Yamaha Announces the RX-V2700 and RX-V1700 !

[Phantomguy]

RXV- 2700/2600 problems seeing 720p PJs with DVI input

I hope I am not breaching any Posting Rules here ....
I have posted this problem under the RXV-2700 and 1700 because I have confirmed that this problem is common to the 2700 and the 2600 .. Here goes ..

Purchased BenQ PE8700+ 12 months ago. Proprietary delinterlace and scaler were hopeless esp on signals received thru DVI input. eg 1080i->540p and other lower resolutions the aspect ratio is impossible to get right... ssems as tho it is "dropping" vertical lines while maintaining width.. Also it doesnt seem to have any resizing to fill "full screen". Digital Cable signals even worse ... 30% compressed width but full height???? etc etc So gave up on the BenQ internal video processing

So 6 months ago after throrough reading the Yammie 2600 manual and discusing with Yammie customer support purchased the 260 to do all the video processing and just put native 720p into the 8700+. Also hoping the reduced load on the processor will stop fast motion "jaggies".

Found out much later that HDMI source input DOESNT UPSCALE (Shame!) 2700 same! So I have been attempting to upgrade just he analog sources input to the 2600 and using the HDMI MONITOR OUT to the DVI-I port of a BenQ PE8700+ 720p DLP Projector. But the ONLY options I get on the GUI to output are "Through" (no upscaling) and 576p (I'm running PAL so it the equivalent of your 480p).

Yamaha told me forcefully 6 months ago that it was the BenQ that needed an firmware update to its EDID table which is supposed to send back on DVI pin 7the DDC signal with Basic EDID and Extended EDID the display capabilty of the projector. It appeared at first that he BenQ had been programmed to send 576p (or 480p) whereas is should have been sending "I am a 720p"! BenQ claim there is no firmware upgrade for this and they are "sure" the EDID table would be correct (sure???? Yeah).

Later BenQ told me that the DVI port was NEVER fully implemented ... was just VESA standard for PC connection but not CE Standard for Broadcast Video. (Great they didnt tell me before I bought the BenQ one year ago .. or at least some time in the last year of constant hassling with them about various issues including poor de-interlacing and scaling by their onboard proprietary processor esp via DVI). Back to the Yammie ..

Earlier tonite I was reading a "white paper" on the incompatibity of PC based Vesa DDC and TV/Video based CE EDID .. and then I read a posting elsewhere on Audioholics of a problem which looked very much the same a mine. It quoted Yammie engineers allegedly confirming that there was an "undershoot" fault on the DDC line on all 2600s manufactures before April 2006 and there may be a Yammie fix for this (unclear). Anyone know about this?

But as of the last post their 6 months ago there was no solution.

Oh, by the way I got a similar result inputting both 2700/2600 to a Sharp XVZ2000 DVI port recently but in that case (worse) I could not even select 576p (480p) and the only choice was "Through". However the white paper suggested that same EDID tables (or is it HDMI senders?) may default to 576p (480p) where there is "no handshaking at all", but I tend to think in such as case the Yammie would just say HDMI error and/or HDCP error and give no display ???? .

Has anyone had this type of Problem Upscaling Yammie HDMI-> Projector DVI .. and solved it?

If NOT, Clint/Gene do you have any info on this incompatibility. I haven't yet seen a Review on the 2700, and I tried one last week into the BenQ DVI port and the Sharp DVI port in an attempt to sort out this problem but the results was identical to the 2600 ... that is it cant get upscaling above 576p (480p) (because 720p and 1080i are greyed out on the Yammie GUI)
Desparate Now.
P.G

 

[Phantomguy]

Rx-v2700 Major Dvi Compatability Issue!!!!

Here is an update on my posting earlier today.....

Well how is this for BAD news and BAD customer service from the CE industry ... gross customer neglect, in fact!

I managed to chase up with the Yamie 2700 Specialist Support this "supposed" problem of "undershooting" on the DDC line of the HDMI interface of the 2700/2600. Earlier this year they had logged with the Japan factory the problem of the inability to upscale in the GUI to 720p and 1080i for HDMI to DVI connections in the case of the VAST MAJORITY of display devices INCLUDING their own range of Yammie Plasma panels with DVI-D inputs which they were still supplying until 12-18months ago.

HE CONFIRMED THAT THE UNFORESEEN PROBLEM WAS THAT THE EXTENDED EDID DATA IN THE DVI (WHICH IS BASED ON VESA STANDARD FOR PC IS DIFFERENT TO THAT FOR CE WHICH THE HDMI USES) .... SO HDMI IS NOT 100% BACKWARD COMPATIBLE WITH DVI. I THINK THAT'S WHAT HE SAID.

Japan has refused to do anything about changing their software (for GUI) to accommodate users worldwide who have DVI ported displays as they consider it is a DVI problem not within the scope of the HDMI standards, even though they initially advertised and promoted the 2600 as DVI backward compatible.

In Feb 2006 the factory issue a bulletin making their network aware of this problem and making it clear that they will not provide any solution to this problem.

