Delay in my system? please help

[lovinthehd]

Yes, get rid of that receiver. It can not do what you need.

Just because you dislike receivers doesn't mean one "can not" do what he needs (his current one certainly doesn't have the pre-outs, tho), a dedicated pre-pro like that used 8003 would perhaps be easier but believe he has other speakers to drive outside the QSC amp so he may need additional amplification as well, he still needs to be more exact on his full list of gear and how he wants to use current speakers as well as his theater find.

 

[TLS Guy]

Just because you dislike receivers doesn't mean one "can not" do what he needs (his current one certainly doesn't have the pre-outs, tho), a dedicated pre-pro like that used 8003 would perhaps be easier but believe he has other speakers to drive outside the QSC amp so he may need additional amplification as well, he still needs to be more exact on his full list of gear and how he wants to use current speakers as well as his theater find.

That's the point though. The pre pro has balanced and unbalanced connections you can use at the same time.

My experience tells me that if you have a combination of consumer and pro gear a Pre/pro is absolutely the way to go.

In fact if you are never going to use the receivers power amps, a pre/pro is best. A receiver in my system would be totally useless.

In addition pre/pros have a better build quality and the absence of power amps in the case is likely to increase reliability.

As you know I really don't like the receiver concept, and I like it less the more amps and facilities are piled on. Even in the sixties and seventies I never liked them, and now they are descending to, and truly reached, the level of atrocious devices.

 

[lovinthehd]

That's the point though. The pre pro has balanced and unbalanced connections you can use at the same time.

My experience tells me that if you have a combination of consumer and pro gear a Pre/pro is absolutely the way to go.

In fact if you are never going to use the receivers power amps, a pre/pro is best. A receiver in my system would be totally useless.

In addition pre/pros have a better build quality and the absence of power amps in the case is likely to increase reliability.

As you know I really don't like the receiver concept, and I like it less the more amps and facilities are piled on. Even in the sixties and seventies I never liked them, and now they are descending to, and truly reached, the level of atrocious devices.

I use pro amps (four Crowns and a Crest) with my avrs, it isn't that hard. All depends on how much one is willing to spend on a pre and sufficient amplification....that is a nice price for an 8803 altho I'm not much of an ebay kinda shopper myself, maybe I'd risk it here on the classifieds from a known member. A4L does have a refurb 7701 with xlr output with a limited warranty....http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/marav7701/marantz-av7701-7.2-ch-networking-a/v-preamp/processor/1.html

Still depends on how he wants to use (some or all) the speakers he has, seems he'll need add'l amps for all the theater speakers if he doesn't go the avr route....whereas those speakers are probably sensitive enough to be driven by an avr's amp in any case.

 

[TLS Guy]

I use pro amps (four Crowns and a Crest) with my avrs, it isn't that hard. All depends on how much one is willing to spend on a pre and sufficient amplification....that is a nice price for an 8803 altho I'm not much of an ebay kinda shopper myself, maybe I'd risk it here on the classifieds from a known member. A4L does have a refurb 7701 with xlr output with a limited warranty....http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/marav7701/marantz-av7701-7.2-ch-networking-a/v-preamp/processor/1.html

Still depends on how he wants to use (some or all) the speakers he has, seems he'll need add'l amps for all the theater speakers if he doesn't go the avr route....whereas those speakers are probably sensitive enough to be driven by an avr's amp in any case.

The speakers won't be the problem. It will be S/N. Although you could float the line between unbalanced outs and pro XLR, there will be a voltage miss match and gain structure issues.

The XLR output of a pre/pro is over twice that of unbalanced outputs. The high sensitivity of his speakers will unmask degraded S/N from a less than ideal connection to a much greater degree.

 

[lovinthehd]

The speakers won't be the problem. It will be S/N. Although you could float the line between unbalanced outs and pro XLR, there will be a voltage miss match and gain structure issues.

The XLR output of a pre/pro is over twice that of unbalanced outputs. The high sensitivity of his speakers will unmask degraded S/N from a less than ideal connection to a much greater degree.

