Usher S 520

[Vin2.1guy]

Update:

The email I sent to www.MusikMatters.com was replied to (not bad: it was sent and replied to over the weekend) and they do ship to customers not close to a Usher distributor.

$400 plus shipping, which they did not mention. I wonder what that would be? Each speaker weighs about 15lbs. each, so figure 30-40lbs. with box and packing...around $50?

I'll email them back and ask, and see what finishes they have, I'm partial to the wood veneer, but the black piano looks great as well.

Once I know how much that is and if it is reasonable, then I'll make my final decision out of all the speakers I've been considering, based off of reviews and price (including shipping).

 

[pearsall001]

This seems to be what I've been hearing.

But where do you find them if there is no dealer near you? I looked on Ebay and Audiogon and found nothing, plus I'd rather buy them new and direct from a authorized seller anyway.

Anyone know where I can?

And thanks for all the replys so far!

Stephen Monte (owner) of Quest for Sound in Bensalem, PA. carries the full Usher line along with other fabulous speakers. Give him a call & he will show you what customer service is all about. The man is a gem when it comes to dealing with people in the audio field. I personally have dealt with Stephen on numerous occasions & love just going to his place on a Sat & spending the day just shooting the breeze & listening to music is his many demo rooms. If you do talk to him tell him Phil sent you, (I have the AAD 2001 monitors & the CJ from him). He'll know me well. Good luck on your quest. By the way the Usher line is fabulous!! http://www.questforsound.com/

Phil

 

[Davemcc]

Dave - That's great and I respect the impression you had on that setup. I haven't had a demo of that manufacturer so thanks for the heads-up, it's on my short list. I'll play advocate and say, "Dave, cmon now....you know you can, come to papa...yea, reach, reach baby...the wallet will work...."

Mark

That's the problem. The wallet will work for the D4, DTC-9.8 and SMS-1 in one fell swoop, but I don't want it to. Restraint is HARD.

Re: Epos - The Epos bookshelf speakers were actually my wife's number one favorite of all the speakers we auditioned. I was not as impressed with the Epos towers.

Re: Usher S-520 - I've been wondering about some specs on the Ushers that I'm not sure how to interpret.

Sensitivity: 86dB/1M
Impedance: 8 ohms nominal
Power Handling: 50 watts

The way I read this is that it's not a very sensitive speaker and at 86 dB. It's going to want some power to drive it properly. But then they rate it at 50 watts power handling, which leads me to think it will shred when fed the juice that it's sensitivity suggests it needs. Now I understand that most of the time it will be handling just one or two watts, but it seems to me that transient peaks could easily easily overwhelm this speaker (especially if using a receiver that could send out clipped peaks when it runs out of power supply).

It appears to be a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. The sensitivity would demand that it be driven, but the power handling suggests it's somewhat fragile.

 

[mazersteven]

The way I read this is that it's not a very sensitive speaker and at 86 dB. It's going to want some power to drive it properly. But then they rate it at 50 watts power handling, which leads me to think it will shred when fed the juice that it's sensitivity suggests it needs. Now I understand that most of the time it will be handling just one or two watts, but it seems to me that transient peaks could easily easily overwhelm this speaker (especially if using a receiver that could send out clipped peaks when it runs out of power supply).

It appears to be a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. The sensitivity would demand that it be driven, but the power handling suggests it's somewhat fragile.

The day I auditioned the Ushers. I (We) where using a 200 watt amp. I don't think you have to worry about over juicing them.

 

[Davemcc]

The day I auditioned the Ushers. I (We) where using a 200 watt amp. I don't think you have to worry about over juicing them.

That's what I'd like to do to eliminate clipping and/or distortion of any kind. But the Op's situation ("I have a vintage Pioneer SX 980 receiver I'll run it with and an Outlaw LFM-2 sub to pair it with, and I listen to mostly rock/pop") might present a challenge getting the volume he wants without clipping and distortion. I'm just thinking that there may be a mismatch between low sensitivity speakers, vintage receiver and loud rock/pop.

I don't want to dump on the Ushers. I'm the only one that voted for them in the recent Bookshelf Shootout Thread. I'm quite intrigued with the Ushers, but these specs throw me a bit and I just want to make sure the OP gets the best for his situation. Call it due diligence.

 

[Vin2.1guy]

That's the problem. The wallet will work for the D4, DTC-9.8 and SMS-1 in one fell swoop, but I don't want it to. Restraint is HARD.

Re: Epos - The Epos bookshelf speakers were actually my wife's number one favorite of all the speakers we auditioned. I was not as impressed with the Epos towers.

