Rifle scope/sight for .223/5.56?

[itschris]

Have you looked at Burris' red dot offerings? They make a pretty decent red dot as well.

 

[mike c]

Have you looked at Burris' red dot offerings? They make a pretty decent red dot as well.

the teeny tiny red dot in the above pics is a burris fastfire and one of the options.

i have a 3x primary arms scope incoming and a sightmark sight on backorder. i'll see how these go, and hopefully wouldn't need anything else.

if the rifle with the 3x scope requires a 1x backup ... the burris is the sight to get (with it's small size and weight)


i'm just curious how combat soldiers use the trijicon magnified scopes in CQB.

 

[itschris]

the teeny tiny red dot in the above pics is a burris fastfire and one of the options.

i have a 3x primary arms scope incoming and a sightmark sight on backorder. i'll see how these go, and hopefully wouldn't need anything else.


i'm just curious how combat soldiers use the trijicon magnified scopes in CQB.

if the rifle with the 3x scope requires a 1x backup ... the burris is the sight to get (with it's small size and weight)

Yeah... I have a one of those Fastfire III's... but Burris actually makes a true red dot and a magnified one as well. Just wondering if you checked into those. Primary Arms is a very nice choice. They make really great stuff for the money. I wouldn't take it to Iraq, but it's certainly great for the range and some 3 gun matches. They're top notch people there.

 

[itschris]

i'm just curious how combat soldiers use the trijicon magnified scopes in CQB.

The ACOGs are based off the Bindind Aiming Concept (BAC). You basically teach yourself to shoot with both eyes open. Your non-scoped eye sees the sight picture in transiton while the target blurs in the scoped eye. Your brian is able to merge the pictures... as you come on target, your scoped eye dials in and you're set. It's hard to explain, but it works. It took awhile for me to get it. I was convinced it just wouldn't work for me, but then one day just goofing around the house it sort of clicked and I could do it. My TA33 on my SBR... the one pictured above... is 3X with a green horseshoe ret. When I'm moving I just seem to notice the ret and pic up the sight picture with my uncoped eye. it's hard to explain, but it really does work. You can still do CQB the traditional way, but it's obviously not going to be as fast. On my other rifle with the 4X ACOG, I have a Trijicon on a 45 degree mount on my rail just beyond the receiver. When doing CQB drills, I cante the rifle and look through the little reflex sight (very much like the FastFire III you got )

 

[sholling]

I haven't read the whole thread (just 3-4 pages) but I'll toss an idea out for future reference. Weaver's V3 1-3x20 is a nice inexpensive but very good quality dangerous game scope for around $170. The V3 are engineered to hold up to elephant guns so a 5.56 is no problem. It's not illuminated but it has true 1x on the low-end making it easy to use with both eyes open for CQB. I use one on my M&P15-22 as a low cost training analog for my 6.8 SPC with a high buck Burris XTR 1-4x24. It works pretty good for that and I've even played with putting one on my home protection Mini-14 but I really don't like scopes on Minis.

 

[Tomorrow]

I haven't read the whole thread (just 3-4 pages) but I'll toss an idea out for future reference. Weaver's V3 1-3x20 is a nice inexpensive but very good quality dangerous game scope for around $170. The V3 are engineered to hold up to elephant guns so a 5.56 is no problem. It's not illuminated but it has true 1x on the low-end making it easy to use with both eyes open for CQB. I use one on my M&P15-22 as a low cost training analog for my 6.8 SPC with a high buck Burris XTR 1-4x24. It works pretty good for that and I've even played with putting one on my home protection Mini-14 but I really don't like scopes on Minis.

Hi,

Is that an aftermarket flash suppressor on the Mini? What is it, how does it attach, and how do you like it?

 

[sholling]

It's not a flash suppressor it's a modified Shrewd varmint style muzzle brake with a Brockman sight for a Marlin rifle attached. The barrel was shortened and threaded and the brake threaded on, properly indexed, and pinned in place. The brake-sight combination design is mine but the work was done at Great Western Gunsmithing and was part of an accurizing process (package B) that included stock bedding and trigger work (3.5lb) etc that's supposed to turn a 2-3 MOA Mini into a 1 MOA carbine. My eyes are't good enough to test that without installing a fairly powerful scope but I'm very happy with it.