Easier, and maybe snr would be an issue, maybe not. Still depends on what amps he wants and how much he wants in the way of spl; the avr alone may be fine even without the QSC.

 

[KlipschFTW]

I plan on running my two jbl 15's, the horns on top and my bookshelf speakers if I don't sell them too, and if I ever find room the 2 massive horns, 2 twelves and 2 18's. Is there a place I can read up on all this stuff because im having a hard time understanding all the terminology.

 

[KlipschFTW]

Just because you dislike receivers doesn't mean one "can not" do what he needs (his current one certainly doesn't have the pre-outs, tho), a dedicated pre-pro like that used 8003 would perhaps be easier but believe he has other speakers to drive outside the QSC amp so he may need additional amplification as well, he still needs to be more exact on his full list of gear and how he wants to use current speakers as well as his theater find.

Ok what I have two klipsch bookshelf speakers and a klipsch r112 powered subwoofer hooked up to my receiver, then the 2 jbl's hooked to the the qsc amp

 

[KlipschFTW]

What happened about a year ago I started building my home audio bought receiver bookshelf then the sub all together, then about a month ago I ran into some people that had bought out carmike cinemas surplus and was selling it at a great rate so I bought all of that stuff unknown to me I couldn't run it all at the same time which is were the splitter and Dbx came into play it was the only way I could figure out how to get it working, I'm a newbie so I don't really know about pre Amps and so forth, in a perfect world I'd like to use everything together without an echo, so far what I have learned is if I get the marantz i could run them all together but would need a separate amp for my bookshelf speakers( the klipsch ones) I'm sorry guys I'm trying to get my head out my arse it's just taking me alittle

 

[Pogre]

You're in a good place. You got what appears to be some very nice professional equipment. Just take a deep breath and start reading. Do some searches here and ask about things you don't understand. Slow down and break those posts up into a couple of paragraphs instead of one chunk. Once you sell some of your gear and have some kind of a budget established, you can start seriously looking at options.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

You're in a good place. You got what appears to be some very nice professional equipment. Just take a deep breath and start reading. Do some searches here and ask about things you don't understand. Slow down and break those posts up into a couple of paragraphs instead of one chunk. Once you sell some of your gear and have some kind of a budget established, you can start seriously looking at options.

This is good advice P.

 

[KlipschFTW]

You're in a good place. You got what appears to be some very nice professional equipment. Just take a deep breath and start reading. Do some searches here and ask about things you don't understand. Slow down and break those posts up into a couple of paragraphs instead of one chunk. Once you sell some of your gear and have some kind of a budget established, you can start seriously looking at options.

I'm hoping for 1k for what I'm selling so we will see!

 

[lovinthehd]

Ok what I have two klipsch bookshelf speakers and a klipsch r112 powered subwoofer hooked up to my receiver, then the 2 jbl's hooked to the the qsc amp

What happened about a year ago I started building my home audio bought receiver bookshelf then the sub all together, then about a month ago I ran into some people that had bought out carmike cinemas surplus and was selling it at a great rate so I bought all of that stuff unknown to me I couldn't run it all at the same time which is were the splitter and Dbx came into play it was the only way I could figure out how to get it working, I'm a newbie so I don't really know about pre Amps and so forth, in a perfect world I'd like to use everything together without an echo, so far what I have learned is if I get the marantz i could run them all together but would need a separate amp for my bookshelf speakers( the klipsch ones) I'm sorry guys I'm trying to get my head out my arse it's just taking me alittle

Yes, a single receiver (or multi-ch pre-pro) can handle the proper delays (which is aka the distance setting) for a multi-ch speaker system. Just depends on what you want in the way of use of external amplification, you can let an avr handle some or all of the speaker duties, or you can get a pre-pro and sufficient amps to drive the speakers you want.

Did you get more than two channels worth of the JBL speakers? I was under the impression you had more than just a pair of them? In any case an avr with high sensitivity speakers like the JBLs may be all you need; if you want amp flexibility then an avr with pre-outs or a pre-pro are your options.

