Time to buy a gun ... again

[slipperybidness]

For tactical shotguns I just don't believe in the high price stuff that companies are trying to sell, OK, if you need 15 round capacity pump 12ga your options are going to be slimmed out a bit, I have held the uts, it feels cheap to me, IMO there is a reason the uts sells used for around 50% of its new cost lol, there is a video on youtube, I haven't seen it in a while but one guy says "so you like it?" the reply is "yah if I had to go to battle I may take it over a pellet gun", I have seen a few used for under $700, there is one on GB rite now for around $700... What I hear is they are junk..

Now for the keltek I own one, bought it used/never shot and played with it a bit, its also kind of junk, nothing I would EVER put in my bedroom for home security...

NOW that all being said, if you want a shotgun, don't get a pump... Get a semi, mossberg 930 comes in 8 shot {I own} Mossberg 930 8 shot 18.5" #85360 .12Ga NEW! : Semi Auto Shotguns at GunBroker.com {they also have a pistol grip version, I like and own the one in the link} and I promise you go to battle against a well taken care of 930 with one of the above pumpers, you will need a priest... Another semi to consider, and the things I hear are hit or miss with it is the Saiga, some people love it, I own one and haven't shot it a ton, but like... AK-47 Saiga Izhmash 12ga. Shotgun sbs short AK47 : Semi Auto Shotguns at GunBroker.com ...

I am not sure what the point of high cap 12 gauges are, they used to be the "go to" home defense weapon but people love them and they sell {and I own a few myself, lol} but if you can't get it done in 8 {12ga} then you only need one to turn on yourself, lol.... I am not a fan of shotguns for home defense unless its 410 self defense rounds in a gov. revolver with the ct grips and strobe light... In my bedside lock box I have a scorpion 1911 rail gun with a strobe/laser mounted on it, and Grizzly 175 g xtreme rounds http://i.ytimg.com/vi/7fvUhGp0mRc/hqdefault.jpg ...

If you just want a bad ass shotgun, I would personally get the 930 spx {no pistol grip} with a bulldozer Elite Tactical Advantage rail sytem with an undermounted projectile launcher ST 12 Rear Loading Havoc Launcher [STH1210] - $329.95 : Spikes Tactical you would be under the cost of a 15 rd pump with the 930, rail, and launcher...

Thanks for the feedback!

Yeah, you are now the 2nd person to tell me the UTS is "junk". I didn't know the other person that told me that too well, so I took it with a grain of salt. But, now that you have confirmed what he said, I'll steer clear.

So, you do make some valid points on the KSG too, but I still want one, it still looks bada$$

I also get your point on the semi shotguns. But, in all honest, I have shot pump-action shotguns so much that I am just so comfortable with them. Even when I go out skeet shooting, I prefer the pump. When I use a friend's semi, I find myself trying to pump it (that whole muscle-memory thing).

I do already have a tactical Remington 870. That is a fine shotgun, but I'm sure you know that is just about the most run-of-the-mill shotty out there. Maybe I should just save $, not get KSG, and spend it pimping out the 870 instead. I'm 100% sure that I would be happy with that approach.

Yeah, 410, I have the sister of the Governor, the Tauraus Judge. I have a laser dot for it, but haven't installed it yet. Really, I think the Judge is one of the most fun pistols I have ever shot. The 45 colt was more accurate than I expected, and the 410 is just about impossible to completely miss the mark. It might be a little bit of a gimmick, but what a fun gimmick to have!

I'll definitely have a look at that Mossberg.

 

[j_garcia]

Gun shows are illegal around here lol...

The springfield is better than the kimber, hands down, the only kimbers I would bother with are the "custom shoppe" guns, anything else is junk {IMO}....

Why are you looking into the 9mm models, the 45acp is a much better carry round to me... check out this guy 1911 Ultra Two-Tone I own one {similar mine is all black its the ultra nitron} and its a very vince ccw...
or go for the daddy of all compact 1911's WILSON COMBAT CARRY COMP COMPACT 45 1911 : Semi Auto Pistols at GunBroker.com mine is a little older, {that is brand new} but I have the same done by wilson on a forged springfeild frame, I love it... I can put a pic up if you may be interested in one of them...

9mm is fine for carry. Home defense .45 sure, but not so much for concealed carry. 9mm has the best selection of defensive ammo around, can be found most everywhere, and ballistically, should be more than enough to end a situation. I've checked out the EMP and I like it because I was considering it myself, but it still feels a bit bulky to carry, though I also have my full size 1911 on my permit For carry, IMO, you want at least one option that is narrow and easy to conceal.

KSG is known to have a number of issues. Yes, it looks mean, but function trumps looks My home defense shotgun is also an 870 tactical. Try out the Magpul stock and forend. I wasn't crazy about the stock, but I have the forend with a rail and light and really like it.

 

[slipperybidness]

KSG is known to have a number of issues. Yes, it looks mean, but function trumps looks

Well, thanks for raining on my KSG parade

I suppose I have heard enough about the KSG and the UTS to take them off my list. Maybe if I find a used one for a good price I will consider it again. Oh well, saves me $ without finding out the hard way.

I guess I'm back to the "pimp out the 870" plan. Like I mentioned, the 870 is already a fine shotty, so I'm 100% sure that I would be happy with that approach.

 

[j_garcia]

Well, thanks for raining on my KSG parade

I suppose I have heard enough about the KSG and the UTS to take them off my list. Maybe if I find a used one for a good price I will consider it again. Oh well, saves me $ without finding out the hard way.

I guess I'm back to the "pimp out the 870" plan. Like I mentioned, the 870 is already a fine shotty, so I'm 100% sure that I would be happy with that approach.

I really wanted the KSG too, but when I went to look at it in person, that's exactly what the guy at the shop told me too. Wait until they've got the bugs worked out on it.

