Best Way to Capture LP to Digital

[TLS Guy]

Can you recommend a suitable sound card?


I am a bit lost. I am ultra interested in good quality, but I don’t understand what you mean by “like to be able to mix with the ADC/DAC”

Sorry for the tardy reply, but I was driving back to the lake yesterday, and now we are getting close to ice out, so I need to get boats tractors and trailers ready. We are now approaching one of he busiest times of the year in Minnesota Lakes country.

First of all what is your location as this will affect my advice. Because of your equipment I have a suspicion you may be in the UK. I need to know where you are.

Next because of the very high quality of your equipment, especially your speakers, you need a high quality system. I strongly recommend pro gear for you. There is a chasm in the quality of consumer grade and pro grade equipment for this task. You have gear where you will tell the difference.

Sure you can use a consumer grade ADC and free software. Is it likely to sound like the LP on your equipment? It is highly unlikely.

I have 16 years experience of this now, with computer audio.

So what is required is a really good turntable. What cartridge do you have in your Rega turntable? Archiving a large LP collection is a lot of work. So if you are thinking of an upgrade to turntable or cartridge, now is the time to do it.

Now you have a good preamp. I think it is a good idea to use the preamp output to the ADC.

Now you need a good audio interface. Your choice here is related to who your vendors are.

In addition to an analog input from your preamp, It is nice to be able to mix in another source especially for a voice over or introduction if you want.

The most important thing is to be able to set input and output gain, so you can set the gain structure optimally. You also need accurate metering against over load. Everyone things digital systems are silent. This is not true because of the requirement for dither. So if the gain structure is not correct then the recording will be degraded just as it would be in an analog system.

Now if you want to record streamed concerts into your computer then you need a ADC/DAC that will record the audio input and AT the SAME time send an output to your system that you can hear simultaneously. This is called loop back. I use it all the time and would never want to be without it.

Next your software does affect audio quality, make no mistake about it. Free software is free and you don't get something for nothing.

Now in the pro arena Protools is dominant and overkill for what you and I need. You need good software with ASIO drivers. The DAC does need to be able to output SPDIF so it can work with domestic gear. A lot only has ADAT which pretty much excludes outputting to domestic gear.

I use Steinberg WaveLab. I'm used to it and really like it. It is really handy if your software can set peaks, and also optimize dynamic levels Wav, by Wav and or by batch. These issues are important to get your archived recording sounding identical to what comes off your turntable.

I use this ADC/DAC.

Something like this would probably do the trick for you though.

I can't stress enough that good metering in the hardware and software is crucial. A digital overload sounds way worse than an analog one.

This is my second DAW I built last year. I got 15 years service out of the first one.

Here are a couple of archived recordings from recordings I made for public radio broadcast. You can see the metering.

 

[Echolane]

Hey TLS, sorry, but I’m the one that’s really tardy. I’ve been really sick, just out of the hospital actually... but I must say, thinking of that beautiful Minnesota lake country cheers me up considerably. My husband is a farmer’s son from Western Minnesota and though I’m originally from Illinois and am now a long time Californian, life brought some Minnesota woodland acreage into my life many years ago, and as a result I own some property in Brainerd which I hope the wildlife are enjoying - I haven’t seen it in years!

I do very much believe that you get what you pay for. I just WISH I could play the audio game at the highest quality level. I would love to own the RME device you have pictured, for example, but I probably wouldn’t get anything done because I wouldn’t be able to take my eyes off those wonderful mermerizing meters! That said, I can definitely afford WaveLab Elements and the Focusrite Scarlett (and it’s really pretty too), thank you for suggesting them. Feel free to critique my stock Rega cartridge, which is an Elyse40, and maybe I can afford to upgrade it, though I will say it’s barely broken in.

I have just today spent an hour with Microsoft Support trying to figure out why my ASUS Xonar Essence Sound Card refuses to produce sound. After being sent to ASUS who have declared it in working order, thrn downloading the latest drivers, adding a new wiring harness, it still will not produce sound, so I need to replace it before I can do anything further at all. I’ve never liked the way it sounds that much anyway; I much prefer the cheaper Creative Sound Blaster I had used for many years, but obsoleted when I got a new motherboard which doesn’t have the right slot for it. I thought I’d go with an external sound card as replacement.

