Pre amp setup ?

[Dreamweaverx5000]

Driving this setup now with an Onkyo 393 AVR. I only have 1 remote. The Apple remote. One click. Everything comes on. I open a movie, Tidal, and everything I do from there. Iv come to love how simple that is. It’s all happening via HDMI CEC. No IR blasters or special Harmony Remotes. Also always works every time.
now I want more power without making that happy process more complicated than that.

 

[Dreamweaverx5000]

Thanks

 

[PENG]

I gotcha.
So sounds like for me... since I don’t what anymore than stereo and a center channel possibly... and my subs do not have XLR.
For a an extra 1700$ For the AV 70. All that I would add is a better built in DAC for that 1700$. Which isn’t not worth that.

so probably better get an AVR and add DAC separate for less.
Since I didn’t hear Anthem Room Correction is better than Audyssey. Then get a Denon 3700H for 1300$ and add the power amp to it using the Denon for a Pre amp instead of buying an expensive pre amp. Then add a DAC to it if I don’t like Denons DAC.

Yes if I were in your situation I would grab an AVR-X3700H, and use the savings to get a good stereo power amp such as Monolith's, or Anthem MCA225, or the Purifi based Buckeye amps for even better specs verified by bench test if you are on a budget.

As far as external DAC, unless you use analog input direct mode, it really would make no difference but I would do it regardless just because I want to be able to play DSD256 so that I am not limited to the available digital files I can purchase. I do not believe those so call high resolution files are better, but I did find there are more top notch recordings from the bucket of the DSD256 and 24b/192 kHz PCM files. Recording quality is by far the most important contributing factor to good sound quality, in my opinion.

If you are one of those who believe in DACs making audible difference then you do have the option to use a good media player such as JRiver so that you can use direct mode that would disable Audyssey REQ, and use JRiver's very versatile/flexible PEQs instead. That way your signal from the analog output of your favorite DAC will remain analog and pristine all the way to the preamp outputs.

The same applies to Anthem ARC, as soon as you use REQ, the signal has to be digitized so if you use external DAC, it will be worse (in theory) because it will get converted twice.

In fact, Anthem's analog inputs will not bypass the ADC/DAC path as it does not seem to have the direct mode that works like Denon, Marantz and Yamaha's, that would bypass the ADC/DAC block. May be it would, but I doubt it based on their FAQ's ambiguous response.

 

[Pogre]

The speakers are easy to drive and are 8 ohm. I just want better sound at the same volume which for me is maybe 75-85dB.
Do you have any other amp or receiver recommendations to make them sound good. Then what’s already suggested? I need an AVR to control things, but I am still looking to see if there is a better Amp I should add.
This whole thing was me trying to find a central AV controller while still having the benefit of a power amp for music in one controller. More or less.

The only real thing you can do to improve sound at "normal" volumes is eq or upgrade speakers. The tiny differences in measurements between DACs a lot of folks quibble over generally ALL fall under "inaudible" and even the most gifted golden ears would struggle to hear a difference, if at all. Get a good mid tier avr with preouts and skip the dac. It won't offer you anything above or beyond the DACs in most of the competently manufactured avrs that you'll be able to hear.

 

[Pogre]

Driving this setup now with an Onkyo 393 AVR. I only have 1 remote. The Apple remote. One click. Everything comes on. I open a movie, Tidal, and everything I do from there. Iv come to love how simple that is. It’s all happening via HDMI CEC. No IR blasters or special Harmony Remotes. Also always works every time.
now I want more power without making that happy process more complicated than that.

More power will allow you to reach higher volumes with lower distortion, but will be no different from what you have now at the volumes you're talking about. I'd recommend shifting gears and looking into new speakers if you're not happy with what you have now. Maximizing setup and positioning is a big one too, that a lot of folks overlook. Your room is as much in charge of your sound as the speakers themselves, and poor placement can have a huge negative impact on what you hear.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

If I can buy a Anthem 540 AVR for $1700, why buy the Anthem AVP for $3400?

What am I getting for that price that the 540 AVR cannot do?

Well, you're getting "prestige", "bragging rights", XLR inputs/outputs, and few other things.

The key to price differences is Economies of Scale, whether the price difference is between different brands or within the same brand.

The more units a company is able to sell, the less they will charge you. AVRs from any brand outsell AVPs by about 9:1 ratio. So AVRs will cost a lot less than AVPs.