 

[ImcLoud]

9mm is fine for carry. Home defense .45 sure, but not so much for concealed carry. 9mm has the best selection of defensive ammo around, can be found most everywhere, and ballistically, should be more than enough to end a situation. I've checked out the EMP and I like it because I was considering it myself, but it still feels a bit bulky to carry, though I also have my full size 1911 on my permit For carry, IMO, you want at least one option that is narrow and easy to conceal.

KSG is known to have a number of issues. Yes, it looks mean, but function trumps looks My home defense shotgun is also an 870 tactical. Try out the Magpul stock and forend. I wasn't crazy about the stock, but I have the forend with a rail and light and really like it.

My CCW is a sig p229, I have a pair of them and love them, 1 with laser 1 without... For a 1911 I just prefer the 45 over the 9mm, they are the same size, so why not have the 45, as far as the ammo goes, there are a lot of 9mm sd rounds out there, but there are some really really nice 45acp's out there too, plus I tend to buy one and stick with it, and that box normally lasts a very very long time since I dont shoot to defend myself too often, lol... It is true 9mm has enough punch to neutralise most threats, but I have seen that big slow 45 pop some targets, they are just 2 different animals... It all comes down to personal preference. I prefer a very small gun for ccw, p3at, sig p229, ect the smaller the better.. Now for Home defense I will never use anything but the 1911 rail gun with tlr-2 fastened to it, ever since I seen it in action and went through the tactical class where it was introduced to me, for me to consider something else it would have to be a magic gun, because the 1911 for home defense is almost magic...

 

[mike c]

bought the teeny tiny reflex sight. ^ it's much too small for my taste (sight picture wise), and i would need some type of 45 deg mount to use it properly. honestly, this is a range gun, that didn't really need this (and i would die before i get a shot out with this gun handheld).



bought the primary arms 1-4x scope, UBR stock, fab defense T-pod g2 and agr-43 pistol grip



the primary arms MD-06L in a different mount than before and Fab defense GL-MAG stock

 

[j_garcia]

Nice, I can actually see this thread again because it doesn't get blocked by our stupid net nanny on the new fourm

 

[mike c]

which looks better:
Tavor vs X-95

and then the winner of that

winner vs Kriss vector


Tavor
cons: still looking for one


X-95
cons: needs a lot of paperwork


Kriss Vector
pros: available now
cons: semi-auto

 

[ImcLoud]

I just like bull pup designs...

 

[j_garcia]

I really like the Tavor. I've handled them both though and the Kriss is pretty impressive. Considering picking one up next year since it is actually legal here.

 

[mike c]

yeah, if i had the money for both and didn't have the cap set by the wife ... i'd be on that kriss.

is the kriss considered an SBR over there?

 

[j_garcia]

No, the Kriss is sold in stores here but has to be the long barrel version to have the stock and not be SBR. One of my friends who works at the near by shop has one and says he really likes it - it can also be built featureless for CA so no bullet button. Not sure if the pistol configuration is available here or not. Problem with the Tavor for me is the price pretty much , but the shop also has them on the shelf.

 

[mike c]

they say that the 45 doesn't really like long barrels (in terms of velocity) ...

well, that's CA for you.

 

[ImcLoud]

they say that the 45 doesn't really like long barrels (in terms of velocity) ...

well, that's CA for you.

It depends, you can load 45 to do what ever you want, longer barrel with more twist, lighter projectile with a faster burning powder, just find the recipe that works in which ever gun you have... The reason rounds like 9mm, 40, 45, ect aren't great in long barrels is because they are loaded to be shot out of hand guns...

I couldn't expect a round I load for a 4 1/4" 1911 and shoots fantastic in that gun to shoot as good in a 14" barrel as a round I load for the 14" barrel and vice versa...
For example, I have a German Sig p210, completely customized by sig germany, the gun is amazingly accurate when I load the rounds a certain way at subsonic 147 grains at 25 yards the gun shoots in the 10 circle mag after mag i have never seen anything like it in a pistol before... Now that same round in my 16" Steyr AUG 9mm {converted to 9} shoots absolutely terrible, that shoots cheap ball ammo better than the handloaded 147 subs...

ANYWAY, keep that in mind 45 will shoot fine you just need the right bullet, most likely going to be a faster round with a hot powder load and the projectile grains matched to you twist rate...

 

[mike c]

finally managed to complete the draconian requirements for our new gun license.

to save on a little footwork, i ordered a SIG 522 Swat so the store would be the one to pick up my new license.

excited!
magtech 22lr = 0.12cents each
magtech other ammo = 0.63cents each

i can hear the plinking already.

 

[mike c]

first time to replace gas block and free float handguard.

i wish i had a vice and/or 4 arms. working with incomplete tools

 

[ImcLoud]

did you tap the rear detent hole 4-40 , shorten the detent spring, and install a setscrew? Thats my favorite ar mod...

Looks good...


I am going shooting tomorrow, pistol, bringing my 1911 target gun and my bullseye gun and 500 rounds, should be a fun day...

 

[mike c]

did you tap the rear detent hole 4-40 , shorten the detent spring, and install a setscrew? Thats my favorite ar mod...

Looks good...

i did not understand any of that

 

[ImcLoud]

OK, you know where the rear detent is? thats the little spring that flys out when you remove the rear plate {tht the buffer tube goes through}...

So that spring is no maintenance item but everytime you remove your stock it flys out and needs to be reset...

So you tap the whole with a 4-40 tap, cut the spring down about 5/16 of an inch, and install a 4/40 set screw with a drop of loctite on it... Now the take down detent works smoother {shorter more stable spring} and you can remove your stock with out having to deal with the detent spring...

 

[mike c]

when i got it


and we're done with this