of reproducing low frequencies for a number of pipe organ albums fairly accurately, that punchy bottom these rock albums put out are sadly fluffy and weak with the volume cranked up.

My budget for adding a subwoofer is no more than $200. At this point I've reviewed a $100 Monoprice sub, then moved on to a Definitive ProSub 800 selling for $110 on Craigslist. I've passed on a very old Martin Logan Dynamo 500 on eBay for $275 I could pick up locally. Then I found a very positive review of the Emotiva Basx S8. Searching reviews of it landed me on this AVS Forum discussion comparing the Emotiva Basx S8 with the JBL Studio 550p. The consensus there seemed to settle on the Studio 550p being the best bang for the bucks. That lead me to a YouTube video that absolutely raved about the quality of the Studio 550p at a ~$200 price tag.

Searching Studio 550p reviews landed me on this Audioholics thread on the Dayton Audio SUB1200 selling for $180 where because of the JBL's massive driver got a lot of praise. Many reviews also tout it's impressive 300 RMS watt amp, and 1 inch thick cabinet wall that all add up to a 50 pound beast.

So at this point that JBL 550p is my 1st choice with the Dayton SUB1200 running in 2nd a bit behind. But I'm still only guessing how they's sound in this small studio apartment.

Since 2012 I've been using a PC I put together with 1/8" 5.1 analog outputs to feed music via Foobar2000 and movies via Potplayer & VLC to a Denon receiver and out to my speakers. I had to update my old Denon lst summer to a new one when it developed a slight hum. Here's my present setup I've cobbled together over the years from thrift stores, yard sales Craigslist and gear I've had for 30-40 years:

• HTPC with a MSI G41M-P28 motherboard running Windows 7.
• Denon AVR-3310CI receiver
• Klipsch kg4 main speakers
• Definitive C1 center speaker
• Realistic Minimus 7 side speakers to sub for the more costly Visonik David 50s

I had to install and set up Peter's Equalizer APO Extension (Peace) Windows software to bring up the highs on the Definitive C1 that was very bottom heavy. I'll probably upgrade that speaker at some point.

So here's what I'd like to get feedback on if folks here have any thoughts.

1. Which do folks think would compliment my system, the JBL Studio 550p or the Dayton Audio SUB1200, or something I haven't looked at yet for under $200. I'm leaning pretty heavily towards the Studio 550p.

2. I use the HTPC for both music and movie playback, and am not sure how I would set up a sub for both. The 550p has both RCA speaker inputs where each can perform as low frequency bass inputs. But unlike the SUB1200, it also has a 1/8" LFE input.

I could run a cable from my Denon AVR-3310CI's SFE RCA jack to the 550p 1/8" LFE input. And run a pair of RCA cables from the Dennon's R/L RCA preamp outs to the 550p's RCA inputs. But I have no idea if that would work. The Denon's manual seems to require a PhD to read and comprehend.

As the SUB1200 lacks an 1/8" LFE input, the only way I can see to get stereo music and 5.1 movie audio input and output functioning would be to run wires from the 'Front B' speaker terminals on the Denon to the SUB1200 speaker inputs, and a cable from the Denon's RCA LFE out to one of the RCA inputs on the SUB1200. I read somewhere that might be complicated to tweak, and I don't know if the Level and Crossover controls on both these subs apply to both a;; RCA, 1/8" min and high power speaker inputs.

Sorry for such a lengthy post. Brevity has never been one of my strong points. Thanks for any feedback on which sub folks think might play with my system best, and what all might be needed for a sub to function well for both stereo music and 5.1 movie audio playback.

PS: I've posted this over in the AVS forums too.

 

[lovinthehd]

With your gear its more just capabilities of each sub, neither of which are particularly great. The JBL sub can be nice combined with their matching speakers as it ca provide a high pass filter for the speakers, but you don't have that need with your avr. I'd just simply look further up the sub ladder generally. If anything, two of the SUB1200 (or SUB1500) can be a good deal, but sometimes the price on the JBL can be quite good....might not dig quite as low, tho.

 

[isolar8001]

Your ultimate goal should be to be thrown against the wall when the bass at the start of "Back In NYC" from The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway hits.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Iirc @panteragstk used to have one in his office. I know he liked, but I also seem to remember he thought it rolled off a little too high. Seems like it’s at about 28hz if memory serves, which it seems to struggle with lately lol. I think these two are probably more similar than different honestly, so maybe get the one that’s less expensive?

 

[Dynatuber]

With your gear its more just capabilities of each sub, neither of which are particularly great. The JBL sub can be nice combined with their matching speakers as it ca provide a high pass filter for the speakers, but you don't have that need with your avr. I'd just simply look further up the sub ladder generally. If anything, two of the SUB1200 (or SUB1500) can be a good deal, but sometimes the price on the JBL can be quite good....might not dig quite as low, tho.

