Yamaha RX-V663 Receiver Overview

[Jack Hammer]

Well my friend called me yesterday from Atlanta looking for a ~$500 avr. she was considering the Denon 688 or Onkyo 575. I steered her toward this because it seems like it does a lot more and is more dependable. so I'm hoping I didn't give bad advice. i'll find out how happy she is in about a week or so.

Jack

 

[skykeys]

Hello Jack,

I didn't understand what you meant. Did you steer your friend toward the Yamaha V663, or toward the Denon and Onkyo units?

Just curious. I'm still researching this issue of which brand to go for, when I do eventually upgrade. I know that Yamaha is a very reliable, well built unit with very good DSP technology. I have the older RX-V620 and I'm very happy with it. But when I finally get around to upgrading it, I going to at least look at Onkyo and Denon receivers.

The new Onkyo's have some interesting technology in their units, including what appears to be superior quality DACs and video upconvert chips compared to the V663 and V863; and of course Denon has had a very good reputation for quality sound for a long time. Though, the Onkyos look like they are a tad more expensive than equivalent Yamaha units.

Thanks.

 

[Jack Hammer]

Hello Jack,

I didn't understand what you meant. Did you steer your friend toward the Yamaha V663, or toward the Denon and Onkyo units?

Just curious. I'm still researching this issue of which brand to go for, when I do eventually upgrade. I know that Yamaha is a very reliable, well built unit with very good DSP technology. I have the older RX-V620 and I'm very happy with it. But when I finally get around to upgrading it, I going to at least look at Onkyo and Denon receivers.

The new Onkyo's have some interesting technology in their units, including what appears to be superior quality DACs and video upconvert chips compared to the V663 and V863; and of course Denon has had a very good reputation for quality sound for a long time. Though, the Onkyos look like they are a tad more expensive than equivalent Yamaha units.

Thanks.

I recommended the Yamaha 663 to her. The Onkyo she was looking at was an older closeout model with less features. She was fairly set on a Denon 883, then a 688. I really like Denon recievers, but for the same $500 the Yamaha looks to be a better choice.

Jack

 

[Seth=L]

Which units where you comparing against the RX-V663?

Onkyo's DACs and Yamaha's DACs are both Burr-Brown 192kHz/24-bit DACs used in all channels, I doubt there will be much if any difference at all. If one was to have an advantage I would speculate the Yamaha would have a much better integrated DAC, this speculation is based simply on that the Onkyo receivers seem to have a poorly integrated line of receivers (this is equivicable to the original Xbox gaming system and it's horrible integration, as a gaming system, making it a subpar performer given it's parts).

 

[skykeys]

Which units where you comparing against the RX-V663?

Onkyo's DACs and Yamaha's DACs are both Burr-Brown 192kHz/24-bit DACs used in all channels, I doubt there will be much if any difference at all. If one was to have an advantage I would speculate the Yamaha would have a much better integrated DAC, this speculation is based simply on that the Onkyo receivers seem to have a poorly integrated line of receivers (this is equivicable to the original Xbox gaming system and it's horrible integration, as a gaming system, making it a subpar performer given it's parts).

Hi Seth,

To answer your specific question, I "think" the rough equivalent in terms of models - pairs the Yamaha RX-V663 vs. Onkyo TX-SR805, and one level up is the RX-V863 vs. TX-SR875. If you think this is not accurate, please let me know.

I love Yamaha receivers and will continue to lean toward them for my next choice, which is not going to happen soon, because as I said previously, my older Yamaha RX-V620 works flawlessly and sounds great.

The only reason why I mention Onkyo is because of some info I saw in another thread somewhere - a link for which I can not find at the moment so I can't reference it right now. But it peaked my interest. Someone on that thread (who seemed to be knowledgeable about DACs) said that the Onkyo models mentioned above had higher quality DACs then the equivalent Yamahas, actually specifying the specific model numbers. (So even though both Onkyo and Yamaha use Burr-Brown, they are using different models within that brand - according to this guy.) I am wondering if the DAC is a big factor in determining audio quality??? (If I find the link, I'll edit this entry and add it.)

