Advice on SVS or Arendal

[JTongret]

I need some advice and or opinions on a pair of subwoofers I'm prepared to purchase very soon. My current room is only 16' x 13' x 8'. Fairly small, but we're house shopping and I most certainly will be in a larger room. My current setup is a 2 channel system in the living room that gets used for music and TV/movies. My speakers are a pair of Arendal Sound 1723 Monitor which I absolutely LOVE after being on the hifi merry-go-round for a few years! I'm coming from a pair of SVS SB-3000's that I've had for the past 2.5 years and I liked quite a bit, but I recently sold in order to move to a pair of ported subs with more slam, impact, presence or whatever term fits best here. I listen to a lot of hip-hop, rap, electronic music with big bass and I think ported would do better here, as well as with movies. I initially planned to go with the PB-3000's because I like SVS as a company and feel good about their warranty and support and I really like the app. The 3 band peq allowed me to get a pretty good response using REW and the Umik 1. Then I started looking at the Arendal 1723 Subwoofer 1V because they look so much nicer than the SVS and of course perfectly match my speakers. The only drawback being they cost a little more and it looks like the SVS have better performance when looking at the numbers from the reviews. I don't want to place too much on the numbers alone, but I don't know how much that'll translate to actual usage? The only other subwoofer I have owned besides the SB-3000's is an RSL Speedwoofer 10S, so I just don't have much experience with different subs in my home. I see the Monolith 13/15 and they have beautiful flat measurements and even the compression tests have much nicer shaping to them compared to both the SVS and Arendal, but I'd need a minidsp, they're huge/heavy in comparison, I wouldn't have the same level of confidence in the warranty/support and I've read a lot about them having lower gain than others and users having trouble because of that. Anyhow, I'd love to hear from anyone who can offer any solid advice or input. Thanks in advance guys!

 

[shadyJ]

I would say you are reading the situation correctly. The SVS subs do offer a bit more performance for the dollar, but the Arendals have better build quality and look nicer. The Monoprice subs have more performance for the dollar, and the build quality is also very good, but, as you say, the customer service is geared more like a large vendor than the personalized service you get with these dedicated manufacturers. You might also consider Hsu Research, their 15" subs are very good bang for the buck.

 

[JTongret]

I would say you are reading the situation correctly. The SVS subs do offer a bit more performance for the dollar, but the Arendals have better build quality and look nicer. The Monoprice subs have more performance for the dollar, and the build quality is also very good, but, as you say, the customer service is geared more like a large vendor than the personalized service you get with these dedicated manufacturers. You might also consider Hsu Research, their 15" subs are very good bang for the buck.

First and foremost, I'm actually a fan of yours @shadyJ ! I stay away from interacting on most audio forums for obvious reasons. I do read several sites, but your reviews are by far the most informative, accurate and helpful of anyone else in the industry! You follow a consistent format that makes them easy to digest, and you backup your statements with objective data coupled with easy to understand explanations. I just wanted to take the opportunity to show you some appreciation for your work and I'd love to send you a $20 as a thank you if you can give me a PayPal email to send it to? With my fanboying out of the way I'll move on...

I've considered HSU along with most of the usual suspects. To summarize:

HSU - I like the ULS 15 mkii and may buy a pair for my second system, but for this one I want ported. The VTF 15H mkii is just not my cup of tea. The black satin paint looks much better than the black oak of SVS but I don't like the look of the triangle ports at all!

Monoprice - I'm not opposed to giving up the convenience of having an app and buying a Minidsp, but any model above the 12 v2 is just too big and heavy IMO! I'm only 41 and plenty strong enough to move them, it's just a PITA to deal with. The 12 v2 seems to be a better performer than the 1723 1V according to CEA 2010 but again, I don't want to put too much importance into that? Maybe I should just get a pair of those and save HALF of what I'd spend on the 1V's? The SVS don't look any better than the Monolith imo anyhow.

PSA - I live in NE Ohio only an hour from them and a few people have urged me to call Tom and make arrangements to go in and demo their models. I've been told he may give discounts for not having to ship them, etc, etc. Unfortunately I don't think I'd feel confident in making a purchase without the third party measurements. I've skimmed through threads where I've read a few reasons why he hasn't gone that route, but with all of the measured and proven options available today I prefer to go with something I can be certain about.

