Z
zoysia
Audioholic Intern
Does anyone have any suggestions on an amp to power zone 2 speakers by a pool.(spending no more than $500).
Looking to power 2 B&W WM6's.
Randy
Looking to power 2 B&W WM6's.
Randy
"Let our rigorous testing and reviews be your guidelines to A/V equipment – not marketing slogans"
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LOUMFSG
Junior Audioholic
I have the same question
One low-cost option I have found is the AudioSource - AMP100 - can be had for about $115 shipped. Does anyone have experience / know anything about AudioSource products - I am not familiar with them?
A couple of others I have found:
Gemini X1 - about $165 shipped
Onkyo M-282 - about $300 shipped
I'm sure the Onkyo is well-built, good-sounding unit. Like I said, I don't know much about the others, and I'm looking for advice as well.
Actually, I have a much more complicated question, which I'll post shortly, but part of my question involves a 2-channel amp.zoysia said:
One low-cost option I have found is the AudioSource - AMP100 - can be had for about $115 shipped. Does anyone have experience / know anything about AudioSource products - I am not familiar with them?
A couple of others I have found:
Gemini X1 - about $165 shipped
Onkyo M-282 - about $300 shipped
I'm sure the Onkyo is well-built, good-sounding unit. Like I said, I don't know much about the others, and I'm looking for advice as well.
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Doug917
Full Audioholic
Audio Source makes decent amps. I don't think I would put one in my HT set up, but I would have no problem using one for a zone2 stereo setup. Here are a couple reviews of the amp from Amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00026BQJ6/104-6251092-3099938?v=glance&n=172282&n=507846&s=electronics&v=glance
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00026BQJ6/104-6251092-3099938?v=glance&n=172282&n=507846&s=electronics&v=glance
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LOUMFSG
Junior Audioholic
Question about speakers
"You can drive A, B or both. Speakers MUST be at least 8 ohms resistance"
Does this mean 6 ohm speakers cannot be used with this amp? I am considering Yamaha NS-AW350 speakers for my patio, and they are 6 ohm speakers. If anyone can explain the relationship between speaker resistance and the amplifier in layman's terms, I would greatly appreciate it.
OK, time to show how little I understand about electrical engineering. In the Amazon reviews, one of the reviews writes:Doug917 said:
"You can drive A, B or both. Speakers MUST be at least 8 ohms resistance"
Does this mean 6 ohm speakers cannot be used with this amp? I am considering Yamaha NS-AW350 speakers for my patio, and they are 6 ohm speakers. If anyone can explain the relationship between speaker resistance and the amplifier in layman's terms, I would greatly appreciate it.
j_garcia
Audioholic Jedi
The Audiosource amps are actually pretty decent sounding. Very detailed, though not what I would call "lively"; more of a flat, accurate sound. The nice thing is they are pretty small (amp One/A is 1U, about 1/2 the height of a M282) and don't generate a ton of heat.
Lower impedance means the speaker will draw more current thus driving the amp harder and hotter. An amp that is not designed to handle lower impedance may clip and damage the speakers. With 2 speakers, this shouldn't be a problem, and the Audiosource amps are usually 2 Ohm stable, so they can handle most anything.
The M282 can be found at www.jr.com for $229.
A / B switching doesn't apply if you are using a separate amp and only one set of speakers in Zone2.
What receiver? Does your current receiver have a Zone 2 function?
Lower impedance means the speaker will draw more current thus driving the amp harder and hotter. An amp that is not designed to handle lower impedance may clip and damage the speakers. With 2 speakers, this shouldn't be a problem, and the Audiosource amps are usually 2 Ohm stable, so they can handle most anything.
The M282 can be found at www.jr.com for $229.
A / B switching doesn't apply if you are using a separate amp and only one set of speakers in Zone2.
What receiver? Does your current receiver have a Zone 2 function?
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zoysia
Audioholic Intern
Probably yamaha rx-v2600 or a rx-v2500.
