Worst Period In Rock/Pop Music History???

A. Vivaldi

A. Vivaldi

Audioholic
<font color='#000000'><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Unfortunately, in this day and age, everything has a predetermined (re-short) lifespan. The marketing men now control the minds of teenagers and they feel they have to keep the wheel turning. Because it's like a wheel, if you live long enough, you'll hear the same things coming around.

If the likes of Bob Dylan, Led Zep or The Stones were to debut in this day and age, they'd be gone in a few months. At least you could rest assured that it would be back in a couple of months.
</td></tr></table> &nbsp;I have to say I beg to differ. Great music is great music, period, no matter when it comes out, and teenagers do not dictate what everyone listens to. Many people who started listening to Dylan were college folkies, and the audiences for prog rock bands were generally in their early to late 20's. There has always been bubble gum/schlocky/worthless music for teenagers. Watching a show like The Brady Bunch, one would never get the feeling that bands like Black Sabbath, Led Zepplin, Deep Purple or The Who even existed or were even popular, but they were. Who was Marcia's idol? Robert Plant? Ozzy? no, it was (ugh) Davy Jones (even the Monkees are better than a lot of todays crap). I know using The Brady Bunch is extreme, but it's an example of how the media tries to implant falsehoods in society. As for what goes around comes around? You may be right about that, but the likes of Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, etc. haven't came back around yet, and it's been 250 years!</font>
 
F

frkuhn

Audioholic Intern
<font color='#000000'>I think the problem is that great music is more and more underground and cult, and the success is more and more going towards the crap stuff.

I can't remember a huge sucessfull new act that showed up in the last ten years that has also huge quality (like Dylan or Zep), someone you know its gonna last at least 20 years.
</font>
 
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Rob Babcock

Rob Babcock

Moderator
<font color='#8D38C9'><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">You may be right about that, but the likes of Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, etc. haven't came back around yet, and it's been 250 years! </td></tr></table>

I wish they would!  That'd be something!  Their music is going strong, though.</font>
 
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U

Unregistered

Guest
Worst Period In Music.

I think that the late 1990s-today happens to be the worst, at least as far as mainstream radio goes. Up until the late 1980s, an interesting song could get substantial radio airplay in the United States. I mean, even in the late 1980s, you could still hear the occasional XTC or Julian Cope or Church song alongside the standard Paula Abdul/Duran Duran/Hall and Oates garbage.
 
Rock&Roll Ninja

Rock&Roll Ninja

Audioholic Field Marshall
canislupsi

Well I can say this: The era of 'rap' has only two good things come out of it. The Insane Clown Posse albums "The Great Milenko" and "The Amazing jeckel Brothers". Totally hilarious.

That having been said, I am a young pup who has just started (late at 25) the road to audiophile. I was 22 before i even knew you weren't supposed to listen to boomboxes & shelf systems! :eek:

Luckily, most of the greats have compiled "best of" and greatest hits albums. I respect the musical ability of David Bowie, but I am not buying his 23 studio albums in 2004, and The Rolling Stones didn't have very much good material that wasn't covered in the original 'Hot Rocks' collection.

I now return you to your regularly scheduled post.
 
Mudcat

Mudcat

Senior Audioholic
A. Vivaldi said:
Who was Marcia's idol? Robert Plant? Ozzy? no, it was (ugh) Davy Jones
How on earth did you know that????

A. Vivaldi said:
but the likes of Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, etc. haven't came back around yet, and it's been 250 years!</font>
There have been a few close calls in tha last hundred year though

John Brahms, Igor (John) Stravinsky, Pete Tchaikovsky, Sergi (Steve) Rachmaninoff, Ben Britten, Pete Gabriel, and Tony Carey, and since this an HT based forum, maybe Jon Williams.
 
M

mike_p

Audioholic Intern
frkuhn said:
<font color='#000000'>I think the problem is that great music is more and more underground and cult, and the success is more and more going towards the crap stuff.

I can't remember a huge sucessfull new act that showed up in the last ten years that has also huge quality (like Dylan or Zep), someone you know its gonna last at least 20 years.
</font>
lemme help your memory.. Radiohead

errr, maybe too underground?
 
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C

cornelius

Full Audioholic
Radiohead's music (one of our few hopes right now) unfortunately is few and far between. 25-30 years ago similar creative output was more commonplace. I'm very afraid that a lot of what happened musically not so long ago, is already a lost art. BTW, I'm not old enough to be an old fart.
 
