Ukraine – Russia … not more of the last thread

[mtrycrafts]

Zelensky and Trump blow up at WH.

WATCH: Trump and Vance blast Zelenskyy in Oval Office meeting, suggesting he needs to be more grateful

President Donald Trump chided Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy after Vice President JD Vance, one of the administration’s most skeptical voices on Ukraine, said Zelenskyy was being disrespectful for debating Trump in the Oval Office in front of the American media.

www.pbs.org

I wish Z would have responded to that reporter who asked about coat and tie, that he is in his commander in chief's uniform.

 

[Dude#1279435]

I wish Z would have responded to that reporter who asked about coat and tie, that he is in his commander in chief's uniform.

He did by saying along the lines of maybe I'll buy a suit that's better looking, maybe I'll buy something that's cheaper.

 

[Dude#1279435]

How Not to End the War in Ukraine

Past failures make clear that an imposed peace won’t last.

www.foreignaffairs.com

 

[Dude#1279435]

Look at how upset and red in the face Trump/Vance got when asked anything by Z, like a couple of children having a fit when they couldn't have their way on tv. I liked the example that this was about a hypermasculinity performance for their audience.

 

[Dude#1279435]

I think this was more a try and get money back on the $350 billion we gave to Ukraine knowing that Zelensky would never agree to a minerals deal w/o protections. So the end goal was to get out of Ukraine altogether. If you agree with that, good for you. Maybe it's time Europe step it up and pay their fair share. Sadly though what a couple of losers Trump and Vance are with how they handle this on tv.

 

[GO-NAD!]

I think this was more a try and get money back on the $350 billion we gave to Ukraine knowing that Zelensky would never agree to a minerals deal w/o protections. So the end goal was to get out of Ukraine altogether. If you agree with that, good for you. Maybe it's time Europe step it up and pay their fair share. Sadly though what a couple of losers Trump and Vance are with how they handle this on tv.

Trump pulled that $350 billion figure out of his back passage, just like most numbers he tosses out. And, how can you say that Europe hasn't stepped and paid it's fair share?

Infographic: The Countries Sending the Most Aid to Ukraine

This chart shows the countries which have committed the most aid to Ukraine, by type, from January 2022 to December 2024.

www.statista.com

 

[Dude#1279435]

Trump pulled that $350 billion figure out of his back passage, just like most numbers he tosses out. And, how can you say that Europe hasn't stepped and paid it's fair share?

Cause a Trump supporter said so.
I think though they're going to say it isn't % of GDP but the total.
Edit: yeah the $350 million is a number Trump made up. Of course.

 

[GO-NAD!]

Cause a Trump supporter said so.
I think though they're going to say it isn't % of GDP but the total.
Edit: yeah the $350 million is a number Trump made up. Of course.

Even if they talk about totals, the list I posted includes just six of the European countries that have ponied up the dough.

 

[highfigh]

You are parroting the Russian line. Same as Trump. He is, in effect, a Russian asset. Think on that.

What did I parrot? Show it. If you can't find it, piss off.

 

[highfigh]

That circus show was beyond the pale. I also wish greater Europe would act more as one and independent of the U.S. taking the lead.

Looks like that wish may have been granted unless something changed since yesterday afternoon.

 

[Dude#1279435]

Hehehe.....

Trump's deep obsession: Winning the Nobel Peace Prize

>>>What they're saying: Critics of Trump's foreign policy say he doesn't deserve a Nobel because it's not clear he'll achieve lasting peace in the Middle East or between Ukraine and Russia.

• Trump's apparent embrace of Russia at the expense of Ukraine and NATO also could weigh heavily on a Norwegian jury.
• Trump "has said if Obama got one early in his term, he should too," said John Bolton, who was national security adviser during Trump's first term and now is a critic of the president.
• "I would turn it around. They should be treated equally — neither of them deserve it."<<<

 

[GO-NAD!]

I want to make it clear that I do not hate the US. It's more like I'm concerned about a loved one in the grip of a psychotic episode. A loved one who is also 6'8" and 275lbs of muscle. One who likes to play with forks and electrical outlets. And, sleeps in the bedroom next to mine.