Just depends on what you want your system to be and how much to spend on it....

 

[KlipschFTW]

The

Yes, a single receiver (or multi-ch pre-pro) can handle the proper delays (which is aka the distance setting) for a multi-ch speaker system. Just depends on what you want in the way of use of external amplification, you can let an avr handle some or all of the speaker duties, or you can get a pre-pro and sufficient amps to drive the speakers you want.

Did you get more than two channels worth of the JBL speakers? I was under the impression you had more than just a pair of them? In any case an avr with high sensitivity speakers like the JBLs may be all you need; if you want amp flexibility then an avr with pre-outs or a pre-pro are your options.

Just depends on what you want your system to be and how much to spend on it....

Everything I have shown in pictures is what I have, im only using the jbl's and the horns on the pro audio side

 

[lovinthehd]

The


Everything I have shown in pictures is what I have, im only using the jbl's and the horns on the pro audio side

As I mentioned, looking at pictures only says so much, thought the later picture with speakers and bass bins were additional speakers to what you showed earlier (let alone all the other speakers in that last photo). So we're considering two speakers and the bass bins only for speakers now? How do you plan to amplify the bass bins or did they come with a crossover or? I saw you're selling the Denon 510, the Klipsch sats and sub, so that helps, too. Keep in mind despite their size the bass bins may not dig as deep as a sub.

A nice concise list of gear with not just make but specific model of each piece is a good thing in posting here, so we can look up specs/manuals; your goals are for just stereo now or multi-ch later?

 

[lovinthehd]

Also, have you tried the JBLs just with your Denon avr alone?

 

[Verdinut]

I went through all the posts and nobody has questioned about explaining the delay which the OP hears.

I suspect that what he describes as a delay might be an out of phase condition between the horn and the woofers in the theatre cabinets. There is a possibility that those speakers are equipped with a passive crossover which contains a time delay control to counteract the out of phase condition between the two transducers of which voice coils are not in the same vertical plane.

In a theater, distances between speakers and the spectators are quite longer than in someone's home. The acoustics are completely different. If the crossover does not have a time delay adjustment, the OP could try reversing the wires on the woofers, but it might just be easier to reverse the polarity on the horn compression driver instead. I may be wrong but that might fix the problem.

 

[lovinthehd]

I went through all the posts and nobody has questioned about explaining the delay which the OP hears.

I suspect that what he describes as a delay might be an out of phase condition between the horn and the woofers in the theatre cabinets. There is a possibility that those speakers are equipped with a passive crossover which contains a time delay control to annul the out of phase condition between the two transducers of which voice coils are not in the same vertical plane.

In a theater, distances between speakers and the spectators are quite longer than in someone's home. The acoustics are completely different. If the crossover does not have a time delay adjustment, the OP could try reversing the wires on the woofers, but it might just be easier to reverse the polarity on the horn compression driver instead. I may be wrong but that might fix the problem.

More certainly the reason is that he has a single source routed via an hdmi splitter, essentially through two different and not time aligned processors....but we are lacking a lot of details

 

[slipperybidness]

What happened about a year ago I started building my home audio bought receiver bookshelf then the sub all together, then about a month ago I ran into some people that had bought out carmike cinemas surplus and was selling it at a great rate so I bought all of that stuff unknown to me I couldn't run it all at the same time which is were the splitter and Dbx came into play it was the only way I could figure out how to get it working, I'm a newbie so I don't really know about pre Amps and so forth, in a perfect world I'd like to use everything together without an echo, so far what I have learned is if I get the marantz i could run them all together but would need a separate amp for my bookshelf speakers( the klipsch ones) I'm sorry guys I'm trying to get my head out my arse it's just taking me alittle

You really don't want to duplicate the front Left/Right speakers, and from your pics that looks like what you are trying to do.

Repurpose those Klipsch Bookshelf speakers as surrounds, or build a complete 2nd system.