F

frkuhn

Audioholic Intern
mike_p said:
lemme help your memory.. Radiohead

errr, maybe too underground?
Yep, Radiohead is a good one! :)

Please don't get me wrong, I'm not saying there are no good new acts. There are many, but they just don't get the success they deserve.
 
M

mike_p

Audioholic Intern
radiohead

I saw them live at Coachella a couple months ago.. I was completely blown away, I still get goosebumps thinking about it. I was completely shocked how good they sound live.. even with the mega speaker outdoor venue thing going on.. these guys are TRUE musicians in every sense of the word.

As far as I'm concerned every album (with the exception of their first) is a master-piece... can you tell I'm a huge fan. ;)

mike

frkuhn said:
Yep, Radiohead is a good one! :)

Please don't get me wrong, I'm not saying there are no good new acts. There are many, but they just don't get the success they deserve.
 
O

O'Shag

Junior Audioholic
Every era brings good and bad, even within one artist. Mozart - most of his stuff is pure magic, but some is mediocre (I know I know; Blasphemy!).

Bach, what can you say except he was a friggin genius - just listen to Concerto for two pianos: C minor (BWV 1060) C major (BWV 1061) D Minor (BWV 1063) D Major (BWV 1064) - He frolics effortlessly into the mathetmatical fabric of scale and harmonic structures, and then produces pure magic, (rather like Beckham taking a free kick from just outside the box). And he does all this while he's shagging his way to a heart attack (he fathered 21 children). But many of Bach's contemporaries were producing rubbish.

There's good and bad in every common era.

The 40s thru 60s - many great pieces of music, but many pieces of crap also. In the 60s -70s there was a lot of really uninspired stuff including most light pop and disco, but then there was Oscar Peterson (best Jazz piano player of all time IMHO), Creedance Clearwater Revival, ELP, J Tull, Who, Led Z, Jimi Hendrix, Floyd, even the Carpenters for God's sake (although I'm ashamed to admit that one) and many more. The 80s had a lot ogf good stuff - how about the Clash, the Pogues, The English Beat, VAN HALEN, etc. But as always, there were many really embarrassing ensembles where the point itself was hard to grasp let alone the possiblity of liking the music. Flock of Seagulls??? Does anyone remember what were they running so far away from? Probably themselves - with embarrassment.

The nineties - Oasis, Nirvana, Pearl Jam etc etc, but the wasteland of commercially popular boy-band over-scaley-warm n fuzzy- ultra-harmony-for no-good-reason, and rap music smothered everything.

Using commercially released music to qualify a choice of an era where things are pretty suckified, then it would seem to me there is less creative energy surfacing today than in times past (although I'm sure there's plenty of genius lurking in garages all over this most creative of countries). This could be alot to do with money-making 'machines' that churn out boy-bands, Madonna types(sorry but most of here stuff is pure shiite), Cher (a beautiful looking mongolian warbler in a Gee-string and holey fishnet stockings), and Britney Spears( although she is a hotty, and whoops I did it again on video can be rather arousing).

For me, I don't think there's one genre or any one particular era where I don't like something (mongolian warbling might be the exception). To be honest, much of the music of today may be reasonably considered shiite, but then again the raw energy and quality from some is compelling.

Eminem. Some of his lyrics put me off at first. But if you listen through some of the stupid nonsense in a lot of his lyrics, you start to hear some real talent. Watch 8 mile, and you have to admit the guy even has some acting ability.

I'll stop because I think I've been talking out my arse since the second paragraph. Anyway I love good music, even if its sung by the Bee Gees, or Johan Gambleputti de von dingle dangle dungle... of Ulm.
 
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fdrennen

fdrennen

Audiophyte
You're all right I remember way back when we listened to AM pop radio in the sixties we got a variety of stuff; Louie Armstrong, Frank Sinatra, The Beetles,Rolling Stones, James Brown, Broadway show tunes, Jazz, on and on. After the advent of dreaded Disco (Oy vey!), radio stations started to pedgeon-hole themselves and listening to one pop station every record sounds like the one they just finished playing. there are many culprits in this cultural mess we find ourselves in theese days, it starts with schools, when the budget crunch is on the first thing to go is music. In kindergarten when I attended all teachers in that grade played piano. Now teachers teach thier students a bunch of songs to maybe three tunes Old MacDonald, London bridges and twinkle twinkle little star, so kids grow up thinking thats all there is to music. So we have a generation beleiving that Rap and music are the same thing we have rap music an oxy-moron if I ever heard one.
 