I asked the Yammie guy why couldnt they provide a manual intervention as was suggested in one industry white paper about 12 months ago (i.e. for customers to override and force an output resolution eg 720p out of the 2700/2600 much like we all used to do with PC Video card resolutions and where the Monitor could not support the setting we just went back and selected a lower setting). He replied that he was in no doubt Japan could do it if they wished and provide a firmware upgraded to load it, but he says Japan has the view that there is not enough customer demand/pressure to do this.

C'MON! HOW MANY CUSTOMERS ARE THERE WORLD WIDE THAT HAVE DISPLAYS WITH DVI -INPUT THAT ARE NOT YET READY TO THROW AWAY DISPLAYS THEY HAVE PURCHASED AND ARE ABOUT TO PURCHASE A 2700 OR 2600 OR A MARANTZ OR PIONEER OR DENON ETC FOR THAT MATTER.

MAYBE EVEN HDMI STANDRADS HAVE LOCKED US IN TOO MUCH ... WHY SHOULDN'T THAT STANDARD PROVIDE A FAILSAFE (OVERRIDE) FOR THIS TYPE OF PROBLEM.

FELLOW AUDIOHOLIUCS AND THE MILLIONS OF OTHERS OUT THERE NEED TO PUT PRESSURE ON THE HDMI STANDARDS CORP AND EQUIPMENT MANUFACTURERS TO NOT LEAVE US IN THE IN THE COLD AND HIGH AND DRY!

CLINT/GENE HOW CAN SE GET A BETTER DEAL FROM THE INDUSTRY ON THIS DISGRACEFUL SITUATION?

Hope us consumers have some power to get a fair deal.

What say you?
PG.

 

[RainMan]

Purchaced RX-V 2700 in Dec

Hi all, I replaced my Yamaha RX-V1000 with the RX-V 2700 in December. I thought I would share a bit of info after using it for a month.
I really like the unit ,took me two evening's to get it networked,as it would not come up at all on Window's medai player 11 for adding new hardware.
Window's has included media connect 2.0 in 11 ,but I had a terrible time getting Window's to recognise the 2700.
One complaint I have is ,at certain spot's of a movie ,the audio will mute as the amp's display goes from dolby digital to straight I believe it was?
No idea how to fix that one .
Great sound though ,I only wish I had room to do the front presence speaker's . The 2 channel enhancer work's well ,although it is made to help MP3's sound a little richer ( I never listen to MP3's ) instead I use the enhancer on low for my wave files streaming from my Computer .
If you spend enough time doing critical listening ,I think you will find the attack and decay in bass notes will not be quite as clean streaming the music from your computer ,although I think it is quit acceptable .
anyone else have any input on the RX-V2700?

 

[RainMan]

John,I also cannot get my Hidef cable box to work threw my 2700 with HDMI ,which really is a disappointment!
I had to use color stream ,and I cannot get an answer why it does not work . I get video for about 3 second's then a black screen with audio only ?
We had the same problem with a Marranz amp also ,so it's not just my 2700. I think I jumped into this game to soon

 

[mvrock]

Rainman,
Is your HDbox a Comcast box? I ask because I know this is a known problem with the Denon AVR2807. That's why I'm researching the Yamaha. Please let me know (because I have comcast boxes)

 

[posobilov]

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Hi Happy Yammi owner!

Could you help me?
I' cant to turn surraund mode from stereo mode in my Yamaha 2700. Screen is showing L and R front only. And I can't to find any buttoms to return it to surraund.

 

[RainMan]

Cable box

I have a Motorola PVR and it does not work threw my Yami amp ,but the HDMI will work directly to the Plasma . I have been hearing some interesting thing's regarding firmware upgrades .Sound's like a switching issue from what I'm hearing. What a shame ,as that was the whole idea of going to HDMI equipment ,to get rid of all those cables and have one input useon my Plasma . Thankfully the 2700 has upconversion.
BTW I work for a cable company (SHaw Cable here in Canada ) and all I was told is not to use the HDMI out .
Not the answer I wanted to hear,but hopefully it will get resolved ,but I have a bad feeling about it .

 

[RainMan]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Happy Yammi owner!

Could you help me?
I' cant to turn surraund mode from stereo mode in my Yamaha 2700. Screen is showing L and R front only. And I can't to find any buttoms to return it to surraund.

Are you not putting the remote's side buton to it's upper location ? That's the way I configured my amp ,as all the button's change function

 

[posobilov]

Are you not putting the remote's side buton to it's upper location ? That's the way I configured my amp ,as all the button's change function

Could you explain me this way with more ditail?

 

[RainMan]

Could you explain me this way with more ditail?

There is a button on the right hand side of the 2700 that say's amp,source or TV.
If you slide the button to the top position ,you will notice your remote will control the orange colored field's on the button's .
I don't know if this is of any help. I find it hard to believe you can't get off of R/L?

 

[fernalfer123]

I have a 1700 and a 5.1 surround setup. No sub right now on Pre-order. Should the movie be on Pro-Logic in the receiver? It just seems like the rear surrounds arent that loud and producing the right sound. When i hit the Surround decode button it seems to get better. But i thought that was just for 2 channel sources.

How do i get the right sound from the rears. I am using my HTIB receiver to play the movies for now. The HTIB is hooked to the Yamaha via HDMI.