The new Onkyos also supposedly have a higher quality video upconvert technology. From what I've read in various threads, Onkyo 875 and 905 units are using the Reon VX chip for 1080p unconversion, while the new Denon 3808 and 4308 as well as the Yamaha RX-V863 are using a Faroudja chip for 1080p. Supposedly, this Reon technology is better than the Faroudja, so for video ability - theoretically the Onkyo should have better upconversion.


But, I also believe that Onkyo won't be as reliable as Yamaha. I have seen several threads on Amazon from people complaining of excessive heat from the Onkyo units. This can not be a good.

There is also an issue with the Onkyo DTS processor. Here is a comment from yet another thread. Referring to the Onkyo models, he says: ". . . The DTS-HD Masteraudio issue is where it gives a very loud popping sound sometimes which 'could' damage your speakers. It is a problem on several brands of Recievers right now and it's due to a specific chip set they use for the DTS-HD Masteraudio decoding. The Yamaha does not have this problem, not to mention Yamaha is a better brand in my opinion." http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?p=760618&posted=1#post760618

So there you go.

Regards.

 

[Zetram]

Yeah I'm having a similar dilema. I'm back and forth between 663 and Onkyo 705. It's a battle between price/reliablity against functionality/overall proformance.

 

[Bluesmoke]

Hi Seth,

To answer your specific question, I "think" the rough equivalent in terms of models - pairs the Yamaha RX-V663 vs. Onkyo TX-SR805, and one level up is the RX-V863 vs. TX-SR875. If you think this is not accurate, please let me know.

Regards.

The V663 is not in the same league as the 805. It's in between the 605 and 705, in terms of features and power. The 705 still has the extra HDMI input, making it on par with the V863. The 805 is closer to the Yamaha V3800 actually if you look at the specs.

Yeah I'm having a similar dilema. I'm back and forth between 663 and Onkyo 705. It's a battle between price/reliablity against functionality/overall proformance.

If you don't need the extra HDMI input, then go with the v663. The entire Onkyo like seems to have one issue or another. If they can work out the kinks and the overheating issues, then they would be better off!

 

[Zetram]

Yeah, well from what I've been seeing the popping issue is being solved with a firmware update and shouldn't be a problem on new models. Lip synching is a minor annoyance and readily fixable on top of the fact it is hit or miss. Heat is nothing a simple fan can't fix.

However from what I hear the 663 is like 605 in that it doesn't mix 5.1 tracks into 7.1. That is a real concern for me, because I don't have 7.1 yet I am definitely going to have it in a year or so.

 

[GlocksRock]

However from what I hear the 663 is like 605 in that it doesn't mix 5.1 tracks into 7.1. That is a real concern for me, because I don't have 7.1 yet I am definitely going to have it in a year or so.

It should be able to if it has a PLIIx decoder in it.

 

[johsti]

There is also an issue with the Onkyo DTS processor. Here is a comment from yet another thread. Referring to the Onkyo models, he says: ". . . The DTS-HD Masteraudio issue is where it gives a very loud popping sound sometimes which 'could' damage your speakers. It is a problem on several brands of Recievers right now and it's due to a specific chip set they use for the DTS-HD Masteraudio decoding. The Yamaha does not have this problem, not to mention Yamaha is a better brand in my opinion." http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?p=760618&posted=1#post760618

The loud popping also affects the Yamaha processor. Check link for more info
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1008620

There has also been a DSP firmware update for the Onkyo to correct this.
http://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.php?p=754392&postcount=12

 

[PENG]

I think Seth knows quite a bit about the 805/875 so he may correct me but for now I would say the 805 compares more closely with the RX-V1800 while the 875 is closer to the RX-V3800 in terms of features. Either Onkyo models have more power than the Yamaha models especially in terms of ACD.

 

[Seth=L]

The RX-V1800 more than likely has better scalers than the Onkyo (but not by much). The scalers in the TX-SR875 are far superior to the RX-V3800. The Onkyos are more stable with 4 ohm loads and have a higher dynamic headroom for intense passages. The smiling for Onkyo stops there. They are heavy, they are large (many people have trouble fitting them into their entertainment centers) and they produce large amounts of heat. I like the look of Yamaha products, especially the RX-V1800 on up, to the Onkyos.