 

[sterling shoote]

Hey TLS, sorry, but I’m the one that’s really tardy. I’ve been really sick, just out of the hospital actually... but I must say, thinking of that beautiful Minnesota lake country cheers me up considerably. My husband is a farmer’s son from Western Minnesota and though I’m originally from Illinois and am now a long time Californian, life brought some Minnesota woodland acreage into my life many years ago, and as a result I own some property in Brainerd which I hope the wildlife are enjoying - I haven’t seen it in years!

I do very much believe that you get what you pay for. I just WISH I could play the audio game at the highest quality level. I would love to own the RME device you have pictured, for example, but I probably wouldn’t get anything done because I wouldn’t be able to take my eyes off those wonderful mermerizing meters! That said, I can definitely afford WaveLab Elements and the Focusrite Scarlett (and it’s really pretty too), thank you for suggesting them. Feel free to critique my stock Rega cartridge, which is an Elyse40, and maybe I can afford to upgrade it, though I will say it’s barely broken in.

I have just today spent an hour with Microsoft Support trying to figure out why my ASUS Xonar Essence Sound Card refuses to produce sound. After being sent to ASUS who have declared it in working order, thrn downloading the latest drivers, adding a new wiring harness, it still will not produce sound, so I need to replace it before I can do anything further at all. I’ve never liked the way it sounds that much anyway; I much prefer the cheaper Creative Sound Blaster I had used for many years, but obsoleted when I got a new motherboard which doesn’t have the right slot for it. I thought I’d go with an external sound card as replacement.

Here are a few facts which support getting all there is from your LP's without much expense. First, the Creative Sound Blaster will connect to your PC since it's a usb connected device. Plug it in and install driver. Second the Roxio Software will yield a music file which you or no one else on the Planet could distinguish as sounding different than the LP, unless you record at too high or too low a recording level. And, finally, if you are concerned about your cartridge, don't be, unless you do not like how your LP's sound from the cartridge. No doubt, if you think your cartridge is not getting all there is from the groove, buy a Shure M97xE. It delivers LP sound which sounds like the CD of same. At any rate, $100 for X-FI HD, $50 for Roxio software, and $100 for Shure cartridge. This will get you a result where the file created will sound just like the LP, maybe better, if you use the software's pop filter. One more thing, if you want to make the file sound different from the LP, then, you might want to consider Professional recording equipment and methods as TLS alluded too. The only reason I'd do that would be someone paying me to do it, like a public library wanting to restore, and/or preserve vinyl recordings. Oh, if you want something that is really fast, another route is buy a Tascam CD Recorder. It will record your LP's like a compact cassette recorder would, then just rip the CD to your computer's music player's library. This will get a great result but does not address pops.

 

[TLS Guy]

Hey TLS, sorry, but I’m the one that’s really tardy. I’ve been really sick, just out of the hospital actually... but I must say, thinking of that beautiful Minnesota lake country cheers me up considerably. My husband is a farmer’s son from Western Minnesota and though I’m originally from Illinois and am now a long time Californian, life brought some Minnesota woodland acreage into my life many years ago, and as a result I own some property in Brainerd which I hope the wildlife are enjoying - I haven’t seen it in years!

I do very much believe that you get what you pay for. I just WISH I could play the audio game at the highest quality level. I would love to own the RME device you have pictured, for example, but I probably wouldn’t get anything done because I wouldn’t be able to take my eyes off those wonderful mermerizing meters! That said, I can definitely afford WaveLab Elements and the Focusrite Scarlett (and it’s really pretty too), thank you for suggesting them. Feel free to critique my stock Rega cartridge, which is an Elyse40, and maybe I can afford to upgrade it, though I will say it’s barely broken in.