J

jamiel

Audiophyte
the type of ignorant, defeatist attitude so prevalent in this thread is one that annoys me on many, many levels.

first of all, the logic in this thread seems to dictate that if the quality of Clear Channel radio goes downhill, the quality of music overall goes downhill also. i fail to see how that makes any sense whatsoever. yes, radio has become steadily worse over the years, as it becomes more homogenized and commercialized with certain conglomerates owning and hence controlling the output of virtually all media. payola, advertising, promotion, etc - money. money and its tightening grip on everything that exists is the problem. not the quality of the music scene. to think it is the latter is merely ignorant and illogical.

there are too many amazing albums being released for me to listen to, at the moment. the fact that very very very few current acts have actually been named in this thread leads me to suspect that virtually noone in this thread has even bothered to look for any new music. if you wait for music to be spoonfed to you while you sit there on your ***, of course you won't find anything. even just restricting it to this year, let alone the last few years or even the last decade as some nut suggested - a.c. newman, devendra banhart, guided by voices, wilco, sonic youth, of montreal, xiu xiu, tv on the radio, iron & wine, les savy fav, the polyphonic spree, !!!, the animal collective, deerhoof, mountain goats, french kicks, ratatat, modest mouse, sufjan stevens, magnetic fields, morrissey, gomez, john frusciante (guitarist in the red hot chili peppers), the beta band, stereolab, the walkmen, franz ferdinand, the liars, the secret machines, mission of burma, and the one am radio have all released lovely albums this year. and it's only july. how many of them have you guys heard? or have you just been listening to old stones records all year? and that list is even excluding hip hop (madvillain, blockhead...), jazz (brad mehldau...) and electronic music (mouse on mars...).

this inability or refusal to look beyond radio also reflects in some of the hilariously cliched comments on rap music. here's a tip, slick - most "fads" don't last three decades. i think people gave up dismissing rap as a "fad" in about 1992. the fact that some people are still persisting is hilarious (when's this whole punk fad going to die out then?). you guys are judging a gigantic, multi-faceted genre based upon about 0.000001% of what has been produced. how would you like it if some kid heard a Good Charlotte single on the radio and chose to take their crumminess as an indicator of the quality of Highway 61 Revisited or Revolver? or if someone heard Kenny * on the radio and chose to take that as an indicator of the quality of Headhunters or The Black Saint & The Sinner Lady? Because that's basically the equivalent of what you're doing. open your minds and listen to some Aesop Rock, Cannibal Ox, Mos Def, De La Soul, RJD2, Public Enemy, Aceyalone, Organized Konfusion, Atmosphere, Eyedea, Sage Francis or something.

the internet has provided more facility to discover new music than ever before. why you guys are chosing to ignore it completely is just baffling to me.
 
Mudcat

Mudcat

Senior Audioholic
Could it be that we have heard it and still don't like it?

But you do hit upon one very valid point that was made here in this thread, and that is to each their own, or whatever.
 
J

jamiel

Audiophyte
Mudcat said:
Could it be that we have heard it and still don't like it?
as I said, I am assuming that is not the case based on the fact it has not been mentioned. all that has been mentioned, with a couple of exceptions, is superstar MTV denizens like eminem and britney or generic references to "cRap music" (very original joke there btw, i've never heard that one before) or whatever. and also, most of the artists/bands that are positively mentioned are fairly lightweight stuff - the stones, pearl jam, oasis, generic metal - and don't exactly suggest superelitist taste which would exclude all of what i mentioned.
 
C

cornelius

Full Audioholic
ok, the music industry is filled with idiots, so we're not easily exposed to many of those pretty great artists mentioned by jamiel. But, I still think there is a musical side to the art of writing and playing music that is generally getting lost. It's up to some of these younger musicians to keep it alive. Best example today: Meshell Ndegeocello. Great songs, and her band can PLAY.
 
H

Haasenator

Enthusiast
Generational and Musical thing?

