Tired of EP2500. Need replacement ideas.

[monsterman]

we need a picture of the amp in it's stand/rack and confirmation if the modded fan is still running.

if there's space, i'd sooner cut out about 3-4 fan sized holes at the top of the amp casing, right above the heatsinks ... put some of them quiet PC fans on top than buy another amp.

edit: also, what load did you put on it? how many VC's does that driver have?

4 ohm load and the driver has a single VC.

 

[monsterman]

Sounds more like a speaker wire strand is touching or shorting somewhere.

I thought the factory fan vented back to front?

Yes, Actually because just today my amp's circuit breaker went off and it seems like there is a short somewhere along the line. The clipping signal indicator is lit for the brief time the amp on, after switching the circuit breaker back on (I mean the little one on the back of the amp itself)

 

[monsterman]

Well, if you are running the amp near it's full power often, then the 'silent' fan does not push the volume of the air of the original and you can expect over-heating problems. That is an issue when doing these mods for home use. But very rarely does anyone push these amps at high power on a continuous basis (high power output usually only occurring during short periods) in the home environment.

If you need a lot more continuous power and a silent amp(no mods needed), the Yamaha P7000S outputs nearly 1000 watts x 2 at 4 Ohms, both channels driven, 20Hz-20,000Hz. If you need a bridged mono at 4 Ohms, though, the Yamahas are not intended to drive 4 Ohms bridged.

-Chris

Yamaha P7000S FEATURES:


* In 4 Ohm bridged mode the Yamaha P7000S delivers 3200 watts
* Yamaha's exclusive EEEngine technology significantly reduces power consumption and heat generation.
* Independent sweepable high-pass and low-pass filters on each channel so you can optimize output for subwoofer or full range systems.
* Neutrik Speakon output jacks and 1/4-inch output jacks for each channel, in addition to 5-way binding post.
* Balanced XLR and 1/4-inch TRS jacks are provided for channel input.
* Variable-speed fans offer quiet, efficient cooling.
* Comprehensive protection includes power on/off muting, DC detection, thermal protection, current limiting, and a protective cover for the attenuators.
* YS Processing (Yamaha Speaker Processing) achieves optimum matching with Yamaha Club Series loudspeaker systems.

 

[monsterman]

Cranking the snot out of an amp after doing a mod to silence the fan makes no sense.

Well I wanted a cheap, powerful, quite amp. That makes perfect sense to me. I figured the EP2500 used a inexpensive loud fan to keep the production costs down. So I slapped in a new one.

 

[mike c]

4 ohm load and the driver has a single VC.

i see. you are using bridged 4 ohms ... basically stereo 2 ohms.

you're gonna need a way bigger amp if you need that much power into 4 ohms on a single channel (get an amp with enough power on ONE channel so you wouldn't need to bridge)

have you tried just using one channel on the EP2500? that would give you 650w RMS and it would run a lot cooler.

 

[walter duque]

Hot is OK, to a point. If it's not well-protected, thermal runaway is a real problem.

I don't know if you are familiar with Cinepro, but these amps run 24/7 under test conditions which draw 5800 watts. I have run this amp at times for 12 or more hours at max. power. With that kind of power consumption they better run hot.

 

[monsterman]

i see. you are using bridged 4 ohms ... basically stereo 2 ohms.

you're gonna need a way bigger amp if you need that much power into 4 ohms on a single channel (get an amp with enough power on ONE channel so you wouldn't need to bridge)

have you tried just using one channel on the EP2500? that would give you 650w RMS and it would run a lot cooler.

This does not make any sense. This amp is bridged with a 4 ohm load. It supposed to put out a lot of power into 4 ohm's. No I will not run it on a single channel, would rather buy a new amp.

 

[monsterman]

I don't know if you are familiar with Cinepro, but these amps run 24/7 under test conditions which draw 5800 watts. I have run this amp at times for 12 or more hours at max. power. With that kind of power consumption they better run hot.

I don't have a problem with hot. I have a problem when its starting to heat up my room and gives off a smell. I will open up my woofer box and make sure everything is fine on the connection inside. If there is a wire crossed I will fix and re-post results.

 

[walter duque]

I don't have a problem with hot. I have a problem when its starting to heat up my room and gives off a smell. I will open up my woofer box and make sure everything is fine on the connection inside. If there is a wire crossed I will fix and re-post results.

I never smell my amp, I guess there is something wrong with yours. I also have a Threshold which is my bride and joy and the hotter it gets the sweeter it sounds. Did it ever cross your mind "you get what you pay for". Friend of mine bought a highly acclaimed pro-amp and I said you want get a year out this, I don't think it lasted 4 months. Most of these low cost IKEA amps are just a temporary fix till you have the funds to kick it up a notch or two. I had to throw that in since I am a chef.

 

[WmAx]

Page 9 of Yamaha manual states not to use under 8 Ohms on bridged mono for the Yamaha amps.

The 2 ohm/stereo and 4 ohm/mono ratings appear to be just for marketing purposes. However, I will say I have read many pro forum posts where users connect the Yamaha amps as such, and have never reported a problem. Never the less, Yamaha recommends against this.

As for the 'smell' of the Ep2500. This is definitely not normal and perhaps the 1st case of this I have yet to read about.

