Whole House audio referral in Dallas

[McDuffer]

Greetings, I'm the typical guy with a pre-wired house that is in over his head. Who do you know in this area that can help? Thanks!

I've spent a lot of time trying to research which system is best for the money I want to spend ($3-4k) and am ready to throw up my hands and let someone help me. I'm not a fan of the couple of experts that I have talked to locally as they want to install what they think is cool and not what I want, so any help is much appreciated.

Wire installer wanted to install Elan system. Looks great, don't need all the automation/video options and it was pricey ($8-10k).

I've been looking at Channel Plus, Xantech and Aton if that helps.

My general needs:
- 12-14 zones (about 6 would be heavier use than the others)
- Prefer the option for 4-6 sources (including MP3 or harddrive of music, but don't have any ipod at this point)
- want to play different sources in different rooms and control the sources from the rooms
- pretty much background music type use only
- don't need video or home automation

My general setup at this point (I have detailed spec sheet if needed):
- All wiring to central closet
- 2 Cat5 wires to control boxes in each room
- speaker wires to control boxes in each room
- most rooms already have 6" or 8" Polk speakers as well
- Separate surround system already installed (wire connection to central closet)

 

[InTheIndustry]

Greetings, I'm the typical guy with a pre-wired house that is in over his head. Who do you know in this area that can help? Thanks!

I've spent a lot of time trying to research which system is best for the money I want to spend ($3-4k) and am ready to throw up my hands and let someone help me. I'm not a fan of the couple of experts that I have talked to locally as they want to install what they think is cool and not what I want, so any help is much appreciated.

Wire installer wanted to install Elan system. Looks great, don't need all the automation/video options and it was pricey ($8-10k).

I've been looking at Channel Plus, Xantech and Aton if that helps.

My general needs:
- 12-14 zones (about 6 would be heavier use than the others)
- Prefer the option for 4-6 sources (including MP3 or harddrive of music, but don't have any ipod at this point)
- want to play different sources in different rooms and control the sources from the rooms
- pretty much background music type use only
- don't need video or home automation

My general setup at this point (I have detailed spec sheet if needed):
- All wiring to central closet
- 2 Cat5 wires to control boxes in each room
- speaker wires to control boxes in each room
- most rooms already have 6" or 8" Polk speakers as well
- Separate surround system already installed (wire connection to central closet)

12 - 14 zones for $3-4K with all of the features you want?

My initial response is... Well, we all want things but that doesn't mean it can be done realisticly. Technology today is great and all, but the thing that grants wishes hasn't been invented yet.


Traditional whole house audio system hardware to do what you're asking retails around $6.5-$8k before installation and without sources. Nuvo is the nicest, cheapest traditional whole house audio system that's worth a damn and that's roughly where you're going to be priced with them.

HOWEVER..... That's traditional keypad stuff. While I'm still a Nuvo dealer, I've used it once in 2 years.

www.Sonos.com and never look back!

You won't have cute light up wall pads, but you will have state of the art streaming audio. Any internet radio stations in the world, anything you want streamed off of Rhapsody, Pandora radio, Sirius is available as well. All from one, wirless box.

You can add volume controls, etc. or just cover up the wires in each room with a blank plate. You will want a few iPod touches for control. All in all, you're probably around $500 a room, which is CHEAP for whole house audio like what you're trying to do. If you really NEED to be able to play different things in each room at the same time, you're still around $6k, but that includes sources (the Sonos box is the source).

Really try to decide if you need that many seperate sources in seperate zones. If NOT, then try to section off how your home will really be used and break it down from there. Also, it's incredibly simple to instal. So, you won't have huge labor costs if you decide to not do it yourself.

Hope this helps and that you get that I was teasing you in the begining.

 

[BMXTRIX]

I'm gonna agree and say that you've set a budget without a freakin' clue of what things actually cost.