Re: Usher S-520 - I've been wondering about some specs on the Ushers that I'm not sure how to interpret.

Sensitivity: 86dB/1M
Impedance: 8 ohms nominal
Power Handling: 50 watts

The way I read this is that it's not a very sensitive speaker and at 86 dB. It's going to want some power to drive it properly. But then they rate it at 50 watts power handling, which leads me to think it will shred when fed the juice that it's sensitivity suggests it needs. Now I understand that most of the time it will be handling just one or two watts, but it seems to me that transient peaks could easily easily overwhelm this speaker (especially if using a receiver that could send out clipped peaks when it runs out of power supply).

It appears to be a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. The sensitivity would demand that it be driven, but the power handling suggests it's somewhat fragile.

The UK HI FI world review addresses this issue:

"The nominal 8 ohm impedance and reasonable sensitivity will ensure wide amplifier compatibilty..."

In the measurements they claim that impedance never dips below 7ohms and that "the Ushers will not be difficult to drive".

This can be read here (enlarge the scan) :

http://www.usheraudio.com/news/Hi Fi World Dec 06 S-520/index.htm

Also, Chris Martens from avguide.com actually compared the Usher directly to the Epos els3 (which are/were high on my list I might add, and the M5's look great but are a little more than what I want to pay) in his review of it and said that he found the Usher's can: "handle heavily modulated passages and fast-rising transients...with much greater freedom from compression or constriction than their competition." He goes on to say that: "the Ushers managed to play cleanly at volume levels where the Epos els 3 where starting to show traces of audible compression." That review can be found here: http://www.usheraudio.com/news/Poland-S520.pdf (I think I already included this link before, and ignore the "poland" thing, it's in English).

So if the Epos which have 4 ohm impedance and 87 sensitivity (right?) can play well loudly, and the Usher's can beat them out (according to this guy at least) at this, then I don't think the Usher's specs are a problem. I've also read that they sound great loud or at low volumes. I prefer moderate volumes anyway, if I want to crank something I'll use my BIC's.

But anyway, like I mentioned, I have a vintage Pioneer receiver and I've heard that back when it was made (late 70's) wpc were measured honestly or differently than now. So although it "only" has 80wpc, it is very loud and powerful, and if it were measured today would have something more like around 120-150 wpc or even more. I know it's as loud or louder than any of my friend's newer high wpc receivers or amps (we've hooked it up to their systems just to see how it would handle them and on two channels playing anyway it usually is louder than the newer equipment or at least as loud), and it literally kills my early 90's Kenwood reciever which is measured at 80wpc, it makes it sound like the anemic wimp it is. Actually, I have a smaller vintage Pioneer as well with "only" 35 wpc and that thing at least matches my Kenwood with supposed 80wpc.

Either way, I could always upgrade with a larger vintage receiver or amp (they made some insane ones that went up to 200 wpc as measured back then, you can find some info. on those here: http://jbmanuals.free.fr/web/monsterreceiver/ ) or even a newer one, though I prefer vintage components.

 

[Vin2.1guy]

That's what I'd like to do to eliminate clipping and/or distortion of any kind. But the Op's situation ("I have a vintage Pioneer SX 980 receiver I'll run it with and an Outlaw LFM-2 sub to pair it with, and I listen to mostly rock/pop") might present a challenge getting the volume he wants without clipping and distortion. I'm just thinking that there may be a mismatch between low sensitivity speakers, vintage receiver and loud rock/pop.

I don't want to dump on the Ushers. I'm the only one that voted for them in the recent Bookshelf Shootout Thread. I'm quite intrigued with the Ushers, but these specs throw me a bit and I just want to make sure the OP gets the best for his situation. Call it due diligence.

And I appreciate it!

I made my post above before I read this one, and it addresses some of the things you mention. Briefly:

The Usher's are supposed to be good at playing loudly without distorting.

The Pioneer is no wimp, it in fact is more powerful than most of the newer stuff I've compared it to.

I don't need to crank anything anyway, and if I do, I'll use my BIC's which will be for "rockin' out, sound quality be damned" times, which, btw, I have done with my sub and Pioneer and have never had the meter's on the Pio even reach the halfway point before I found the volume as loud as I'd ever want my music, and I've heard no distortion. Of course the BIC's are more sensitive than the Usher's and the sub is of course powered.

Btw, do you have the link to that shootout thread?

 

[mziegler]

I am an Usher fan in general--the 520 is excellent, as is the V-601. I campared both directly with the Ascend 340SE. I preferred the Ascend, but it is 568/pair and not very good looking to many.