Rythmik - I like that they are one of the few with nice satin and gloss white finishes! The FV15HP seems to be a nice option, but there isn't a lot of recent data out there on it. Also, all of the options and controls on their plate amps is a bit of a turnoff to me. I'd just want to use a Minidsp in that case and it would all seem pretty unnecessary.

So I guess what I'm asking is are these performance differences between the 1723 1V and PB-3000 large enough to be a massive difference in normal usage with actual music and TV content? I do like to listen to my music loud at times, up to 95db I'd say. Also, with the Monolith subs appearing to have a flatter shape with higher amplitude(or compression tests?) compared to Arendal/SVS, does this make for higher fidelity or significantly better performance? I'd like to keep this under $4k and I know I'm probably focusing too much on small details.

 

[lovinthehd]

Just a note on the Hsu, the VTF-3 mk5 is very similar to the VTF-15H mk2, and doesn't have the triangle ports and the grill covers driver/ports anyways. How pretty it is otherwise have no idea

 

[shadyJ]

First and foremost, I'm actually a fan of yours @shadyJ ! I stay away from interacting on most audio forums for obvious reasons. I do read several sites, but your reviews are by far the most informative, accurate and helpful of anyone else in the industry! You follow a consistent format that makes them easy to digest, and you backup your statements with objective data coupled with easy to understand explanations. I just wanted to take the opportunity to show you some appreciation for your work and I'd love to send you a $20 as a thank you if you can give me a PayPal email to send it to? With my fanboying out of the way I'll move on...

I've considered HSU along with most of the usual suspects. To summarize:

HSU - I like the ULS 15 mkii and may buy a pair for my second system, but for this one I want ported. The VTF 15H mkii is just not my cup of tea. The black satin paint looks much better than the black oak of SVS but I don't like the look of the triangle ports at all!

Monoprice - I'm not opposed to giving up the convenience of having an app and buying a Minidsp, but any model above the 12 v2 is just too big and heavy IMO! I'm only 41 and plenty strong enough to move them, it's just a PITA to deal with. The 12 v2 seems to be a better performer than the 1723 1V according to CEA 2010 but again, I don't want to put too much importance into that? Maybe I should just get a pair of those and save HALF of what I'd spend on the 1V's? The SVS don't look any better than the Monolith imo anyhow.

PSA - I live in NE Ohio only an hour from them and a few people have urged me to call Tom and make arrangements to go in and demo their models. I've been told he may give discounts for not having to ship them, etc, etc. Unfortunately I don't think I'd feel confident in making a purchase without the third party measurements. I've skimmed through threads where I've read a few reasons why he hasn't gone that route, but with all of the measured and proven options available today I prefer to go with something I can be certain about.

Rythmik - I like that they are one of the few with nice satin and gloss white finishes! The FV15HP seems to be a nice option, but there isn't a lot of recent data out there on it. Also, all of the options and controls on their plate amps is a bit of a turnoff to me. I'd just want to use a Minidsp in that case and it would all seem pretty unnecessary.

So I guess what I'm asking is are these performance differences between the 1723 1V and PB-3000 large enough to be a massive difference in normal usage with actual music and TV content? I do like to listen to my music loud at times, up to 95db I'd say. Also, with the Monolith subs appearing to have a flatter shape with higher amplitude(or compression tests?) compared to Arendal/SVS, does this make for higher fidelity or significantly better performance? I'd like to keep this under $4k and I know I'm probably focusing too much on small details.

Thanks for the compliments! And no need for a tip, but thank you anyway.

The triangle ports don't personally bother me so much, but it is a bit unusual, so I can see your objection. Still, such a good subwoofer. The triangular port design shape is a clever move. One of my own subs is a VTF-15h mk2.

Having dealt with the weight of the Monoprice Monolith 15", I can definitely see not wanting to deal with that kind of weight. Even their 12" is no picnic. Make sure you get a friend to help you with any of those large ported subs! If you have to move them through stair cases, make sure to use something like a shoulder dolly. The only subs in this class that I would be willing to lift without help is the sealed ones, but even then there are exceptions like the 1723 S2 or SVS SB16-Ultra.