 

[j_garcia]

It looks like a compensator/muzzle brake and appears to be integral to the barrel (pretty sure you showed me pics of the Mini before and your grandfathered hi-cap mags )

That Weavers might be just what I am looking for for my MP15-22 also. I don't really think I'll have a need for CQB with the ground squirrels There is no "close" with them. My Weavers offset rails should be here today.

 

[sholling]

That Weavers might be just what I am looking for for my MP15-22 also.

It's a good little scope. Two others that may be worth a look are a Weaver RV4 4x28 rimfire and a RV7 2.5-7x28 rimfire. Both are very good quality rimfire scopes as are the larger Nikon Prostaff rimfire scopes. For what it's worth I'm using Burris' QD P.E.P.R mount on my M&P15-22.

 

[itschris]

Hey Sholling, no flash hider or brake on your one rifle? What's the fireball look like coming out of that!?

 

[j_garcia]

If you mean the first one, that's a .22, presumably CA compliant like mine No fireballs coming out of that guy really.

 

[sholling]

Yup it's a 22. I saved about $100 buying the no flash hider version of CA legal M&P15-22 and the hassle of arguing with cops over the legality of a flash hider on a 22.

 

[Tomorrow]

Thanks for the info. Nice work on the Mini package. What brand bipod is that? Adaptor required?

 

[sholling]

Thanks for the info. Nice work on the Mini package. What brand bipod is that? Adaptor required?

Thanks. It's a Harris but it was just there for the pictures. I had GW install an adapter and sling stud in the stock. The up charge was trivial, like $10-15 if memory serves. I'm in California and our AR15s can't have simple magazine releases so it made sense to put some money into my pre-magazine ban Mini-14 and make it accurate. My other Mini just has a scope and a trigger work by Brimstone (~35-40) and will eventually get an Accu-Strut if Minis aren't banned this year.

 

[itschris]

Yup it's a 22. I saved about $100 buying the no flash hider version of CA legal M&P15-22 and the hassle of arguing with cops over the legality of a flash hider on a 22.

I keep forgetting you guys are in CA where nothing really makes a whole lot of sense. No VFG's and no Flash Hider... for what possible reason? It's just so bizarre. I was testing different brakes out of my 10.5" SBR and shot it without any muzzle device. It looked like a freakin flame thrower. I could believe the fireball and even more just how effective the standard A2 hider is at taming the flame. For my SBR, I went with the KX3 brake. The flash isn't bad and it's throws all the concussion forward instead of out to the sides like a lot of brakes do. The guys shooting next to me appreciate that.

 

[j_garcia]

A brake is nice for the shooter, just not for anyone else around Flash hider is not 100% illegal here, it just needs to meet certain criteria based on the barrel length, overall length, what features that rifle has, etc... for the given rifle. It's all very lame.

Yeah, well SB150 intends to push basically what California's laws are to everyone else with the addition of all AR-15 and AR-10 types banned. Good thing they separated it out yesterday saying that it was not expected to pass.

Democrats on Tuesday confirmed that a proposed ban on assault weapons will not be included in a package of gun reform legislation yet to be introduced in the Senate, suggesting the measure does not have broad support in Congress.

The bill's sponsor, Democratic Sen. Dianne Feinstein of California, confirmed to reporters Tuesday that Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid will remove an assault weapons ban from a package of gun reform legislation, and offer it separately as an amendment.

Assault weapons ban dropped from Senate bill

I am holding off on the scope/mount right now even though my angled rails came in last night. Saving the funds for my new compact pistol which should be in anytime and the CCW class that will go along with it

 

[Tomorrow]

A brake is nice for the shooter, just not for anyone else around Flash hider is not 100% illegal here, it just needs to meet certain criteria based on the barrel length, overall length, what features that rifle has, etc... for the given rifle. It's all very lame.