They have a zone 2 control, I was told the B & W's were power hungry and I didn't want to kill the yamaha if I crank the outdoor speakers all day.
They have a zone 2 control, I was told the B & W's were power hungry and I didn't want to kill the yamaha if I crank the outdoor speakers all day.
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LOUMFSG
Junior Audioholic
This multizone setup is complicated
Here is my deal. I have a Yamaha RX-V2500, currently running a 5.1 setup in my family room. I originally planned to add presence speakers up front, as the room was pre-wired by the previous owner to hang speakers up front, and I have floor-standers as mains. However, depending on what I do for Zone 2, that may or may not work.
I am in the process of landscaping the backyard, and I would like to have 2 pairs of speakers out there. One pair will attach to the house for the patio/deck area, and a second pair will be away from the house in a seating area (I am thinking about getting faux-rock type speakers for that area). In any event, I would like to be able, in the outside areas, to drive A, B or both.
It seems I have several options:
1) I could use "Zone B" of the V2500 to drive the outdoor speakers. I would need an A/B switch to run the two outdoor areas separately. I think I could get something like this from Radio Shack (although the Owner's guide indicates a maximum of 10 watts/channel, continuous music power. Would I need something similar, but with more power capability?):
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062679&cp=&kw=speaker+switch&parentPage=search
I would still be able to add presence speakers this way, but the limitations of using the B speakers as a separate Zone is that the input would be the same as the family room, so I couldn't have music outside while the TV was on in the family room (particularly an issue, since I currently only have a monitor in the family room, so the sound has to come through the HT right now)
2) I could use the V2500 internal amp to power Zone 2, but again would need some kind of an A/B switch for the two outdoor areas. If I do this, I don't believe I would be able to run presence speakers in the family room (easily anyway. I probably could get some kind of an A/B/C switch and wire the presence speakers as A and the outdoor areas as B and C, but then I would also have to go into setup and change the presence/Zone 2 settings in the V2500 every time I switched uses, which seems like a hassle). The other issue I have here is that Zone 2 seems to only accept analog inputs. The only analog inputs I currently have connected are the Multichannel inputs from my SACD/DVD-A changer (I also have a digital coax connection for the changer, as well as a digital coax connection from my STB), but I am not sure if those are accessible to Zone 2 or not (can you set Zone 2 to Multi-In?). I would like to maintain my digital connections for primary listening in the family room. If I add analog connections from my DVD changer and Digital STB to the V2500, will it default to analog or digital? Will I have to go into setup and change settings to Analog when I want to use Zone 2? What happens if I want to listen to a 5-channel DVD-A inside, and also want to have sound to Zone 2 outdoors at the same time? My head is spinning.
3) The third option is setting Zone 2 to an external amp, and getting something like the AudioSource amp, which will already do the A/B switching I want outside. I still have the same analog/digital input issues, but at least I can use the presence speakers that way.
One last question. It seems to me that the V2500 only has 8 amps, as you can only have one of either surround back, presence or Zone 2 powered by the V2500. However, you can have both Speakers A and Speakers B powered simultaneously. Are two amps powering all four speakers in that case. If so, when you turn on B, does that cut the power available to A, or does B take power from another channel (the surrounds?). What does it do to sound quality if you use the V2500 "Zone B" to power speakers in another room?
Sorry for the length of this post - I just want to make sure I understand all of this before I try configure these multiple zones.
EDIT - apologies to zoysia if I wind up hijacking this thread. Is there an easy way to move a post to its own thread?
Here is my deal. I have a Yamaha RX-V2500, currently running a 5.1 setup in my family room. I originally planned to add presence speakers up front, as the room was pre-wired by the previous owner to hang speakers up front, and I have floor-standers as mains. However, depending on what I do for Zone 2, that may or may not work.
