velodyne SPL 1200 vs DLS 5000R

[Sheep]

Ohh yes I am so against SVS that I want an SB12 for a 2ch setup.

Ok, if you want one, why do you hate them?

And please point out where I stated that all velodyne subs are better than SVS. Please point out where I said that. Hell point out just one time where I even compared any specific two.

Ok..

My friend has a PB-12/2 sitting at his house and I got to mess with it the other day. While it has huge output which makes it perfect for movies, in music it lacks some accuracy compared to other subs like REL and some Velodynes

You have nothing so now you just decide to make **** up. But it's just a huge conspiracy, I went to my friend's house to sabotage his PB12/2.

Until you read up on bias, I can't continue this conversation. Happy to re-convene when your finished though.

SheepStar

 

[billy p]

You're going to tell my SVS is the only company that has done that on AH?

Search any MBM-12 thread and look for Peter Marks. He's in every one.

SheepStar

Yea, but Peter doesn't hide who is is! Its the people who had hidden agendas, whom worked for the aforementioned companies that AH had issues with?

PS: I can't believe this thread.

 

[furrycute]

Well said!

Yea, but Peter doesn't hide who is is! Its the people who had hidden adgendas and work for the aforementioned companies that AH and issues with?

 

[kenhoeve]

wow, I had no idea I could be so controversial.

I'll start off by saying that objective measurements are difficult to get for every electronic and architectural setup. I live for sites like this to get me the skinny on the fundamentals, but I gotta say that it is the demo run that sells me in my space.

So you ask what objective measurement would I rely on to say that one sub is tighter than another? I call it repetition. There is a certain song that I absolutely adore by John Mayer Trio named "Out of my Mind". Pino Palladino plays bass for the trio and I go completely numb everytime I hear this guy play. Anyway, I know this song so well and know how each note feels so well, that I use it to demo speakers. I've found that if I demo blues, the setup is best for my needs and I can select speakers based on it. I've probably listened to this particular song maybe 400 or so times based on iTunes.

Long story short, that is why I thought the Velo was tighter than the Svs. And for comparison I have a car with a sub and that thing is just sloppy, so I do know what ''I" mean when I say "tighter".

But for the last time... YMMV.

 

[Sheep]

Yea, but Peter doesn't hide who is is! Its the people who had hidden agendas, whom worked for the aforementioned companies that AH had issues with?

PS: I can't believe this thread.

The SVS guys didn't either. It was their freaking names.

SheepStar

 

[furrycute]

The SVS marketing people regularly disguise themselves as regular consumers and post made up favorable reviews of SVS products. This marketing practice is shady and highly unethical.

Plus now the SVS marketing group has resorted to scare tactics to silence their critics. I just received a PM from mazersteven telling me that "my days are numbered." Now he has become the official SVS hitman?

The SVS guys didn't either. It was their freaking names.

SheepStar

 

[tomd51]

Sure they do, just like every other conspiracy, Lee Harvey...

 

[furrycute]

The Truth about SVS Revealed

Read it for yourself. It is a fact.

Sure they do, just like every other conspiracy, Lee Harvey...

 

[jinjuku]

Yea, but Peter doesn't hide who is is! Its the people who had hidden agendas, whom worked for the aforementioned companies that AH had issues with?

PS: I can't believe this thread.

Reading through this thread and here is what I can't believe:

The OP was asking about one Velo vs another Velo. I and another poster or two in a round about way suggested thinking 'outside the box'. Told the OP that you may want to expand your search criteria. I specifically mentioned ED and Epik. Others mentioned HSU and SVS.

Here is where the problem starts, Furrycute comes out swinging with statement that is tantamount to accusing people that are onlytrying to help of being 'fanboys'. That is straight up disrespectful.

Velodyne makes a good subwoofer, I have had the chance to at length listen to three of their offerings. One of those was a direct A/B between the DLS-4000 and the eD-A5 350. That for the same amount of money was a no contest. That is why the recommendation was made in the first place. Yes WAF came into the equation a few posts later.

FYI, both subs where setup in the same location and had the same settings. Even ran the receivers auto-eq for both.

To this whole thing about SVS's marketing: When you put a SVS and Velo in a room and start the square off, it's not like one of their employees is stuffed inside the sub making it sound better. GET OVER IT.

To the OP: If you got a killer price on the Velodyne that is great. I wouldn't pass it up either. If you paid full price and came here to solicit peoples experienced opinion and didn't at least check it out, I really don't care. You weren't buying it with my money.

To Furrycute: Still don't know what your problem or your point is. All this yammering and you still haven't made a real contribution to this thread. Maybe your thanks rating is where it's at compared to the number of posts you have for a reason.

 

[tomd51]

The only point he's trying to make is that he's got a personal vendetta against SVS. He doesn't care to offer any positive input, only negative, that's been the one consistent to his postings.

And if you consider this an attack on your character, you're right, it is due to immature behavior exhibited.

Do me a favor, prove me right one more time by saying "it's a fact" and create a link to a thread of an incident you had absolutely no part of...