Heh... As the title of this thread suggests, these are already 'up the ladder' for me. I started searching Craigslist for subs and was looking at cheap Polks, Klipschs etc under $100. I thought I was sold on a Definitive ProSub 800 a guy selling for $110. Only reason I didn't pop for it was he wouldn't meet me at his home and wouldn't agree to meeting me somewhere where I could plug it into my old Denon. At that point I searched audiophile forum posts that trashed it and led me to come up to a $200 roof and these two subs.

Your ultimate goal should be to be thrown against the wall when the bass at the start of "Back In NYC" from The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway hits.

YES! That's exactly when either Foobar2000's EQ or my Denon had a total meltdown and normalized the volume down on peaks for most the rest of the track from that point on. I still don't know which was responsible, but I knew right then I needed a dedicated sub.

Iirc @panteragstk used to have one in his office. I know he liked, but I also seem to remember he thought it rolled off a little too high. Seems like it’s at about 28hz if memory serves, which it seems to struggle with lately lol. I think these two are probably more similar than different honestly, so maybe get the one that’s less expensive?

Well with its beefy driver, 1" case walls and 300-watt RMS amp, I'm leaning heavily towards the JBL 550p. It's selling on Amazon for $425 when JBL is selling it on it's website for $210 with free shipping. The $425 price makes me wonder if there might be high demand for them on Amazon influencing the price there. Confusing as it's the JBL store on Amazon that's selling it.

 

[lovinthehd]

Heh... As the title of this thread suggests, these are already 'up the ladder' for me. I started searching Craigslist for subs and was looking at cheap Polks, Klipschs etc under $100. I thought I was sold on a Definitive ProSub 800 a guy selling for $110. Only reason I didn't pop for it was he wouldn't meet me at his home and wouldn't agree to meeting me somewhere where I could plug it into my old Denon. At that point I searched audiophile forum posts that trashed it and led me to come up to a $200 roof and these two subs.


YES! That's exactly when either Foobar2000's EQ or my Denon had a total meltdown and normalized the volume down on peaks for most the rest of the track from that point on. I still don't know which was responsible, but I knew right then I needed a dedicated sub.


Well with its beefy driver, 1" case walls and 300-watt RMS amp, I'm leaning heavily towards the JBL 550p. It's selling on Amazon for $425 when JBL is selling it on it's website for $210 with free shipping. The $425 price makes me wonder if there might be high demand for them on Amazon influencing the price there. Confusing as it's the JBL store on Amazon that's selling it.

They're not far up the ladder from the subs you mention, altho definitely more up the ladder than the ProSub800 (or most Def Tec subs).

 

[Trebdp83]

I have two of the SB1200 subs that were purchased when they were thirty bucks cheaper. No frills for sure but also not boomy like some cheap subs. They are a bit too quick to go into auto standby mode. I leave em’ on. You simply connect a cable from the receiver’s sub pre out to the R(mono) input port on the SB1200. They were a bargain hunting experiment that worked out. Results will vary of course.

 

[panteragstk]

Iirc @panteragstk used to have one in his office. I know he liked, but I also seem to remember he thought it rolled off a little too high. Seems like it’s at about 28hz if memory serves, which it seems to struggle with lately lol. I think these two are probably more similar than different honestly, so maybe get the one that’s less expensive?

I'm still using it, but it does roll off a bit high. I still get a decent amount of LFE just because I have such a small space for it and also have 4 towers picking up a lot of the bass duties too.

I do plan to replace it with a BIC PL-300 since that'll be a pretty awesome upgrade for my office.

The crazy thing to me is my JBP 550 and the PL-300 have a similar MSRP, but don't come close to being in the same ballpark performance wise.

I only paid $190 or so for the JBL, so at that price point it's a great sub.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

I'm still using it, but it does roll off a bit high. I still get a decent amount of LFE just because I have such a small space for it and also have 4 towers picking up a lot of the bass duties too.

I do plan to replace it with a BIC PL-300 since that'll be a pretty awesome upgrade for my office.

The crazy thing to me is my JBP 550 and the PL-300 have a similar MSRP, but don't come close to being in the same ballpark performance wise.

I only paid $190 or so for the JBL, so at that price point it's a great sub.