12 zones of amplification, 30 watts per channel, new amplifiers (2) - $1,200 PER AMPLIFIER

Distributed audio pre-amp, 6 sources, 6 rooms, about $1,000 per unit, you need 2.

Speakers - 12 pairs! - $120 for a halfway decent set, - $1,440

Keypads, 12 - $150 each (pretty easily) - $1,800

No video, no installation, just pure mid-level materials - Almost $8,000

Add in about 40 hours of labor to get everything fully programmed, tested, installed, working, and warranteed...

This would be a reasonably priced installation at around $10,000 - $12,000.

So, how exactly did you come up with your budget?

 

[McDuffer]

Maybe the title should have been "Clueless in Dallas"

Thanks for the information and help guys, I appreciate it. I probably am off my rocker on the pricing, but I guessed at the cost based on two very feeble pieces of information:

1- Neighbors who have simply run a big amp or two controlled by their iphone that plays a single source. Most have done it for around $1k - $1.5k using used amps.

2- The sellers who will supply basic Channel Plus MDS-6a kits (or similar other products) with the amp and keypads for just over $1k per 6 rooms. Maybe these are junk or they can't really be set up by yourself, but I don't know that.

I already have the speakers and could easily just use 6 zones for now since my kids are small, but I would like to have the ability to move up to more zones later.

I had looked at Sonos, but figured the few thousand I already had in wiring and speakers would just be wasted if I went that route (assuming there is no way to get the Sonos signal to the speaker cables hanging out of a double gang box next to my light switch in every friggin' room).

Anyone know any good installers in Dallas? Thanks again, I appreciate the education guys!

 

[InTheIndustry]

Thanks for the information and help guys, I appreciate it. I probably am off my rocker on the pricing, but I guessed at the cost based on two very feeble pieces of information:

1- Neighbors who have simply run a big amp or two controlled by their iphone that plays a single source. Most have done it for around $1k - $1.5k using used amps.

2- The sellers who will supply basic Channel Plus MDS-6a kits (or similar other products) with the amp and keypads for just over $1k per 6 rooms. Maybe these are junk or they can't really be set up by yourself, but I don't know that.

I already have the speakers and could easily just use 6 zones for now since my kids are small, but I would like to have the ability to move up to more zones later.

I had looked at Sonos, but figured the few thousand I already had in wiring and speakers would just be wasted if I went that route (assuming there is no way to get the Sonos signal to the speaker cables hanging out of a double gang box next to my light switch in every friggin' room).

Anyone know any good installers in Dallas? Thanks again, I appreciate the education guys!

You're right to assume the channel plus stuff isn't what you want.

Sonos is still the perfect solution for you. If you want 6... Buy six ZP120 and a Zone extender (plug this into your router), wirenut the speaker pair together in the wall where the opening is, put a blank wall plate over the hole.

The End. That's a $3k investment for your six rooms. Control wise, buy one or two iPod touch and/or an iPad. You can also control everything from any/all PCs in your house. Our clients absolutely love this system and never have problems with it.

*NOTE: The wire and speakers aren't wasted at all because they will be hooked up to the individual Sonos amps/zone player in your home run closet. If you need extra coverage for the remotes, plug in an extra zone extender or two around your house.

Edit: Sorry, don't know any installers in Dallas. As was mentioned with installers - The probabilities of you finding one to take your interests at heart and sell you something like Sonos is slim. There's less money in it for dealers because the margins are slimmer than keypad based systems so many don't carry or recommend it. Dealers also can't charge a high labor amount to instal it because it's virtually preprogrammed. If you have your mind/heart made up to get a keypad based system you're going to spend more money and get less of everything: Quality of sound, features, etc. But, in a way, you'll at least be getting what you "want". Good luck to you in your search!