 

[billy p]

OK Thanks I will see if I can buy the two SLP 1200 and take my DLS 5000 back

these are the only two subs I realy wanted to know about if I had not found the two SPL 1200 for sale I may have looked at a different sub I just wanted to know how these two compare to each other


Thanks Tim

Please read the above caption!! They where the only recommendations he was looking for velo vs. velo not vs. ........? It happens far to often!

Regards, Billy P

 

[jinjuku]

Please read the above caption!! They where the only recommendations he was looking for was velo vs. velo not vs. ........? It happens far to often!

The alternate interpretation of the OP is that he was a noob and didn't know what he didn't know. That is a possibility.

 

[kenhoeve]

Care to explain the protocol for drawing the conclusion? Were these results what you perceived from just a plain audition, or was proper blind testing done? The terms say a lot about the end result.

SheepStar

Sheep-

I completely respect your perspective and your experience. I am a student of objective data myself, after all, I am an engineer(in fact, licensed).

That said, there is something to be said for those who have a lengthy audio experience. I've been putting together systems since I was 17, and that was 15 years ago. I've heard many, many, very exemplary systems, both car and home. During that time I'll admit I haven't always had the instrumentation to document exactly what I've heard. In fact I never have. But I am confident that I know what sounds good and what does not. I don't claim to hear difference between speaker wire, and I don't think RCA quality makes a damn difference.

That said, I do not intend to say that my opinion rivals those who test and document performance of current technology(on a level basis, that is very very, valuable.). But I will say that I can use fairly qualitative descriptions to describe what I do hear. I don't split hairs, the differences I mention would be easily discernible by any enthusiast(and any average Joe with a little instruction). I.e, I don't use esoteric language like "warm". I can hardly see how language such as "tight" is esoteric in the subwoofer world..

My current system is many times better than yours(no offense intended), and I have heard many better. It may seem trite when I say that one sub is tighter than another, but rest assured that if I do so I am comparing two components with relatively small differences. I know what money can buy, and bashing cheaper equipment just isn't my deal. In the mid-fi arena, it is the small differences that count. You can't always rely on a simple review of one item to be the end all.

I suppose my thesis would say that objective performance data is no doubt king. But if you put a couple fairly equal items together on a level platform with an experienced listener, there is no reason to poo-poo a couple of simple qualitative descriptions.

Sponging what I'm spilling?

 

[Sheep]

Sheep-

I completely respect your perspective and your experience. I am a student of objective data myself, after all, I am an engineer(in fact, licensed).

That said, there is something to be said for those who have a lengthy audio experience. I've been putting together systems since I was 17, and that was 15 years ago. I've heard many, many, very exemplary systems, both car and home. During that time I'll admit I haven't always had the instrumentation to document exactly what I've heard. In fact I never have. But I am confident that I know what sounds good and what does not. I don't claim to hear difference between speaker wire, and I don't think RCA quality makes a damn difference.

That said, I do not intend to say that my opinion rivals those who test and document performance of current technology(on a level basis, that is very very, valuable.). But I will say that I can use fairly qualitative descriptions to describe what I do hear. I don't split hairs, the differences I mention would be easily discernible by any enthusiast(and any average Joe with a little instruction). I.e, I don't use esoteric language like "warm". I can hardly see how language such as "tight" is esoteric in the subwoofer world..

My current system is many times better than yours(no offense intended), and I have heard many better. It may seem trite when I say that one sub is tighter than another, but rest assured that if I do so I am comparing two components with relatively small differences. I know what money can buy, and bashing cheaper equipment just isn't my deal. In the mid-fi arena, it is the small differences that count. You can't always rely on a simple review of one item to be the end all.

I suppose my thesis would say that objective performance data is no doubt king. But if you put a couple fairly equal items together on a level platform with an experienced listener, there is no reason to poo-poo a couple of simple qualitative descriptions.

Sponging what I'm spilling?

Yes, I don't have the equipment to document what I have heard either, but I do try to find it the information. I also realize that BIAS plays a much bigger role in all of this.

I can't even remember what the hell was going on in this thread to begin with...

Here we go

My neighbor got the svs pb13 ultra on my recommendation based on this forum. I have the velo 1500R and we paid almost the same $. The velo won hands down on music, it is just tighter. The svs was the cinema winner for impact. YMMV.

This statement leads me to believe that you chose the subwoofer you bought over the other, simply because you forked out money, thusly influencing your opinion. You claim it was tighter, yet you say you don't like playing into those words (which are necessary to describe what we're hearing). You can't measure tighter, but you can measure FR, Distortion, Group Delay, and obviously the equipment itself (amplifier, driver T/S parameters, box resonance).

Given these factors you can form a good opinion without hearing anything, if you understand them. The new measurements on the PB13-Ultra lead me to believe it is a better subwoofer then the 1500R.

PB-13ultra Measurements via AVtalk.
http://www.avtalk.co.uk/forum/index.php?t=msg&th=22950&start=0&rid=0&SQ=0

SPL-1500R via AVtalk.
http://www.avtalk.co.uk/forum/index.php?t=msg&th=22064&start=0&rid=0&SQ=0

You preferred the sound, that is fine. But to say "Hands down it was tighter" would technically be misleading, as most people ascribe THD with tightness. Clearly the Velodyne has more.

That is why I asked how you form that opinion. Saying hands down it's better means it technically is better, which it appears to be not.

SheepStar