I have just today spent an hour with Microsoft Support trying to figure out why my ASUS Xonar Essence Sound Card refuses to produce sound. After being sent to ASUS who have declared it in working order, thrn downloading the latest drivers, adding a new wiring harness, it still will not produce sound, so I need to replace it before I can do anything further at all. I’ve never liked the way it sounds that much anyway; I much prefer the cheaper Creative Sound Blaster I had used for many years, but obsoleted when I got a new motherboard which doesn’t have the right slot for it. I thought I’d go with an external sound card as replacement.

I hope you are recovering nicely from your hospital stay.

We are 60 miles NW of Brainerd and connected to Leech Lake.

I know nothing of your cartridge, but I see it is not cheap, so it ought to be good. It is $265 on Needle Doctor. It is the same as the 2, the one that comes with the turntable is called the 40.

I would try and get the ADC/DAC out of the computer. I think that Focusrite unit will do a good job for you.

 

[Echolane]

Sorry to have gone silent, but I have been dealing with some continuing health issues. Still, this topic remains of significant interest to me, and I’ve still managed to continue exploring this topic. Especially appreciate the great education and advice I have been getting.

I’ve been so close to choosing the Focusrite Scarlett, which I’m quite attracted to. It seems a higher quality product than the Creative Sound Blaster, though it’d be nice to hear the difference. I’ve even downloaded and pored over the Scarlett User Guide, but making the proper connections to my stereo system continues to baffle me. As well, it seems very much targeted to users who record live music, something I have zero interest in doing, nor do I foresee any interest, (I don’t even own a microphone), so without an example of how I’d like to use it, I hesitate to choose it.

At this point, I *think* I am glad I hesitated because I came across a product which seems to have everything I need in one package, a direct connection from the turntable, a high quality ADC and a USB connection to the computer, making it a one piece solution to digitizing my LPs, and unlike the Focusrite, it connects into my stereo system in ways that make much more sense to me. The product has a particular emphasis on analogue sound and it uses a linear power supply, characteristics which greatly appeal to me. I only need add some software, which I regard as the easy part. It’s priced at a close-out-the-inventory price, which is half it’s normal price. It’s replacement will have a different focus and won’t contain an ADC. This shift in emphasis does concern me somewhat.

PS Audio NuWave Analog Phono Converter.
https://www.psaudio.com/products/nuwave-phono-converter/

Would appreciate any opinionated feedback before I pull the trigger on this purchase.

 

[TLS Guy]

Sorry to have gone silent, but I have been dealing with some continuing health issues. Still, this topic remains of significant interest to me, and I’ve still managed to continue exploring this topic. Especially appreciate the great education and advice I have been getting.

I’ve been so close to choosing the Focusrite Scarlett, which I’m quite attracted to. It seems a higher quality product than the Creative Sound Blaster, though it’d be nice to hear the difference. I’ve even downloaded and pored over the Scarlett User Guide, but making the proper connections to my stereo system continues to baffle me. As well, it seems very much targeted to users who record live music, something I have zero interest in doing, nor do I foresee any interest, (I don’t even own a microphone), so without an example of how I’d like to use it, I hesitate to choose it.

At this point, I *think* I am glad I hesitated because I came across a product which seems to have everything I need in one package, a direct connection from the turntable, a high quality ADC and a USB connection to the computer, making it a one piece solution to digitizing my LPs, and unlike the Focusrite, it connects into my stereo system in ways that make much more sense to me. The product has a particular emphasis on analogue sound and it uses a linear power supply, characteristics which greatly appeal to me. I only need add some software, which I regard as the easy part. It’s priced at a close-out-the-inventory price, which is half it’s normal price. It’s replacement will have a different focus and won’t contain an ADC. This shift in emphasis does concern me somewhat.

PS Audio NuWave Analog Phono Converter.
https://www.psaudio.com/products/nuwave-phono-converter/

Would appreciate any opinionated feedback before I pull the trigger on this purchase.

I had a look at that unit. It is quite pricey, but suspect it is a good unit, but certainly peeking into audiophool category.

I like the ability to match the unit to a wide variety of cartridges. Adding DSD (Direct Stream Digital) was superfluous. This is the system used for SACD and its awkward and costly. Also for LP transfer you don't need those high PCM bit rates either. The CD 44.1 16 bit has easily enough frequency response and dynamic range to transfer any LP to digital. Anything higher will just waste storage space.