 

[BMXTRIX]

A lot of this all depends on how much you are willing and capable of doing yourself vs. highering someone. Installing speakers, while easy, is still time consuming. From an installer viewpoint, if you own speakers, the installer still has the headache of ensuring that the speakers will fit in the space where the wires go to, they then need to make sure that every single wire is properly labelled on both ends so that it can be properly found, then the hole must be cut with care to ensure that no ceiling joists are inadvertently hit. It must then be connected to the amplifier, preferably with some sort of clean connection (banana plugs, etc.) and then tested. It's at least an hour of work per speaker pair to get installed. No keypads, no programming yet. This is also almost the baseline requirement no matter what system you intend to use. So, individual zones, or one big zone, this time and effort will be the same.

Obviously, a big difference between 6 zones and 12 zones when we are breaking it down like this.

Now, you look at a single amplifier setup, with in-room volume controls or a volume control/speaker selector, and a couple of used amps, and you can CERTAINLY do this system for not a lot of cash. Save more by doing it on your own even. It may not be pretty, but it can be done.

I always go with what I'm familiar with, which is Crestron, and tends to be more expensive, but I pair it with used/b-stock gear and it isn't outrageous as it could be. But, I do like the Sonos as a workable idea and you keep your in-ceiling speakers.

Put a bunch of these where the wires need to connect...
http://www.sonos.com/products/zoneplayers/zp120/default.aspx?rdr=true&LangType=1033

Then put your in-ceiling speakers in.

Of course, for 12 zones, it's $6,000 and you still need to get individual controllers for everyone and it isn't installed, and there are no speakers included.

The flip side would be to get everything you can used and do as much work as you can yourself.

If I were looking at something like this:
12 pairs of in-wall or in-ceiling speakers - $80/pr - $960
2 - 6 zone 30wpc amps - b-stock - $600/ea. - $1,200
12 - 12 button keypads (each room) - $100 - $1,200
2 - 8 zone preamps - $500 - $1,000
1 - Controller w/power supply - $500
Installation & programming - $3,000

So, about $8,000.

The speakers aren't terribly expensive (or overly impressive), but everything else would be rock solid and give you a lot of capability.

This is a typical multi-zone installation without wiring and there would be some extra hardware required and it would be a VERY good system. But, using used gear. So, there is several thousand in cost savings which can be gained by going with used gear.

 

[wblankenbaker]

Check HTD or Breathe Audio

HTD systems or a Breathe Audio system will give you what you want in your price range, but I can't comment on the quality as I've not used the system myself. I'm going through a whole house audio decision process right now, and have started a blog about the options. Just wrote a post on systems under $1000. While these are generally 6 zones or less, you can tie two of these together and get 12 zones for around $2000. That does not include source equipment, speakers, or wiring. But does include keypads and the controller. These are DIY systems, so if you want help with the install, you'll have to find someone in your area with some AV expertise.

Here is a link to my blog where you can read more: wholehouseaudio.wordpress.com Look for the post called "2011 Buyer's Guide: Wired Systems Under $1000"

 

[McDuffer]

Like many others, I landed on Sonos

Thanks to the board for the expertise and knowledge. I installed the first few Sonos zones over the weekend and after some initial network problems, it is up and running.

Great system, love the functionality. It will cost a little more to do the entire house, but the gains in functionality are worth it. I also know that I can go wtih me vs spending on all of the keypads....

 

[WaynePflughaupt]

Looks like I’m late to the party, but my son is a professional installer in Dallas with 10 years experience, and has worked for some of the major home theater and commercial A/V companies there. PM me if you would like his phone number.

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt

 

[InTheIndustry]

Thanks to the board for the expertise and knowledge. I installed the first few Sonos zones over the weekend and after some initial network problems, it is up and running.

Great system, love the functionality. It will cost a little more to do the entire house, but the gains in functionality are worth it. I also know that I can go wtih me vs spending on all of the keypads....

You tried it?!?!?!?!?!

Awesome! Glad you enjoy it and I appreciate you going out on a limb and trying something many would view as outside the box.

Let us know how you like it moving forward!