I was thinking of the BIC when I saw this thread, but unfortunately the budget seems to have a hard ceiling of 200 bucks. The BIC is priced in the ballpark of the speedwoofer10s. Can’t remember clearly, but I think shady has them both in the under 500 sub list. I’d probably choose the rsl personally, but that’s mainly because of my great experiences with Joe, and that I love c34e’s. In any case, the BIC will be a nice upgrade for you. Might even have a customer for your ol JBL? Lol
Fun side road… was on vacation few weeks ago, and threw Pantera on my Spotify. What a great band. Miss those Abbot boys. The “reunion” footage I’ve seen has been awesome. I think Charlie and Zakk are doing justice, and Phil hasn’t sounded this good in a loooong time. Another fun side road, I was offered a job playing drums in a Pantera tribute band a while back. Should’ve done it…

 

[panteragstk]

I was thinking of the BIC when I saw this thread, but unfortunately the budget seems to have a hard ceiling of 200 bucks. The BIC is priced in the ballpark of the speedwoofer10s. Can’t remember clearly, but I think shady has them both in the under 500 sub list. I’d probably choose the rsl personally, but that’s mainly because of my great experiences with Joe, and that I love c34e’s. In any case, the BIC will be a nice upgrade for you. Might even have a customer for your ol JBL? Lol
Fun side road… was on vacation few weeks ago, and threw Pantera on my Spotify. What a great band. Miss those Abbot boys. The “reunion” footage I’ve seen has been awesome. I think Charlie and Zakk are doing justice, and Phil hasn’t sounded this good in a loooong time. Another fun side road, I was offered a job playing drums in a Pantera tribute band a while back. Should’ve done it…

Yeah you should have.

Me and a buddy are going to see Pantera and Metallica in Dallas this August. Should be awesome.

I looked at the 10s, but ultimately settled on the BIC just because of the fact that it can dig really deep for what it is. I think it will work great to fill up my room. Only downside I've found at this point is I'll have to figure out a way for my PC system to plug into it since the JBL has two inputs and the BIC doesn't.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Yeah you should have.

Me and a buddy are going to see Pantera and Metallica in Dallas this August. Should be awesome.

I looked at the 10s, but ultimately settled on the BIC just because of the fact that it can dig really deep for what it is. I think it will work great to fill up my room. Only downside I've found at this point is I'll have to figure out a way for my PC system to plug into it since the JBL has two inputs and the BIC doesn't.

I think I’m going with my son for Metallica and pantera here too

How about a 1/8” to rca?

 

[panteragstk]

I think I’m going with my son for Metallica and pantera here too

How about a 1/8” to rca?

Nah. That's not the issue. I've got adapters galore. The issue is this.

The JBL has stereo inputs and I'm using one for the LFE from my AVR, the other is coming from my DAC attached to my PC.

The BIC looks like this, so my options would be limited.

 

[ryanosaur]

FWIW, Brent Butterworth gave some pretty good praise to the Sub1200 in a review from a few years back. Compared to the 1500, he claimed you just don't get that much more in performance with the step up in size.
As for best budget Subs?
...
That's been covered before.

If I was looking for good quality Subs, I would probably lean Dayton Sub1200, but also look at what BIC is offering.

There is also a very strong case to be made for saving up a few hundred more and going for just a better overall Sub, which can be had from many companies. So much just depends on use case.

FWIW, it looks like BB refreshed his article and is now liking a Monoprice option... with the Sub1200 as the runner up:

The Best Subwoofer

For powerful, precise bass in stereo and home theater systems, the best subwoofer is the compact, affordable Rogersound Labs Speedwoofer 10S MKII.

www.nytimes.com

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Nah. That's not the issue. I've got adapters galore. The issue is this.

The JBL has stereo inputs and I'm using one for the LFE from my AVR, the other is coming from my DAC attached to my PC.

The BIC looks like this, so my options would be limited.

Roger that!

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

FWIW, Brent Butterworth gave some pretty good praise to the Sub1200 in a review from a few years back. Compared to the 1500, he claimed you just don't get that much more in performance with the step up in size.
As for best budget Subs?
...
That's been covered before.

If I was looking for good quality Subs, I would probably lean Dayton Sub1200, but also look at what BIC is offering.

There is also a very strong case to be made for saving up a few hundred more and going for just a better overall Sub, which can be had from many companies. So much just depends on use case.

FWIW, it looks like BB refreshed his article and is now liking a Monoprice option... with the Sub1200 as the runner up:

The Best Subwoofer

For powerful, precise bass in stereo and home theater systems, the best subwoofer is the compact, affordable Rogersound Labs Speedwoofer 10S MKII.

www.nytimes.com

I also recall that the sub1200 was a much better value than the 1500. Agree, use case is a big deal and everyone’s is different. I also think the save up option is good. But with a 200 dollar budget, I feel like that could take a while. Maybe not too, but yikes, NO sub… couldn’t do that!

 

[lovinthehd]

I seem to remember when the SUB1200 and 1500 were much closer in price. I was trying to think of the Monoprice sub Brent Butterworth last praised....thanks for that so I didn't have to look it up. $230 at Monoprice but out of stock....

 

[Dynatuber]

Nah. That's not the issue. I've got adapters galore. The issue is this.