 

[skykeys]

The RX-V1800 more than likely has better scalers than the Onkyo (but not by much). The scalers in the TX-SR875 are far superior to the RX-V3800. The Onkyos are more stable with 4 ohm loads and have a higher dynamic headroom for intense passages. The smiling for Onkyo stops there. They are heavy, they are large (many people have trouble fitting them into their entertainment centers) and they produce large amounts of heat. I like the look of Yamaha products, especially the RX-V1800 on up, to the Onkyos.

Hi Seth,

What do you mean by "scalers"? Can you explain what these are and what they do? Do you know how the "scalers" on the newer Yamaha models - RX-V663 and RX-V863 compare?

Thank you.

 

[Seth=L]

Hi Seth,

What do you mean by "scalers"? Can you explain what these are and what they do? Do you know how the "scalers" on the newer Yamaha models - RX-V663 and RX-V863 compare?

Thank you.

The RX-V663 has no scaler. I don't know how the scalers in the RX-V1800 and RX-V863 compare. A scaler, which is often incorrectly called an upconvertor, attempts to improve the image quality of standard definition material while bring the resolution to high definition. This does not mean that the material is of high definition quality, only that it's physical resolution is changed.

 

[mudrummer99]

I'm mildly confused about this receiver. I think I remember reading somewhere that this will not upscale analog to hdmi out. Did I read this here, I'm not sure? But on Yamaha's website it says analog to HDMI upconversion http://www.yamaha.com/yec/products/productdetail.html?CNTID=567571&CTID=5000300
(all the way at the bottom on the right) Am I just confused or what? especially since Seth just said that it does not have video scalers?? Thanks for the info and help as always.

Mike

PS This wont effect my decision on the receiver at all, the only non-HDMI unit I own is a XBOX and it shouldn't have a problem outputting that over HDMI, or am I mistaken about that as well?

 

[skykeys]

. . A scaler, which is often incorrectly called an upconvertor, . . .

Ah, yes. I am familiar with the "upconverter" term. I did not realize the correct term is "scaler".

Thank you for the info.

 

[GlocksRock]

I'm mildly confused about this receiver. I think I remember reading somewhere that this will not upscale analog to hdmi out. Did I read this here, I'm not sure? But on Yamaha's website it says analog to HDMI upconversion http://www.yamaha.com/yec/products/productdetail.html?CNTID=567571&CTID=5000300
(all the way at the bottom on the right) Am I just confused or what? especially since Seth just said that it does not have video scalers?? Thanks for the info and help as always.

Mike

PS This wont effect my decision on the receiver at all, the only non-HDMI unit I own is a XBOX and it shouldn't have a problem outputting that over HDMI, or am I mistaken about that as well?

The HDMI upconversion means that all analog signals inputted will be output on HDMI, for instance if you have a VCR that just uses the yellow composite video cable, you plug that into your receiver, and the video will be sent out to your tv via HDMI. This eliminates having to run multiple wires, to your tv, and means less input switching on your tv for when you want to use different components.

 

[mudrummer99]

The HDMI upconversion means that all analog signals inputted will be output on HDMI, for instance if you have a VCR that just uses the yellow composite video cable, you plug that into your receiver, and the video will be sent out to your tv via HDMI. This eliminates having to run multiple wires, to your tv, and means less input switching on your tv for when you want to use different components.

Thank you much glocks, for some reason it stuck in my head someone had said that this unit doesn't do it, but I probably imagined it. I should stick in reality a little more

Mike

 

[Zetram]

It should be able to if it has a PLIIx decoder in it.

Ok so after doing a little more digging it seems that it was DTS-MA that the 663 can't matrix into 7.1

 

[mudrummer99]

Alright, I did a lot of snooping around the net trying to find where I would have got the idea that this receiver doesn't upconvert analog to HDMI. It seems that I was not the only one under this impression. This unit does upconvert analog signals to HDMI but the best it will do is change the signal to a 480P as opposed to the 863 which will upscale it to a 1080P signal. A very tangible difference but, IMO, not worth the extra cash. There were several posters on other forums that were as confused as I was. I'm glad there are plenty of helpful people out there, as on here, that are really helpful. I will, with any luck, have this unit next week and getting it integrated into my system. Thanks again all.

Mike