$10,000 Two Channel Recommended System

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I actually Demo'd the SX-8300/R this past Saturday (1 Hour drive) and have to say I was very impressed with the speakers and it is on my short list for my HT build. I still have time and do want to at least hear the Triton 1s and a few others before I make my final decision

Did you get a chance to actively bi-amp the SX-8300/R using LFE?

Or just as single-amp passive?

 

[gene]

RBH just needs to lower the price of the 8T to $20K so some of us can also enjoy them.

LOL yes and Porsche needs to lower the price of the Cayman S to $40k so we can enjoy it too

Wait till CEDIA, I think some very interesting things will be coming from RBH. Can't wait to report on it!

 

[gene]

Did you get a chance to actively bi-amp the SX-8300/R using LFE?

Or just as single-amp passive?

BTW you can actively Bi-amp the T30s. The T30s were designed to work with a receiver's bass management. The bass portion has no crossover so you can simply use the 24dB oct Xover in the sub channel of a processor. The top portion is sealed and has natural 12dB/oct rolloff. When I owned the T30s that's exactly how I ran them.

The 8T's are way different animal. IMO they sound best single amped with no bass management at all. This kinda sucks b/c it makes for integrating them into a home theater with additional subs very tricky. However if I turn off my powered subs and just feed all Bass to the 8T's you wouldn't believe how much bass fills my room. I really don't need the extra 2 subs in my room other than to smooth out the response of the other seats.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Like I said, if you go by ears you get subjective opinion. That's pefectly fine unless you want to stick with accuracy. I believe there are people who prefer inaccurate speakers if they happen to listen to one that matches their liking. For example, may be s somewhat metallic sound is actual an accurate reflection of the metallic musical instruments, but if the person prefer an artifically warmer or non metallic sound then the person will not necessary prefer a relatively accurate speaker.

WhenI did my A/B/C comparison listening in a KEF/Revel dealer last year, I really like the F32 but still went home with the R900 that I perceived being more live like whereas the F32 was smooth but seemed less transparent to me. So yes I can understand it if someone would say KEF R700 sound metallic but I really am guessing what others may think or perceive. I prefer to stick to facts and figures, as long as they match with my senses.

Sound like you maybe ready to sell your 201 to me and then go buy some RBH.

I like speakers that measure accurately (objectively) and sound great subjectively. I believe the RBH T2, T30, and 8T all measured within +/-2.5dB listening window FR on Audioholics. KEF, Revel, PSB, Paradigm, NHT, Ascend, Salk, and Philharmonic, also measure very accurately. But the RBH T2 & T30 subjectively sounded the most lively and dynamic with the most kick-butt bass I've ever heard.

There are a lot of great sounding speakers, and everyone has a right to his favorite(s).

PERSONALLY, my favorite speaker would be a relatively AFFORDABLE large tower design that allows me to actively bi-amp the woofers using LFE signal. Since the RBH 8T is relatively UNAFFORDABLE , it would be the SX-T2 tower, unless they come out with a SX-T30. .

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

BTW you can actively Bi-amp the T30s. The T30s were designed to work with a receiver's bass management. The bass portion has no crossover so you can simply use the 24dB oct Xover in the sub channel of a processor. The top portion is sealed and has natural 12dB/oct rolloff. When I owned the T30s that's exactly how I ran them.

The 8T's are way different animal. IMO they sound best single amped with no bass management at all. This kinda sucks b/c it makes for integrating them into a home theater with additional subs very tricky. However if I turn off my powered subs and just feed all Bass to the 8T's you wouldn't believe how much bass fills my room. I really don't need the extra 2 subs in my room other than to smooth out the response of the other seats.

Oh, I most definitely believe you don't need other subs with the 8T. I have five SX-1010N subs, and the bass is absolutely amazing to my ears. So the 8T's bass would be nirvana.

Shane was telling me that you could also actively bi-amp the SX-8300 and SX-6300 (like the SX-T2 and T30) using the AVR's LFE/bass management. Of course, the bass magnitude will differ among these speakers.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

LOL yes and Porsche needs to lower the price of the Cayman S to $40k so we can enjoy it too

Hallelujah, I'm all for that.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

A few notes on the above....

- My credibility is based on 15 years doing this for a living and working with a tremendous amount of equipment not just over periods of years, but every day and in just about every type of environment, budget, source material, etc. I stand by my description of what I felt about the KEF R700 as well as my relaying of what other people's opinions have been of it since we set that rig up. 12 people have now come in to listen to these speakers and not one has listed the R700 as anything but last - and by a large gap in performance. More than half of our listeners didn't even want to go back to them after hearing any of the others. I don't have anything against KEF. Heck, I'm a dealer of the line! But, in the market space they are priced in, I don't feel like the R700 is perhaps the best speaker out there.

I also disagree with the robotic idea that people should trust in measurements rather than their own ears. I feel that people should absolutely trust their senses as to what sounds good to them. Music is to be enjoyed by the senses. That's how it works! To go by measurements to determine what sounds good begs the question: Why listen at all? This is not to disparage measurements. Not in the least! But, IMO, that is well behind actual perceived performance from the speaker itself in determining sound quality.

Lastly, I would just like to point out that the other speakers were designed by engineers as well.

Yes, measurements and research serve as a good starting point and guideline. But this is not heart surgery, bridge and building engineering, rocket science, and medicine where accuracy and measurement are of utmost importance.

With audio, we start out with a good guideline - measurements. But then we follow where our hearts (or ears ) lead us.