I would say that the Monoprice 12" and the Arendal 1723 1V are somewhat close in raw output, with having advantages in certain areas. The extra cabinet size of the Monolith 12" does allow it a bit more deep bass output. By the way, there will be a full review of the 1723 1V and 1S in the near future. It is completed and just awaiting publishing.

As for PSA, I would imagine that they are pretty good performers overall, but if the looks of the VTF-15h mk2 is off-putting, I don't know how any of the PSA subs would get a pass. They are also bound to be very heavy.

Regarding Rythmik, there is a wealth of data on the FV15HP, and it is a good performer, but would also be very heavy. Unless it has somehow become worse over the years, I would still consider it a good value for performance. As for the settings, that would be pretty easy to deal with. Just leave the PEQ off, set the phase to 0ms, crossover to 120Hz, Level to whatever is easiest for the room correction to work with (probably between 9 to 12'o'clock on the dial). Set the Extension filter to 14Hz and Damping to low, and set the Rumble filter to off and Lin-in Low-pass to 'AVR/12.' Make sure to use the LFE inputs, not the line-in inputs. You are set after that.

Regarding noticeable performance differences between the 1723 iV and the PB-3000, I think that you would see a difference if cranked to a higher enough volume. The PB-3000 will have more low end grunt and mid-bass punch. Not a gigantic difference, but it will be noticeable.

 

[JTongret]

Thanks for the compliments! And no need for a tip, but thank you anyway.

The triangle ports don't personally bother me so much, but it is a bit unusual, so I can see your objection. Still, such a good subwoofer. The triangular port design shape is a clever move. One of my own subs is a VTF-15h mk2.

Having dealt with the weight of the Monoprice Monolith 15", I can definitely see not wanting to deal with that kind of weight. Even their 12" is no picnic. Make sure you get a friend to help you with any of those large ported subs! If you have to move them through stair cases, make sure to use something like a shoulder dolly. The only subs in this class that I would be willing to lift without help is the sealed ones, but even then there are exceptions like the 1723 S2 or SVS SB16-Ultra.

I would say that the Monoprice 12" and the Arendal 1723 1V are somewhat close in raw output, with having advantages in certain areas. The extra cabinet size of the Monolith 12" does allow it a bit more deep bass output. By the way, there will be a full review of the 1723 1V and 1S in the near future. It is completed and just awaiting publishing.

As for PSA, I would imagine that they are pretty good performers overall, but if the looks of the VTF-15h mk2 is off-putting, I don't know how any of the PSA subs would get a pass. They are also bound to be very heavy.

Regarding Rythmik, there is a wealth of data on the FV15HP, and it is a good performer, but would also be very heavy. Unless it has somehow become worse over the years, I would still consider it a good value for performance. As for the settings, that would be pretty easy to deal with. Just leave the PEQ off, set the phase to 0ms, crossover to 120Hz, Level to whatever is easiest for the room correction to work with (probably between 9 to 12'o'clock on the dial). Set the Extension filter to 14Hz and Damping to low, and set the Rumble filter to off and Lin-in Low-pass to 'AVR/12.' Make sure to use the LFE inputs, not the line-in inputs. You are set after that.

Regarding noticeable performance differences between the 1723 iV and the PB-3000, I think that you would see a difference if cranked to a higher enough volume. The PB-3000 will have more low end grunt and mid-bass punch. Not a gigantic difference, but it will be noticeable.

You're the man James and thank you! You've given the insight I was looking for!

 

[Danzilla31]

You're the man James and thank you! You've given the insight I was looking for!

Hey @shadyJ is giving you all the great advice I'd just like to add in they're what's your room size? In a mid to regular sized room like most of us have every sub is going to get a huge gain from they're test numbers due to gain from the rooms boundaries. A lot.

What I'm getting at is these subs with the room gain we get become closer in performance usually then people realize. That's where output becomes less of a selling point and factors such as aesthetics, linearity and flat frequency response, warranty, customer service and other factors come into play when purchasing.

I bet the Arendal subs would work perfect in your room if we knew the size. Although it's nice to get great response down to 16 hz the vast amount of content in movies and or music is 25hz or above.

Good luck with your choices!

 

[JTongret]

Hey @shadyJ is giving you all the great advice I'd just like to add in they're what's your room size? In a mid to regular sized room like most of us have every sub is going to get a huge gain from they're test numbers due to gain from the rooms boundaries. A lot.