I'm glad you have researched this. Choosing equipment is very personal, which is why I just tend to make general recommendations. If this is the unit you want then go ahead, and choose the software you are comfortable with.

 

[Echolane]

I had a look at that unit. It is quite pricey, but suspect it is a good unit, but certainly peeking into audiophool category.

I like the ability to match the unit to a wide variety of cartridges. Adding DSD (Direct Stream Digital) was superfluous. This is the system used for SACD and its awkward and costly. Also for LP transfer you don't need those high PCM bit rates either. The CD 44.1 16 bit has easily enough frequency response and dynamic range to transfer any LP to digital. Anything higher will just waste storage space.

I'm glad you have researched this. Choosing equipment is very personal, which is why I just tend to make general recommendations. If this is the unit you want then go ahead, and choose the software you are comfortable with.

Hahaha I have to really laugh at your audiophool comment because I do feel I am treading way too close to the edge on this. Both this entire venture and this particular PS Audio product. I am already all too aware that hearing degrades significantly in older adults and I am approaching the antique age range. Nothing like an old fool who continues to think like a much younger person.

I have had several alternative (RATIONAL) thoughts on this subject which almost certainly would be cheaper than buying hardware and investing a ton of time.

Sort my LPs into several piles
- Those I don’t care enough about to copy or to buy a replacement CD to rip
- those I can find on DEEZER or Tidal or Primephonic
- those not available above that I can find a CD version of
- those where the analogue qualities cannot be equaled by a CD or no CD is available
and in this latter case, hire someone to make a high quality high res copy*

- Buy the Creative Labs external sound card and use it to listen, not record....

I agree as to the unnecessary options like DSD and PCM. I have read the sweet spot for recording LPs is not at the highest res. Will have to look up the recommended rate again, but it is not DSD or PCM. Besides they take up so much space.

*if you know someone to trust with this, let me know; I might investigate.
.

 

[sterling shoote]

Using the X-FI HD's usb DAC for listening will give you greater pleasure than wireless to your home theatre speakers, for sure. It's easy to set-up too. Just connect it to usb port at computer and its RCA outs to stereo preamp or active speakers. If you prefer your pre/pro's DAC, you can also connect the X-FI HD's optical S/PDIF output to your pre/pro for up to 24/96 conversion. One more connection, the RCA out from your amp to the X-FI, will give you LP recording if you ever want to digitize any of your LP's. I've now had my X-FI HD for about 6 years. Its quality has never been an issue. Not being an IT guy, I did have a learning curve to understand how to correctly install the X-FI HD's driver to activate the X-FI HD; but, once properly applied it has always worked as desired, without needing to go into computer's sound settings. For less than a hundred dollars the X-FI is a best value too.

 

[Echolane]

Using the X-FI HD's usb DAC for listening will give you greater pleasure than wireless to your home theatre speakers, for sure. It's easy to set-up too. Just connect it to usb port at computer and its RCA outs to stereo preamp or active speakers. If you prefer your pre/pro's DAC, you can also connect the X-FI HD's optical S/PDIF output to your pre/pro for up to 24/96 conversion. One more connection, the RCA out from your amp to the X-FI, will give you LP recording if you ever want to digitize any of your LP's. I've now had my X-FI HD for about 6 years. Its quality has never been an issue. Not being an IT guy, I did have a learning curve to understand how to correctly install the X-FI HD's driver to activate the X-FI HD; but, once properly applied it has always worked as desired, without needing to go into computer's sound settings. For less than a hundred dollars the X-FI is a best value too.

Thanks for the encouragement. My desktop is currently mute so I need to get with it and make a decision! Did I mention that I had a Creative Sound Blaster sound card from way back? It moved from computer to computer whenever I upgraded, until this last one, which didn’t have a vintage slot for it, so I bought the troublesome ASUS. But I missed the Sound Blaster the minute I heard the ASUS; I never liked the way it sounded and I never got used to the way it sounded. Hopefully the X-FI HD retains a similarity to its earlier stable mate.