The Ushers are also front ported, which can be an advantage if you have placement issues.

The real gem to me is the Ascend Sierra, which is Ascend's home run speaker: great looking in natural bamboo or piano black, and incredible sounding. Rear ported, so there can be placement issues.

We have bottomed out the 520, but I don't remember what amp we were using. Easy to drive. The only potentially difficult one to drive is the Sierra, although it works well with my Denon 2807.

 

[ChrisJam]

I don't really have a budget, but I'd like to keep it under $1000 and more like $300-$700...Still, I would be interested in suggustions up to the $1000 mark. I've seen the Swan D2.1SE, Ascend Acoustic Sierra, RBH Sound MC-6C, Revel Concerta M12, and others that are considered close to high end at least and they do look nice and well reviewed.

Hi again,

Thanks for the update. I was going to recommend two sets of speakers. One's a little out of your price range ($1200/pair) and the other, the Sierra-1, you already know about.

G'luck,
Chris

 

[Davemcc]

Btw, do you have the link to that shootout thread?

It was a goofy little thread about which do you think will win the shootout. No actual shootout took place. I just included a reference to it here to show I'm not biased against the Ushers, but having never heard them, I'm still pulling for them. They actually have 6 votes now since I last looked.
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33556

 

[Vin2.1guy]

I am an Usher fan in general--the 520 is excellent, as is the V-601. I campared both directly with the Ascend 340SE. I preferred the Ascend, but it is 568/pair and not very good looking to many.

The Ushers are also front ported, which can be an advantage if you have placement issues.

The real gem to me is the Ascend Sierra, which is Ascend's home run speaker: great looking in natural bamboo or piano black, and incredible sounding. Rear ported, so there can be placement issues.

We have bottomed out the 520, but I don't remember what amp we were using. Easy to drive. The only potentially difficult one to drive is the Sierra, although it works well with my Denon 2807.

Thanks for the info, especially about the 520 being easy to drive.

I find all the Ascends except for the Sierra not very attractive. I know that's a stupid thing to base one's decision off of, but I can't help it (hey, if I'm going to spend $300+ on a speaker, I want it to look good! ). The one I would be looking at is the CBM-170 SE since with the sub I have I don't need the bass of the 340's, and they are even worse looking imo (and more expensive of course).

I do like the front port of the Usher's; although I do have room right now for a rear-ported speaker, but it is possible that someday I might use the Usher's for a second system in which I might not. Front ported speakers are just more versatile.

 

[Vin2.1guy]

Hi again,

Thanks for the update. I was going to recommend two sets of speakers. One's a little out of your price range ($1200/pair) and the other, the Sierra-1, you already know about.

G'luck,
Chris

Thanks for the reply!

I think I'm going to keep it around $300-$500 a pair, my feeling is that I can always move up if I'm not satisfied with speakers in that price range (I'm sure I will be, the best speaker's I have ever owned are BIC Venturi DV62si that I got on Amazon for $110 shipped and even those I'm pretty happy with) and regulate the cheaper speakers to a second system or sell them with a bit of a loss.

 

[Vin2.1guy]

It was a goofy little thread about which do you think will win the shootout. No actual shootout took place. I just included a reference to it here to show I'm not biased against the Ushers, but having never heard them, I'm still pulling for them. They actually have 6 votes now since I last looked.
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33556

Ah, I see.

Still an interesting little thread that gives me some info.

Thanks!

PS: For anyone interested, on another forum there is a detailed bookshelf rating theard. It's purpose is not to pick a winner, but to blind group test several bookshelfs (in order to reduce brand preferences and expectations) and then report on which speakers had which strengths and weaknesses. It can be found here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=821009&page=1&pp=30

The first post sums up the results of each speaker tested so far.

 

[Tom Andry]

No actual shootout took place.

Really? Well, what did I do that day? I must have been abducted by aliens and had the speaker shootout memory implanted. If you have any more insight into my life, feel free to let me know. Who knows what memories you'll help be recover or how many of my so called memories were just fabrications or illusions.

 

[Vin2.1guy]

Stephen Monte (owner) of Quest for Sound in Bensalem, PA. carries the full Usher line along with other fabulous speakers. Give him a call & he will show you what customer service is all about. The man is a gem when it comes to dealing with people in the audio field. I personally have dealt with Stephen on numerous occasions & love just going to his place on a Sat & spending the day just shooting the breeze & listening to music is his many demo rooms. If you do talk to him tell him Phil sent you, (I have the AAD 2001 monitors & the CJ from him). He'll know me well. Good luck on your quest. By the way the Usher line is fabulous!! http://www.questforsound.com/

Phil

Sorry, forgot to reply to this one earlier it seems.