The JBL has stereo inputs and I'm using one for the LFE from my AVR, the other is coming from my DAC attached to my PC.
<->
The BIC looks like this, so my options would be limited.
<->

@panteragstk So you're feeding surround audio to 1 RCA input on the JBL from your AVR when you're playing content via the AVR, and alternately feeding surround audio to the 2nd RCA on the JBL from your PC via a DAC when you play content from the PC. Right? Obviously not simultaneously. You' don't mention stereo music playback.

I'm struggling to figure out if this or any sub can be configured to deal with playing both a stereo signal from my AVR when I play music fed from my HTPC, and alternately a 5.1 signal also from my HTPC when I play videos with 5.1 audio content. My HTPC outputs 6 discreet channels to 6 discreet inputs on my AVR. I'll be able to pass the lows to the JBL via a single LFE RCA cable from the AVR. But then playing stereo will only involve the 2 front speakers wired to my AVR with no support from the sub. I'm toying with the idea of finding or making a switch to toggle the 2 RCA inputs on the sub between stereo preamp outs on the AVR, and the AVR's LFE jack. Have you, of has anyone here dealt with setting a sub up for dual-use HT & stereo audio playback?

I also notice you have a different 550p than most I've seen currently available. A Studio 550p. Your photo of the back panel is different from the current 550ps labeled Sub 550p I see out there pictured in my 1st post. I was under the impression that JBL just changed the name. But the 2 pictures seem to indicate there are, or were 2 different models of the 550p. Do you know what's up there?

 

[shadyJ]

I would probably swing for the JBL sub, if only for build quality. No one is going to be able to determine performance differences without extensive measurements of both subs, so everything else is speculation. But the JBL will probably be built on a higher level than the Dayton sub.

 

[Trebdp83]

@panteragstk So you're feeding surround audio to 1 RCA input on the JBL from your AVR when you're playing content via the AVR, and alternately feeding surround audio to the 2nd RCA on the JBL from your PC via a DAC when you play content from the PC. Right? Obviously not simultaneously. You' don't mention stereo music playback.

I'm struggling to figure out if this or any sub can be configured to deal with playing both a stereo signal from my AVR when I play music fed from my HTPC, and alternately a 5.1 signal also from my HTPC when I play videos with 5.1 audio content. My HTPC outputs 6 discreet channels to 6 discreet inputs on my AVR. I'll be able to pass the lows to the JBL via a single LFE RCA cable from the AVR. But then playing stereo will only involve the 2 front speakers wired to my AVR with no support from the sub. I'm toying with the idea of finding or making a switch to toggle the 2 RCA inputs on the sub between stereo preamp outs on the AVR, and the AVR's LFE jack. Have you, of has anyone here dealt with setting a sub up for dual-use HT & stereo audio playback?

I also notice you have a different 550p than most I've seen currently available. A Studio 550p. Your photo of the back panel is different from the current 550ps labeled Sub 550p I see out there pictured in my 1st post. I was under the impression that JBL just changed the name. But the 2 pictures seem to indicate there are, or were 2 different models of the 550p. Do you know what's up there?

Using the EXT. IN analog ports on the Denon does limit things to same in, same out with no audio processing at all. Have you looked into adding an S/PDIF port to the PC for digital output to the Denon so you can use bass management for two channel signals?

The cables for the new port would connect to your motherboard’s JSP1 connector. Then, you can bitstream digital audio and benefit from the Denon’s processing of digital signals and will only need the SW PRE OUT to the subwoofer of your choice.

 

[Dynatuber]

Using the EXT. IN analog ports on the Denon does limit things to same in, same out with no audio processing at all. Have you looked into adding an S/PDIF port to the PC for digital output to the Denon so you can use bass management for two channel signals?

The cables for the new port would connect to your motherboard’s JSP1 connector. Then, you can bitstream digital audio and benefit from the Denon’s processing of digital signals and will only need the SW PRE OUT to the subwoofer of your choice.
View attachment 61246View attachment 61249View attachment 61247

Wow. Thanks for looking up all that for me @Trebdp83. I did in fact get one of those small S/PDIF cards for the MSI a number of years back. But try as I might, I was never able to get it working. That was suggested over on the AVS forums the other day so I've been trying to find where I put it. I can't remember what the issues were, drivers maybe. But since then I've set up optical cables a couple times between my HDTV & STB to the Denon. I'll have another go at that S/PDIF card if I can track it down. You nailed my MB and the jumper locations. Maybe I'll order another if I can locate my old one and still can't get it working. They're only $10 - $15.

Looking through the Denon's manual I found this entry on p35 that sounds like it'd do what I'm after unless it doesn't apply to the EXT. IN analog ports.

There's also a 'Manual EQ' on the Denon described on p74 of the manual that it seems I actually got to boost the highs to my very bottom heavy Definitive center speaker. So I wonder if I'm really just limited to sam in, same out here. More to explore. Thanks for your input,