Yamaha AVENTAGE 2021 AV Receivers Bulk Up on Power and 8K Features

[chapp]

The distance that the AVR measures with the speaker is acoustic distance depending on the room the actual speakers are located and not the physical distance (how far the tape measure shows).

To all that are trying to correct their rooms through YPAO, REW and other stuff have you check this guy's post here?

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He has a very nice manual on YPAO (YPAO – The Lost Manual!). He claims that YPAO with a cheap USB sound card and a laptop/PC running REW software is sufficient to make your room corrections.

I have been running my YPAO RSC setup similar to this guy's guide and it has been working good for me so far. Of course, everything needs some tweaking to ones own taste.

 

[Replicant 7]

I have a question about stereo listening. Straight or 2CH Stereo? Extra bass or not ?
Until now I use straight with extra bass (front speakers set to large and I don’t have any subwoofer). But with a sub I wonder if I should go for 2CH stereo to get some LFE output). On older Yamaha amps it seems 2CH Stereo doesn’t output through LFE so I wonder if with a 2CH input Straight and 2CH are the same.

Looking into my crystal ball, I see a nice Sub in your very near future. Lol. Try them both out, straight and 2. Channel Stereo, use the settings You like for Your speakers and room. I'm almost sure not all settings will work or sound the best in everyone's setup.

 

[VASKION]

I have been running my YPAO RSC setup similar to this guy's guide and it has been working good for me so far. Of course, everything needs some tweaking to ones own taste.

As you already said several times - we better use our ears to tweak the EQ to our taste. I just played around with my old Yamaha AVR and run again the YPAO measurement (it is kind of ancient receiver and supports only 1 measurement). Then I switch from PEQ to GEQ. Oh boy, what a difference! The speakers sound like they are unleashed and can punch as loud, airy and free as they can. The setting of the GEQ are all flat - so no difference between EQ off and GEQ on.

So in the end, I guess it is convenient to use YPAO to make the measurements on the speakers like distance and adjust speakers' level but then we are on our own to tweak the whole setup to whatever we like best. I can only imagine how much tweaking options you all get with the new Aventage series discussed here. Can't wait to try one of these!

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

With Room EQ, including Audyssey, to get decent results you need to following instructions to the letter with some minor exceptions. For example, when setting up the sub when it tests the level, you will be instructed to get it in the green zone but experience shows that it is better to let it go over the red a little.

Also, for subwoofer distance, it is advisable to let Audyssey take care of it than to use the measuring tape. Distance is sort of a misnomer in this case because it is the delay that matters and the delay is typically affected by the DSP build in active subwoofers. Audyssey is by no means perfect, far from it, but you should be able to get very good results if you limit the EQ range to 20-300 Hz.

Regarding its power output vs the A8A, you need to rely on bench measurements, otherwise it is very difficult to compare just "going by ears", and/or the volume settings.

Audiovision.de (German) tested on and the results appear to be very similar, almost identical:

Denon AVC-8500H (Test) – audiovision
Yamaha RX-A8A (Test) – audiovision

Interesting how both the X8500 and RX-A8 have the same 260W x 2Ch into 4 ohms as the Yamaha RX-A2080.

 

[Replicant 7]

Interesting how both the X8500 and RX-A8 have the same 260W x 2Ch into 4 ohms as the Yamaha RX-A2080.

Yeah, I looked those links PENG posted up, both unit's are beasts!!

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Yeah, I looked those links PENG posted up, both unit's are beasts!!

Yep, 260W x 2Ch 4 ohms (RX-A2080, RX-A8, X8500) is beast-status.

Of course, my RX-A3080 is 294W x 2Ch 4 ohms.

 

[Replicant 7]

Yep, 260W x 2Ch 4 ohms (RX-A2080, RX-A8, X8500) is beast-status.

Of course, my RX-A3080 is 294W x 2Ch 4 ohms.

According to those tests on that link A8A has a bigger power supply, says it puts out more in 5 channels. Unless I missed something.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

According to those tests on that link A8A has a bigger power supply, says it puts out more in 5 channels. Unless I missed something.

Oh, don't get PENG started!

I think 146W x 5Ch (A8) vs 131W x 5Ch (X8500) and 118W x 7Ch (A8) vs 131W x 7Ch (X8500) are similar enough.