 

[mtrycrafts]

But the national debt is so much more than what we give for other peoples' wars, POTUS and Congress really know how to piss away money in Monopoly amounts. Hell, we can't keep funding the US forever. It's as if they don't ever consider where the money comes from, especially when they overspend.

You chalk everything up to the Trump era- what did Obama do to prevent this? Nothing. What did Biden do to pervent it? Nothing.

EVERY POTUS & Congress need to put down their pens and think about what they're about to do. The 'Let's study the sexual habits of lizards", etc. The link has some examples and other links to more waste. It has gone on for decades.

7 Ridiculous Examples of Government Waste in 2023

The Department of Defense spent $8,395 for a tank—a lobster tank, that is.

fee.org

Yes, when was the last time taxes were increased, on specifically the ones who usually get the greatest benefit from a tax cut.

 

[trochetier]

Perfect opportunity for European NATO members to grow up, show some spine and stand on their own feet. Too long they have depended on US goodwill and largess. Time for US to cut them lose too. Europe should take the lead in NATO and US should be the back up if/when needed.

 

[trochetier]

In retrospect Z should have been using an interpreter, after all English is not his primary language. An interpreter can smooth out the language. Things fell apart when Z questioned T's ability to keep P's ceasefire promise citing past failures. The same could be said more diplomatically like - I will trust you to make P keep his promises. A smart interpreter would have smoothed it out. I have seen this first hand in meetings with my English colleagues they would say something that would sound rather harsh to our ears but that's normal for them.

 

[highfigh]

Yes, when was the last time taxes were increased, on specifically the ones who usually get the greatest benefit from a tax cut.

I don't know, but the highest earners make a helluva lot more money than ever before, so it's kind of a moot point. I know people who used to make six figures and then, they started making seven figures but another part is: how much have they made since the economy puked around 2008? A lot of people hit their highest earning years in the past decade, but "How are they paid and how do hey make money?" need to be answered. If they're smart, they aren't paid income, they receive large bonuses, stock options and other ways, to avoid paying high income tax rates.

So, it's back to 'Hate The Rich' again, eh?

 

[Dude#1279435]

Perfect opportunity for European NATO members to grow up, show some spine and stand on their own feet. Too long they have depended on US goodwill and largess. Time for US to cut them lose too. Europe should take the lead in NATO and US should be the back up if/when needed.

Agreed.

In retrospect Z should have been using an interpreter, after all English is not his primary language. An interpreter can smooth out the language. Things fell apart when Z questioned T's ability to keep P's ceasefire promise citing past failures. The same could be said more diplomatically like - I will trust you to make P keep his promises. A smart interpreter would have smoothed it out. I have seen this first hand in meetings with my English colleagues they would say something that would sound rather harsh to our ears but that's normal for them.

Ah no. It was very clear this was an ambush by the American gangsters. If they at all cared about his positions, they would have let him speak. Instead they talked over him. Another key is when Vance said 'When are you going to thank America?' Turns out Z has thanked America numerous times. What they didn't like was Z stood firm. Also in so many words when Vance said what Z was doing was propaganda without stating what specifically that is. This was premeditated for the cameras. Look at how angry Trump and Vance got when Z spoke up. It was they who were losing their cool like a couple of toddlers who couldn't have their way.

 

[Dude#1279435]

TN Brando said it was MTG's boyfriend who was the one in the background who asked Zelensky why he wasn't wearing a suit. I think the tv meeting will end up being the end of Vance's political career.

 

[Eppie]

Trump keeps insisting that Zelenskyy make peace with Russia. Left unsaid, is that making peace amounts to surrendering.

Zelenskyy came prepared to make a deal with Trump, but wanted a security guarantee. Anything less - considering the steep price Trump is asking - would be a poor return for Ukraine. Trump was never going to offer that guarantee, because he doesn't care if Ukraine is defeated. I wouldn't be surprised if the talks between the US and Russia included discussion of US access to the valuable minerals in Ukraine, i.e. if Ukraine is defeated, the deal would be honoured by the Russians.

Bottom line is, this administration places no value in honouring contracts or treaties.

That's pretty obvious. The USMCA does not expire until 2026. A document Trump signed and said was the greatest deal ever made. Trump's tariffs are a direct violation of that agreement. Trump's signature isn't worth the cost of the ink. He's as trustworthy as Putin.