Yeah, well SB150 intends to push basically what California's laws are to everyone else with the addition of all AR-15 and AR-10 types banned. Good thing they separated it out yesterday saying that it was not expected to pass.



Assault weapons ban dropped from Senate bill

I am holding off on the scope/mount right now even though my angled rails came in last night. Saving the funds for my new compact pistol which should be in anytime and the CCW class that will go along with it

CCW in Kalifornica??! LOL, I thought you had to be a legislator or legislator's bodyguard or some such "important" person to qualify. Have the CCW rules and guidelines changed recently? By the way, having come from Kalifornica and relocated to Oregon was a delight to my shooting hobby. Oregon...Class 3 state, CCW on demand, shooting in rural areas, no "assault rifle" bans or restrictions, no Feinstein, etc.

 

[Tomorrow]

Sholling, it looks like those guys did a great job. The entire setup looks very clean and the M14 style action is classic. I like Mini's a lot, but worry that under heavy fire, that barrel is going to start bending...probably an unfounded worry, though.

 

[j_garcia]

CCW in Kalifornica??! LOL, I thought you had to be a legislator or legislator's bodyguard or some such "important" person to qualify. Have the CCW rules and guidelines changed recently? By the way, having come from Kalifornica and relocated to Oregon was a delight to my shooting hobby. Oregon...Class 3 state, CCW on demand, shooting in rural areas, no "assault rifle" bans or restrictions, no Feinstein, etc.

CCW depends on where you are. Basically large metropolitan areas there's no chance. In rural areas though, very different story. I chose my new county carefully; CCW is not just allowed, the sheriff actually encourages it. One of the guys at the gun shop said our county is as close to "shall issue" for CCW as it gets in NorCal. Best part is, it is legal for the whole state once you have it and it will make it incredibly simple to acquire one for most other states as well. We also live outside of city limits, so I can shoot all I like on my property as well as open carry (also banned now).

 

[sholling]

A brake is nice for the shooter, just not for anyone else around Flash hider is not 100% illegal here, it just needs to meet certain criteria based on the barrel length, overall length, what features that rifle has, etc... for the given rifle. It's all very lame.

The newer Minis are decently accurate but the older ones like mine needed some work to make them accurate. The problem was that while the first shot out went where you wanted barrel whip due to harmonics would cause quick followup shots to spread out. The popular (cheap) fix is an Accu-Strut which acts as a brace, but GunDoc (Great Western Gunsmithing) figured out that changing the barrel harmonics by cutting the length and adding weight to the end of the barrel (the reason for the brake) eliminated the issue and allowed him (along with stock bedding and other mods) to produce what he claims are 1 MOA Minis. Things have improved in the last couple of years with newer models because Ruger finally started using slightly thicker barrels to reduce barrel whip and improve out of the box accuracy.

I am holding off on the scope/mount right now even though my angled rails came in last night. Saving the funds for my new compact pistol which should be in anytime and the CCW class that will go along with it

Congrats! Check out the M&P compacts.

CCW in Kalifornica??! LOL, I thought you had to be a legislator or legislator's bodyguard or some such "important" person to qualify. Have the CCW rules and guidelines changed recently? By the way, having come from Kalifornica and relocated to Oregon was a delight to my shooting hobby. Oregon...Class 3 state, CCW on demand, shooting in rural areas, no "assault rifle" bans or restrictions, no Feinstein, etc.

It's always been up to the local sheriff, in about half the counties the sheriffs accept self defense as good enough cause to issue a permit. On the other hand about a half dozen counties restrict permits to the politically connected, business owners that carry cash or other valuables, and very large campaign donors. The rest are somewhere in the middle however there is a case before the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals just waiting for a decision trying to force shall issue but it could go either way.

Sholling, it looks like those guys did a great job. The entire setup looks very clean and the M14 style action is classic. I like Mini's a lot, but worry that under heavy fire, that barrel is going to start bending...probably an unfounded worry, though.

Minis were popular with police departments, prisons, and even used by one or two armies. They're super reliable but not easy to work on.