It's the same way with Anthem vs Yamaha vs Denon, etc. Yamaha and Denon outsell Anthem and smaller companies by a large margin. Thus, the prices on the Yamaha and Denon AVRs will be a lot less than Anthem AVRs, purely because of economies of scales.

 

[Dreamweaverx5000]

Iv considered a higher rated streamer. But I like the sound and simplicity of the HDMI only Apple TV with tidal. For me it will always be a digital source due to this. I do find the best sound from this Onkyo receiver for music to be Direct mode so for, so that is what I use. But I guess I wouldn’t be looking for anything if I loved the sound. I feel the levels and the response is ok. I am feeling I’m missing some power in the sound of the music.
These speaker are very neutral, which is the sound I like. Not brassy or harsh or shrill by comparison, just needs a little push I think.
Do you think power of watts and amps is what I’m looking for? It that going to help with this?

 

[Pogre]

Iv considered a higher rated streamer. But I like the sound and simplicity of the HDMI only Apple TV with tidal. For me it will always be a digital source due to this. I do find the best sound from this Onkyo receiver for music to be Direct mode so for, so that is what I use. But I guess I wouldn’t be looking for anything if I loved the sound. I feel the levels and the response is ok. I am feeling I’m missing some power in the sound of the music.
These speaker are very neutral, which is the sound I like. Not brassy or harsh or shrill by comparison, just needs a little push I think.
Do you think power of watts and amps is what I’m looking for? It that going to help with this?

Unless you're exceeding power limits with your Onkyo by listening at extreme volumes more power won't do anything. Your speakers will use whatever power is required for your volume level. That's it. If you're reaching your desired volumes with 5 or 10 watts, having another 200 watts on reserve doesn't do anything. That extra power just sits there and goes unused. Period. You need to work on placement, eq or new speakers.

More power doesn't do anything for sound quality unless you exceed the power you have now. In most cases most of us are only using a few watts at a time. Check out this spl calculator. Punch in twice the power you have now and see what it does for your overall volume. Doubling your power only gives you 3 more dB of headroom.

Peak SPL Calculator

 

[Dreamweaverx5000]

Iv read often how the writer bought a good amp and the music really “came alive”. not louder. I thought this is what I was looking for. Is that not a thing?

 

[Pogre]

Iv read often how the writer bought a good amp and the music really “came alive”. not louder. I thought this is what I was looking for. Is that not a thing?

That is not a thing. Well, it IS a thing. It's called marketing fluff.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I have bad acoustics

If your room is a total acoustic mess, no Room EQ Correction in the world is going to magically fix it.

 

[Pogre]

I've read reviews for magic cables and mystery fluids you can put on your cables that do everything from expanding soundstages to making your music come alive too, and it's demonstrably false. There's a lot of woo and irrational reasoning in this hobby.

Take a gander at this one...

Three Dimensionality Enhancer!!! The Future is here!

If you don't already have this, you need this! This solution will add new dimensions you've never heard of before! At only $600 per 3ml, this is a steal! Once you order your Synergistic Research cables, you'll need this Enhancer to get that extra boost to reach full nirvana. Once the cables have...

forums.audioholics.com

 

[Dreamweaverx5000]

This is the SPL calculator

 

[Pogre]

This is the SPL calculator

Yes. Yes it is, lol.

 

[Dreamweaverx5000]

I don’t know what this SPL calculator is saying about this amp though.

 

[Pogre]

This is the SPL calculator

So you're talking about spl of 75-85 dB for your normal listening volumes and you're able to hit 103 dB with 80 watts right now. That's loud enough to cause permanent hearing loss. Now punch in 160 watts, then 320 watts and see what you get. You'll gain 3 dB of max volume for every doubling of power, which will have zero effect when you're listening at 75-85 dB. It's nice knowing you have spare power on tap for sure, but as far as overall sound quality... well, that's your room, speakers and placement. More power is not going change anything at the levels you're asking about.

 

[Pogre]

I don’t know what this SPL calculator is saying about this amp though.

It's saying that you can hit 103 dB with that amp before it clips/distorts.

 

[Dreamweaverx5000]

But there is still a difference is amps? They sound different from one another?

 

[Pogre]

But there is still a difference is amps? They sound different from one another?

Not if they're operating within spec, designed and built competently. Here, check this out. I punched in 5 watts and your speaker's sensitivity. You're hitting 90 dB with only 5 watts!

 

[Dreamweaverx5000]

The AVR is at 72 volume (not dB). I’m sure it producing more than 5 watts. Why I’m i only getting 75dB of actual volume ?