A the beginning of this thread everbody was putting down some very decent bands. Now my point is that people will generally like music from their era more because they grew up with it. I personally like things with heavy beats like electronic music and heavy rock. Personal preference. This is because I play drums and have for a long time now. You would be surprised how much of a effect drumming causes on your preference of music because you grow on music with heavy beats because you play it. My sister plays guitar and she likes things like Jimi Hendricks and Led Zeppling and she is only 17. So my point to say is that everbody likes different music because of age and musical instruments that they play. IMO poeple that don't play a musical instrument and then the put it down should have less say in the matter because they *sometimes don't know what they are talking about. All of this is just my opinion. ;)
 
P

Popsterman

Guest
Deterioration of pop music

Some interesting and valid points have been made here. I feel compelled to add a few thoughts of my own.

Firstly, I disagree with the guy who feels we should dedicate our lives to finding great hidden or unknown pop music out there. There isn't time and it's not our job.

It IS the job of the music industry and radio to select the best available music (which to them, in recent years, often means the worst) and bring it to the world.

They're certainly failing since little high quality pop music has been made or heard since about 1983. In addition, the music biz has been losing countless millions of dollars for many years now.

Two of the music industry's most embarrassing secrets are that back catalog material consistenly outsells new releases and more people over 30 listen to and buy "rock music" than people under 30. In other words, the Beatles are still outselling most of what's out there 34 years after they broke up -- and for many good and obvious reasons.

As a general rule, most of the truly great stuff will find you. If it doesn't, it wasn't really that great. Great pop music survives and is eventually heard by nearly everyone listening. The inferior stuff either doesn't get widely heard or is briefly promoted, disappears and is appropriately forgotten.

Regarding rap and hip hop (genres I consider to be mostly worthless sonic cancers that have largely forced quality pop music into a premature grave), it is astonishing that anything as mindless, negative, atonal and monotonous ever succeeded initially. It's even more incredible that it is still around annoying millions more than 25 years later. Rap and hip hop's extremely limited points were made within hours of their arrival decades ago and they've been endlessly repeating the same swill ever since.

Happily, rap and hip hop are very old news (finally) and the world has never been more ripe for a musical (and cultural) revolution that will wash away all the mountains of rubbish out there the way grunge music swept hair metal off the radar almost overnight.

Whether such a massive and long overdue musical sea change will ever happen remains to be seen, of course, but the need has never been greater in our time than it is today.

Regarding the laundry list of bands listed above, in my opinion, most of them are "off the radar" and not heard on the radio primarily because their songs tend to be weak, poorly written and uninteresting. I haven't heard all of them but I've heard enough of them to get a very good sampling.

The same sad tale is true if you visit original music clubs in, say, Manhattan. Not long ago I spoke to an intelligent, musically discriminating woman who managed a band that had played all over that market. When I asked her what was going on in the New York music scene, she gushed for a minute or two about how exciting it was, how many great bands there were and what great singing and playing she had heard. When she was done, I asked her if she had heard any great original songs. She paused and I already had my answer. "No," she said with evident disappointment in her voice.

Of course most bands are writing and promoting rubbish -- it's all they've heard on the radio and in clubs for close to two decades now. Garbage in, garbage out.

While I haven't given up on popular music, you could have turned your radios off in 1983 and not missed much of anything in the 21 years since.

I hope one day soon that changes for the better.

Scott in NJ aka Popsterman
 
U

Unregistered

Guest
I agree with everything you've said, except for this: 'While I haven't given up on popular music, you could have turned your radios off in 1983 and not missed much of anything in the 21 years since.'

I would place the beginning of the demise of 'good' music about 10 years later - the mid '90s, right about the time that grunge and rap started to be 'mainstream'.
 
U

Unregistered

Guest
it may sound bizzare but there are some death metal bands these days that are almost bringing back the classical music and adding a lot more edge, even though these bands dont have orchestras behind them but synths...the sounds mix together very well

the guy who said that grunge bands were not talented, hasnt listend to alice in chains, soundgarden, or pearl jam, alot of the musicianship in these bands is outstanding. as for nirvana their songs had a catch like the beatles, infact kurt cobain listened to the beatles and other 60s pop up until he was about 11-12 (i think thats the age) when he was loaned a led zeppelin album.

keep your ears out for these orchestral metal bands this may be a kindof comeback
 

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