What I'm getting at is these subs with the room gain we get become closer in performance usually then people realize. That's where output becomes less of a selling point and factors such as aesthetics, linearity and flat frequency response, warranty, customer service and other factors come into play when purchasing.

I bet the Arendal subs would work perfect in your room if we knew the size. Although it's nice to get great response down to 16 hz the vast amount of content in movies and or music is 25hz or above.

Good luck with your choices!

My current room is only 16' x 13' x 8'. Fairly small, but we're house shopping and I most certainly will be in a larger room

 

[Danzilla31]

You're the man James and thank you! You've given the insight I was looking for!

Snap just saw your room size in your first post duh! Lol. In that room size you literally cannot go wrong with your pick. So many options will work. It will be less about what sub you picked and more about making sure your placement and setup is optimal in that room size to get its best performance. Excited for what you choose you'll have to tell us when you make your pick!

 

[JTongret]

Snap just saw your room size in your first post duh! Lol. In that room size you literally cannot go wrong with your pick. So many options will work. It will be less about what sub you picked and more about making sure your placement and setup is optimal in that room size to get its best performance. Excited for what you choose you'll have to tell us when you make your pick!

I definitely will! Thanks for your advice man, I appreciate all the input.

 

[Danzilla31]

My current room is only 16' x 13' x 8'. Fairly small, but we're house shopping and I most certainly will be in a larger room

Okay so you want subs that will eventually be placed in a larger room oh that changes things I'll jump back in here in a bit gotta get my day started but this'll he fun helping you get what you want but keeping it within your budget!

 

[Danzilla31]

I definitely will! Thanks for your advice man, I appreciate all the input.

Hey best of luck on your guys buying the new house and congratulations!

 

[Dinger928]

I would say that the Monoprice 12" and the Arendal 1723 1V are somewhat close in raw output, with having advantages in certain areas. The extra cabinet size of the Monolith 12" does allow it a bit more deep bass output. By the way, there will be a full review of the 1723 1V and 1S in the near future. It is completed and just awaiting publishing.

@shadyJ Does this upcoming review also throw a comparison to the 1961 1S and 1V that you had previously done? I know I can't be the only one that would like to read/see the comparisons between the two lineups. I see many people opting for the 1723 1S when it at least looks like the 1961 1S sort of outperforms it if I am looking at the numbers correctly.

Thanks for the good reads.....

 

[shadyJ]

@shadyJ Does this upcoming review also throw a comparison to the 1961 1S and 1V that you had previously done? I know I can't be the only one that would like to read/see the comparisons between the two lineups. I see many people opting for the 1723 1S when it at least looks like the 1961 1S sort of outperforms it if I am looking at the numbers correctly.

Thanks for the good reads.....

I don't compare them directly in the review, but you can compare them using the graphs and measurements I made. Yes, the 1723 1S does outperform the 1961 1S, but that is what would be expected since the 1723 is much more expensive.

 

[Prolix]

By the way, there will be a full review of the 1723 1V and 1S in the near future. It is completed and just awaiting publishing.

Christmas miracle?

 

[JTongret]

.I would say that the Monoprice 12" and the Arendal 1723 1V are somewhat close in raw output, with having advantages in certain areas. The extra cabinet size of the Monolith 12" does allow it a bit more deep bass output. By the way, there will be a full review of the 1723 1V and 1S in the near future. It is completed and just awaiting publishing.

Hey James, do you have any new information on when your 1723 1S/1V review may be published? I'm really looking forward to this one!

 

[shadyJ]

Hey James, do you have any new information on when your 1723 1S/1V review may be published? I'm really looking forward to this one!

I don't know, sorry. It may be a little while since we have just published a sub review.

 

[Dinger928]

Still waiting on this review. My time with the 1961's are approaching decision time!

 

[shadyJ]

Still waiting on this review. My time with the 1961's are approaching decision time!

Since we just published a review for an Arendal product, it will probably be awhile before we publish another one, so if there is something you want to know specifically about the subs, send a PM to me and maybe I can tell you something useful.

 

[nigio]

@shadyJ Which one would you choose between SB3000 vs 1723 1s? Here in Greece they are priced similarly. It would be useful to mention the differences between them and in which aspects is the one better than the other.

Thanks a lot in advance.