The main thing is the 2Ch power output since in the real world, we won't be seeing that ALL CHANNEL DRIVEN TORTURE.

Now I'm wondering how the $2,200 A6 will do in 2Ch/4 ohms since the $1,600 RX-A2080 can do 260W x 2Ch-4 ohms like the $4,500 X8500 and $3,000 RX-A8.

 

[JNMNL52]

What you’re looking for is:
REW. Freeware to measure the in room response of your system.
Umik. A calibrated microphone that is used to measure said in room response.
Minidsp: to implement EQ filters to smooth in room response.
This IS in addition to ypao and Audyssey to further do what they won’t on their own. Imo, ypao is not as effective as Audyssey, but keep in mind, neither are perfect.
There are two schools of thought.
One is, use REW/minidsp first, and Audi/ypao has less to do. Or vice versa and
Audyssey/ypao does the the heavy lifting, and then rew/minidsp finishes with light touches.

The rules are usually…
Placement and positional EQ are first.
Then room treatments, and then EQ such as Audyssey/ypao/manual EQ etc.

Thank you so much! This is the solution I have been seeking to mitigate any potential YPAO issues with purchasing an RX-A8A. I just googled REW, umik and miniDSP/HD, and I have a basic understanding how they relate and work. I can read and follow directions, so I am willing to give it a shot. I was concerned about purchasing a $3,000 high quality AVR that has the potential to sound like crap after set-up. If I do not like how the new YPAO system performs, I can use REW w/ miniDSP tools to adjust if necessary. Altogether this additional equipment is another $450+ but I am willing to make that investment if I can get the room correction right. It is unsatisfactory to me that Yamaha can't figure this out on their own and make room correction simpler considering the retail cost of their RX-A8A. I am not the only prospective buyer that has issues with the YPAO system and they are losing market share because of this very reason. As long as there is a proven work-around I could be pushed over the edge and place a pre-order as I truly believe, excepting YPAO, RX-A8A is superior to the Denon X6700H.

 

[Majorusa]

The pop is intermittent. I am trying to localize it by doing some more tests which is going to take some time and may cause me to pull out my remaining hair.

I heard the pop when changing from youtube app to TV. It was in the left surround speaker first then later, in the same circumstances, in the right speaker. It's completely random.

 

[Replicant 7]

I heard the pop when changing from youtube app to TV. It was in the left surround speaker first then later, in the same circumstances, in the right speaker. It's completely random.

I had that happen with my A1080, random pop sound, it was caused by a ARC (CEC) issue when switching sources. My tv at that time was a Vizio, which I sold off. Thing was buggy, always had to reset something on it, it didn't play well with my AVR at the time

 

[VASKION]

Thank you so much! This is the solution I have been seeking to mitigate any potential YPAO issues with purchasing an RX-A8A. I just googled REW, umik and miniDSP/HD, and I have a basic understanding how they relate and work. I can read and follow directions, so I am willing to give it a shot. I was concerned about purchasing a $3,000 high quality AVR that has the potential to sound like crap after set-up. If I do not like how the new YPAO system performs, I can use REW w/ miniDSP tools to adjust if necessary. Altogether this additional equipment is another $450+ but I am willing to make that investment if I can get the room correction right. It is unsatisfactory to me that Yamaha can't figure this out on their own and make room correction simpler considering the retail cost of their RX-A8A. I am not the only prospective buyer that has issues with the YPAO system and they are losing market share because of this very reason. As long as there is a proven work-around I could be pushed over the edge and place a pre-order as I truly believe, excepting YPAO, RX-A8A is superior to the Denon X6700H.

That's why I posted above that you can use the YPAO mic (that will come with the receiver) through a cheap sound card like Creative for $20 and use the REW software for starter. If you like the result then you can invest in some more expensive gear to tweak the setup even better.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Then I switch from PEQ to GEQ.

You mean you switched from Auto-EQ (YPAO) to Manual-EQ (PEQ)?