I am in the process of landscaping the backyard, and I would like to have 2 pairs of speakers out there. One pair will attach to the house for the patio/deck area, and a second pair will be away from the house in a seating area (I am thinking about getting faux-rock type speakers for that area). In any event, I would like to be able, in the outside areas, to drive A, B or both.
It seems I have several options:
1) I could use "Zone B" of the V2500 to drive the outdoor speakers. I would need an A/B switch to run the two outdoor areas separately. I think I could get something like this from Radio Shack (although the Owner's guide indicates a maximum of 10 watts/channel, continuous music power. Would I need something similar, but with more power capability?):
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062679&cp=&kw=speaker+switch&parentPage=search
I would still be able to add presence speakers this way, but the limitations of using the B speakers as a separate Zone is that the input would be the same as the family room, so I couldn't have music outside while the TV was on in the family room (particularly an issue, since I currently only have a monitor in the family room, so the sound has to come through the HT right now)
2) I could use the V2500 internal amp to power Zone 2, but again would need some kind of an A/B switch for the two outdoor areas. If I do this, I don't believe I would be able to run presence speakers in the family room (easily anyway. I probably could get some kind of an A/B/C switch and wire the presence speakers as A and the outdoor areas as B and C, but then I would also have to go into setup and change the presence/Zone 2 settings in the V2500 every time I switched uses, which seems like a hassle). The other issue I have here is that Zone 2 seems to only accept analog inputs. The only analog inputs I currently have connected are the Multichannel inputs from my SACD/DVD-A changer (I also have a digital coax connection for the changer, as well as a digital coax connection from my STB), but I am not sure if those are accessible to Zone 2 or not (can you set Zone 2 to Multi-In?). I would like to maintain my digital connections for primary listening in the family room. If I add analog connections from my DVD changer and Digital STB to the V2500, will it default to analog or digital? Will I have to go into setup and change settings to Analog when I want to use Zone 2? What happens if I want to listen to a 5-channel DVD-A inside, and also want to have sound to Zone 2 outdoors at the same time? My head is spinning.
3) The third option is setting Zone 2 to an external amp, and getting something like the AudioSource amp, which will already do the A/B switching I want outside. I still have the same analog/digital input issues, but at least I can use the presence speakers that way.
One last question. It seems to me that the V2500 only has 8 amps, as you can only have one of either surround back, presence or Zone 2 powered by the V2500. However, you can have both Speakers A and Speakers B powered simultaneously. Are two amps powering all four speakers in that case. If so, when you turn on B, does that cut the power available to A, or does B take power from another channel (the surrounds?). What does it do to sound quality if you use the V2500 "Zone B" to power speakers in another room?
Sorry for the length of this post - I just want to make sure I understand all of this before I try configure these multiple zones.
EDIT - apologies to zoysia if I wind up hijacking this thread. Is there an easy way to move a post to its own thread?
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jcPanny
Audioholic Ninja
Receiver A OR B
Your yamaha shares an amp with the A and B speaker connections. If you read the manual, to power A AND B speakers at the same time, you will need speaker with >16 ohms impedence which is not realistic. However, you could power A or B without a problem. The Yamaha could also be running the remaining 3 inside speakers if you have a mode like multi channel stereo selected.
Concerning the 2 sets of outdoor speakers, Consider mounting a couple impedence matching volume controls inside or outside. These allow you to adjust the volume of each set of speakers and maintain an 8 ohm load for your receiver or external amp.
One advantage of the external amp option is that you receiver can play a CD outside on zone 2 while you are watching a movie, radio, etc. on the inside zone.
Your yamaha shares an amp with the A and B speaker connections. If you read the manual, to power A AND B speakers at the same time, you will need speaker with >16 ohms impedence which is not realistic. However, you could power A or B without a problem. The Yamaha could also be running the remaining 3 inside speakers if you have a mode like multi channel stereo selected.
Concerning the 2 sets of outdoor speakers, Consider mounting a couple impedence matching volume controls inside or outside. These allow you to adjust the volume of each set of speakers and maintain an 8 ohm load for your receiver or external amp.