 

[Irvrobinson]

LOL yes and Porsche needs to lower the price of the Cayman S to $40k so we can enjoy it too

Unlike the 8T, you can easily find a used Cayman S. With some looking, especially in FL, you can find good 2006-2007 examples for the $40K range. The new 981s are better, IMO, but the 987s are still pretty good.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Sounds like you should drop the Kef line if you think it's that bad. Seriously why sell something you don't feel passionate about.

Well, a lot of people love the sound of KEF.

We can't please everyone. We can't all agree on everything.

 

[gene]

Oh, I most definitely believe you don't need other subs with the 8T. I have five SX-1010N subs, and the bass is absolutely amazing to my ears. So the 8T's bass would be nirvana.

Shane was telling me that you could also actively bi-amp the SX-8300 and SX-6300 (like the SX-T2 and T30) using the AVR's LFE/bass management. Of course, the bass magnitude will differ among these speakers.

Wow you are a basshead! Do you have the 1010s with the Status driver?

I suppose you can actively biamp the 8300s. IT's funny when I actively biamped my T30s, I settled on a bass level to within 1 dB of how the speakers function single amped. Damn Shane knows how to integrate a system really well passively!

 

[gene]

Unlike the 8T, you can easily find a used Cayman S. With some looking, especially in FL, you can find good 2006-2007 examples for the $40K range. The new 981s are better, IMO, but the 987s are still pretty good.

Yea I had my eye on a 2010 but I don't think I can bring myself to buying a used German car with little or no warranty left. Speakers don't break down (usually) but German cars do

 

[Irvrobinson]

Yea I had my eye on a 2010 but I don't think I can bring myself to buying a used German car with little or no warranty left. Speakers don't break down (usually) but German cars do

The latest Porsches aren't like that, typically. That 2010, for example, has the new engine generation, which addressed a most of the problems in that department, at least if you stay off the track with it. Water pumps are still weak, but a real bargain at only $800 for a new one, installed. The PDK is an iffy proposition off-warranty, but the six-speed is pretty solid. The real issue is whether or not you can do your own maintenance, like oil changes, brake pads, and air filters; it'll save a bundle every year if you can. That is one nice thing about audio systems, they never need a nine-quart synthetic oil change, and they don't have water pumps.

Regardless, get a Cayman S. It's worth the risk.

 

[gene]

The latest Porsches aren't like that, typically. That 2010, for example, has the new engine generation, which addressed a most of the problems in that department, at least if you stay off the track with it. Water pumps are still weak, but a real bargain at only $800 for a new one, installed. The PDK is an iffy proposition off-warranty, but the six-speed is pretty solid. The real issue is whether or not you can do your own maintenance, like oil changes, brake pads, and air filters; it'll save a bundle every year if you can. That is one nice thing about audio systems, they never need a nine-quart synthetic oil change, and they don't have water pumps.

Regardless, get a Cayman S. It's worth the risk.

Man I want a Cayman S badly but I still have 2 kids and no back seat means I have to drive my wife's Minivan a lot more often My 07 Acura TL-S has 84k miles on it and is unbreakable. I think a Cayman S is in my distant future ATM. My closest compromise would be a BMW M235i but they are too new to work a deal. I like to buy slightly used low-mileage cars with plenty of warranty left. My wife hates BMW style so I'm not holding my breath on getting one of those either She want's the new Acura TLX but I am not digging the beak, the lack of a friggin manual shift lever, and FWD at almost $40k!

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Do you have the 1010s with the Status driver?

Just the standard driver in the SX-1010N model.

I suppose you can actively biamp the 8300s. IT's funny when I actively biamped my T30s, I settled on a bass level to within 1 dB of how the speakers function single amped. Damn Shane knows how to integrate a system really well passively!

Agreed.

 

[3db]

If I had the money, the Porsche I would end up getting is this one.. the 959 which was at that time the most advanced and fastest car made, bar none.

 

[Irvrobinson]

A 959 may be a cool piece of history, but for the price you'd pay you can have a his and her new Turbo Ss, order a Macan for errands, and probably have enough left over for a pair of 8Ts, and then some.

Edit: You could also have one of those new hybrid 918s... hmmm...

 

[3db]

A 959 may be a cool piece of history, but for the price you'd pay you can have a his and her new Turbo Ss, order a Macan for errands, and probably have enough left over for a pair of 8Ts, and then some.

Edit: You could also have one of those new hybrid 918s... hmmm...

At the prices we are talking about, value has no meaning. If it does, it means that you are still not in a high enough income bracket. It comes down to personal preference and this is what I prefer to have over any car you care to mention.

 

[cpp]

Unlike the 8T, you can easily find a used Cayman S. With some looking, especially in FL, you can find good 2006-2007 examples for the $40K range. The new 981s are better, IMO, but the 987s are still pretty good.

Got that right, tell me when you want one Gene, search auto trader for your city. Used Porsche Caymans for Sale in Charlotte, NC 28202 - AutoTrader.com

OP, as far as the $10,000 I say forget what people say on a forum, take a trip and listen with your own ears. Equipment might measure great in a magazine and sound great in a audio store but until you get that device in your home all bets are off.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I am not as exciting as you guys.

My money will go towards a Mark Levinson sound system like this.

 

[cpp]

I am not as exciting as you guys.

My money will go towards something much more boring, like this.

Hey talk to the wife, she knows a guy oh ps, be prepared for a MPG shock but with your money that shouldn't matters