PEQ is more advanced than GEQ. Most people would use PEQ, instead of QEQ.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Thank you so much! This is the solution I have been seeking to mitigate any potential YPAO issues with purchasing an RX-A8A. I just googled REW, umik and miniDSP/HD, and I have a basic understanding how they relate and work. I can read and follow directions, so I am willing to give it a shot. I was concerned about purchasing a $3,000 high quality AVR that has the potential to sound like crap after set-up. If I do not like how the new YPAO system performs, I can use REW w/ miniDSP tools to adjust if necessary. Altogether this additional equipment is another $450...

You could just get the $100 UMIK-1 and use the Yamaha Manual PEQ to EQ the Bass region below 200Hz. Only add the additional miniDSP if the Manual Parametric EQ doesn't get you the bass you want.

 

[VASKION]

You mean you switched from Auto-EQ (YPAO) to Manual-EQ (PEQ)?

PEQ is more advanced than GEQ. Most people would use PEQ, instead of QEQ.

Yes, I agree. Mine PEQ is only Auto and does not have any settings - either use it as it is or not. That's why I tried to switch to the other (GEQ) because there are some frequencies to tweak. But I liked a lot what I heard when it is flat so left it this way for now...

 

[Padinn]

I noticed a couple brief pops switching sources through eARC yesterday. Seems random and eARC related.

 

[JNMNL52]

You could just get the $100 UMIK-1 and use the Yamaha Manual PEQ to EQ the Bass region below 200Hz. Only add the additional miniDSP if the Manual Parametric EQ doesn't get you the bass you want.

Thanks; makes sense to take small steps and see what i get before making any additional investment. I am just glad to see a method to refine YPAO. This has been holding me back from a pre-order.

 

[OldAndSlowDev]

Found ONE Black Friday interesting deal : Bosch laser distance computing device for 39cad. I will follow Gene advice to get perfect speaker distances.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Thanks; makes sense to take small steps and see what i get before making any additional investment. I am just glad to see a method to refine YPAO. This has been holding me back from a pre-order.

I used my UMIK-1 a few times since it seems like "everyone" has one, like everyone has a SPL meter.

But then I put the UMIK-1 away and never used it again.

I guess it's a good "exercise" to scratch that curiosity itch. But in retrospect, I really didn't even need it to make my bass sound great.

Before you even order the UMIK-1, you could just play around with the manual PEQ for your subs. For example, change the 40Hz, 60Hz, 80Hz, and 100Hz to +3.0dB and set Q=0.5 for each. If that sounds like the best bass you've heard in your life compared to the other great bass you've heard, especially from expensive speakers and subs, do you even want to spend hours on REW and the $100 UMIK-1?

Here's one interesting fact - just because your Bass Frequency Response is FLAT, does not mean you will like the sound of your bass. You just don't want a huge DIP in the bass, which means you won't get that awesome impactful powerful deep bass like a freight train from hell.

Of course, if your bass still sounds bad or not as good as the great bass you've heard before, then you would want to invest more time and money to improve the sound.

REW/UMIK-1 can be a good exercise if you are curious about the frequency response of your speakers and subs in your room - say you've been there, done it. And after you've scratched that off your bucket list, you can put the UMIK-1 back in the box and store in your closet forever (like me).

 

[3db]

I used my UMIK-1 a few times since it seems like "everyone" has one, like everyone has a SPL meter.

But then I put the UMIK-1 away and never used it again.

I guess it's a good "exercise" to scratch that curiosity itch. But in retrospect, I really didn't even need it to make my bass sound great.

Before you even order the UMIK-1, you could just play around with the manual PEQ for your subs. For example, change the 40Hz, 60Hz, 80Hz, and 100Hz to +3.0dB and set Q=0.5 for each. If that sounds like the best bass you've heard in your life compared to the other great bass you've heard, especially from expensive speakers and subs, do you even want to spend hours on REW and the $100 UMIK-1?

Here's one interesting fact - just because your Bass Frequency Response is FLAT, does not mean you will like the sound of your bass.

Of course, if your bass still sounds bad or not as good as the great bass you've heard before, then you do want to invest more time and money to improve the sound.

REW/UMIK-1 can be a good exercise if you are curious about the frequency response of your speakers and subs in your room - say you've been there, done it. And after you've scratched that off your bucket list, you can put the UMIK-1 back in the box and store in your closet forever (like me).

Since Yamaha lacks the facilities to display in room frequency response, how can one put a away the mic and REW after one tweaks PEQ?