Thanks for the info, I think I'll shoot him an email, do you know if he'll ship out speakers to buyers over the internet?

 

[Davemcc]

Really? Well, what did I do that day? I must have been abducted by aliens and had the speaker shootout memory implanted. If you have any more insight into my life, feel free to let me know. Who knows what memories you'll help be recover or how many of my so called memories were just fabrications or illusions.

I'm very sorry if I have offended you. There is no reference in that thread regarding which shootout the thread is referring to, when it was to be conducted, who was to be conducting it, nor a link to any place I might find such a shootout. From the information provided in that thread, it may as well be aliens that conducted the shootout. But since I value your opinion and the time and effort that you put into your work, I will search the home page for a link to the shootout and read the results that the aliens may or may not have implanted in your mind.

edit - There is no trace or evidence on the homepage or in the reviews section that such an event took place. I shall assume that it is an unpublished article at this time unless somebody either helps me out with a link or shows me the aliens responsible.

 

[Vin2.1guy]

Really? Well, what did I do that day? I must have been abducted by aliens and had the speaker shootout memory implanted. If you have any more insight into my life, feel free to let me know. Who knows what memories you'll help be recover or how many of my so called memories were just fabrications or illusions.

Wow, what's with the uncalled for vitriolic attitude and sarcasm?

Everyone here has been so helpful and considerate and not insulting or degrading to the "newbie", why did you feel the need to come in here out of nowhere and mess up a perfectly good thread with this crap? Are you suffering from abs (admin bullying syndrome, more commonly known as a**hole b.s.)? Do you think being a forum admin is some position of power and do you actually get power trips from being one? I really, for your sake, hope not. And there are other forums too, ones in which the admins do not come out of nowhere and attack their users (and recognize that any ordinary person can run a forum, it's hardly an achievement of epic portions), especially when their users are right: that was hardly a proper shootout thread and I didn't even see you in it, are you sure you even have the right thread here?

So contribute positively (surely, with all of your omniscience, you could offer someone as hopelessly naive and ignorant as I some esoteric knowledge) or do us all a favor and ban yourself for being a troll and flame starter.

*If you meant your post in jest then I apologize, but that's not how I read it.*

 

[Vin2.1guy]

I'm very sorry if I have offended you. There is no reference in that thread regarding which shootout the thread is referring to, when it was to be conducted, who was to be conducting it, nor a link to any place I might find such a shootout. From the information provided in that thread, it may as well be aliens that conducted the shootout. But since I value your opinion and the time and effort that you put into your work, I will search the home page for a link to the shootout and read the results that the aliens may or may not have implanted in your mind.

edit - There is no trace or evidence on the homepage or in the reviews section that such an event took place. I shall assume that it is an unpublished article at this time unless somebody either helps me out with a link or shows me the aliens responsible.

You're a much more tolerant person than I.

 

[Davemcc]

You're a much more tolerant person than I.

Vin,
It's all good. Tom's a good moderator and I didn't take offense. Quite often around here there are things cooking in the background that aren't ready for the public yet. I'll wait for the article or a link. I'm quite interested in the results.

In the meantime, if you can still edit your first post on the subject, now's a good time. Edits have a short shelf life here.

 

[Vin2.1guy]

Vin,
It's all good. Tom's a good moderator and I didn't take offense. Quite often around here there are things cooking in the background that aren't ready for the public yet. I'll wait for the article or a link. I'm quite interested in the results.

In the meantime, if you can still edit your first post on the subject, now's a good time. Edits have a short shelf life here.

Well I took offence, and I stand by what I said. Screw that, there is no need for anyone to be that rude toward's anyone, especially not an admin/moderator who is supposed to kill flames and trolls, not be one himself. That's hardly a good admin/moderator, that's just a pathetic power tripper with a high sense (apparently well deserved) of self inadequacy. JMO.

Anyway, I think this thread has run it's course and I may start another one (if I decide to even post at this place again, which is unlikely if this is the kind of crap I can expect: I'm on and have been on several forums and have never seen a moderator/admin ever attack anyone like that for such an innocent post, or even any post at all, that's total b.s.) to help me choose between my final budget bookshelf choices.

I thank you and everyone else who was helpful to me in this thread, and if I don't ttyl, then I wish everyone many more years of audio bliss.

Take care all.