One advantage of the external amp option is that you receiver can play a CD outside on zone 2 while you are watching a movie, radio, etc. on the inside zone.
j_garcia
Audioholic Jedi
Just copy it and paste it all into a new threadLOUMFSG said:
Usually with a receiver that is zone 2 capable, it doesn't matter if zone 2 is powered by the receiver or an external amp, it can play a separate stereo source simultaneously. IMO, it's better to use an external amp in most cases though. I agree though, the simplest solution for LOUMFSG is probably impedance matching volume controls for each pair of speakers in zone 2.
OK, so you shouldn't have to worry about A/B switching, AFAIK. You would use the zone 2 preamp outputs to the zone 2 amp and then you may want a manual volume control (does not have to be impedance matching if you stick with one pair of speakers) out there too.zoysia said:
Z
zoysia
Audioholic Intern
No big deal LOUMFSG. I am learning from your situation.
Randy
Randy
L
LOUMFSG
Junior Audioholic
Question about impedance matching volume controls
If I go the route of getting an AudioSource AMP100 for Zone2, which allows A/B/A+B switching, and both pairs of outdoor speakers are 8-ohm speakers, do impedance matching volume controls do anything for me (other than provide for the opportunity to possibly use 6-ohm speakers in the future)? Also, is the AMP100 (50 Watts at 8-ohm) going to provide enough power to drive two pairs of speakers, is the AMP200 (80 Watts at 8-ohm) the way to go, or would I be better off letting my RX-V2500 power Zone 2 (and giving up the presence channel in my family room)?
I don't know much about wiring volume controls. Do you essentially put one control for each pair of speakers, and then somehow set something within the volume control to indicate how many pairs of speakers are being powered by the amp? I assume the volume control just sits between the Amp and speakers (in other words, you wire from Amp to volume control, then volume control to speakers).j_garcia said:
If I go the route of getting an AudioSource AMP100 for Zone2, which allows A/B/A+B switching, and both pairs of outdoor speakers are 8-ohm speakers, do impedance matching volume controls do anything for me (other than provide for the opportunity to possibly use 6-ohm speakers in the future)? Also, is the AMP100 (50 Watts at 8-ohm) going to provide enough power to drive two pairs of speakers, is the AMP200 (80 Watts at 8-ohm) the way to go, or would I be better off letting my RX-V2500 power Zone 2 (and giving up the presence channel in my family room)?
jcPanny
Audioholic Ninja
Zone 2 wiring
Your assumption about the volume control wiring is correct.
2 amp channels to 1 volume control to 2 speakers. The impedence matching controls have a jumper or switch allowing you to specify 1, 2, 4, or 8 pairs of speakers.
If you want to power the outdoor speakers with the Yamaha, then you will need this type of volume control or other impedence matching device. If you go for the audiosource, it can handle 2 pairs of 8 ohm speakers and the impedence matching speaker is not necessary. Keep in mind, that if you plan to use the audiosource without any volume controls then you will not be able to independently adjust the level of each set of speakers. Both loud, both quiet, and either set On or Off.
The 50 watts will be fine for running both sets of speakers at background music levels. If you want to crank up the music at the pool, then consider a larger amp.
Your assumption about the volume control wiring is correct.
2 amp channels to 1 volume control to 2 speakers. The impedence matching controls have a jumper or switch allowing you to specify 1, 2, 4, or 8 pairs of speakers.
If you want to power the outdoor speakers with the Yamaha, then you will need this type of volume control or other impedence matching device. If you go for the audiosource, it can handle 2 pairs of 8 ohm speakers and the impedence matching speaker is not necessary. Keep in mind, that if you plan to use the audiosource without any volume controls then you will not be able to independently adjust the level of each set of speakers. Both loud, both quiet, and either set On or Off.
The 50 watts will be fine for running both sets of speakers at background music levels. If you want to crank up the music at the pool, then consider a larger amp.
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