As for any concern of quality.. you are in for a shock. The Ep2500's build quality is better than most. It is superior to most home marketed amps, better than a good deal of pro ones (I have some Crowns that don't hold a candle to it, and the Yamahas are perhaps a match, maybe). Don't go around thinking that just because they don't cost much, that the Ep2500 is somehow skimping in quality, not just in build. Measured performance is very high in 3rd party tests. It measures better than most in regards to output power/ distortion / low impedance.

-Chris

 

[walter duque]

WmAx
I have nothing but the upmost respect for you. I have followed your threads and you are to me one of the most knowledgable members on this forum, why are you so stuck on Yamaha?

 

[KEW]

Yamaha P7000S FEATURES:


* In 4 Ohm bridged mode the Yamaha P7000S delivers 3200 watts

Dynamic power; 1kHz; 20ms nonclip

as specified at
http://www.yamahaproaudio.com/products/power_amps/p7000s/specifications.html

I guess as long as you only drive it at 1kHz for 20 milliseconds and allow it to cool between doing this, you'll be okay!

Of course, we are talking 3200Watts!!!

 

[mike c]

i feel like i do whatever wmax says

when he said the A500 was the bomb, i got 4 of those.
then the EP2500, i got two of those.
then the yammy, i could only afford the P2500S

i'd say i really got my bang for the bucks.

-o-o-o-o-o-

having a "cheap" 2ohm stable amp in the EP2500 is spectacular.

expecting ANY amp to run 2 ohm stereo (same as 4ohm bridged) full bore is too much

i'm thinking a super cooled/ventilated version of the EP2500 can do it.

-o-o-o-o

i think the easier/better solution is to get another of the same sub. run each off each channel. should be about 3db gain IIRC, and will give the amp a lighter load. you also gain better bass response.

 

[highfigh]

I have the new 'quite' fan blowing outwards ... the amp itself is sitting on carpet with my DCX2496 on top. The fan is working and most of the time its not hot. But when I blast music and crank my woofer it gets hot quick.
As a matter of fact, it has gotten so hot that it made a very funny smell in the room and I had to shut it off.

Why the hell is it sitting on carpet? No wonder it gets hot! Get some air under it and let it cool the way it's supposed to!

 

[highfigh]

This does not make any sense. This amp is bridged with a 4 ohm load. It supposed to put out a lot of power into 4 ohm's. No I will not run it on a single channel, would rather buy a new amp.

When an amp is bridged, the load is shared by both channels and the negative speaker terminals aren't usually used (but they're still in-circuit because the channels are always use them for their ground reference. This, and inverting the input to one channel is how the voltage doubles and the power increases. Think of it as stacking the signal of one channel on top of the other channel's signal. The amp looks at the load in this case as if it is half of the normal resistance. You'll almost never see an amp that's rated for a lower impedance in bridged mode than when it's in stereo mode. Electrically, it's hard (read, expensive) to build an amp that can do this.

 

[highfigh]

Well I wanted a cheap, powerful, quite amp. That makes perfect sense to me. I figured the EP2500 used a inexpensive loud fan to keep the production costs down. So I slapped in a new one.

When an amp is designed, it's done so it works under the conditions set forth by the demands of its users. Loud music and quiet fans don't go together. Remember that this is normally sold for pro or commercial use and when a band is playing, nobody cares how loud the fan is- they just want it to never shut down while it's needed. Reliability is more important than a noisy fan. By replacing the fan with a quieter/less CFM model, you have altered the amp's cooling abilities and reduced its reliability. It's not the amp's fault that it gets hot. That's caused by the output transistors dissipating power that can't be used but if you want to use that fan, you'll need bigger heat sinks. Those are sized by surface area, temperature differential and CFM blowing past the fins. Once the CFM is reduced, the heat loss is reduced and the amp will become unstable at best, or it will damage the output transistors and possibly your woofer, at worst.

Noisy and reliable is far better than quiet and damaged by the end user who complains that he doesn't like the amp because it gets too hot and smells funny. Parking it on carpeting is hardly the way it was designed to be used. Did it ever strike you that equipment racks are often open on the back side when the system is being used? That's so it can cool sufficiently.

 

[WmAx]

WmAx
I have nothing but the upmost respect for you. I have followed your threads and you are to me one of the most knowledgable members on this forum, why are you so stuck on Yamaha?

I am in no way stuck on Yamaha. I own very few Yamaha products. But the P**00S amps from Yamaha are one of very few pro amps suited to home use with no mods. No fan noise. The rack mount tabs come off easily for use in regular consumer stereo racks. They are priced better than home amps of equal build quality and performance capabilities in most cases. If one considers the Emotiva brand, probably one of the best value home amp makers (reliability issues aside), the XPA-2 costs far more than a comparable quality/performance Yamaha. The similar price range Yamaha(P7000S) is far more capable of an amp.

-Chris

 

[ufokillerz]

This does not make any sense. This amp is bridged with a 4 ohm load. It supposed to put out a lot of power into 4 ohm's. No I will not run it on a single channel, would rather buy a new amp.

the ep2500 has issues with loads that dip into 2ohm when running bridged mode, but supposedly no issues at all in single channel mode.

 

[highfigh]

the ep2500 has issues with loads that dip into 2ohm when running bridged mode, but supposedly no issues at all in single channel mode.

Most amps have issues when they're bridged and the load is near 2 Ohms.

 

[njedpx3]

.... Loud music and quiet fans don't go together. ....

This give me cognitive dissonance; could you further explain what you meant.

IMHO the loudness of a fan has very little to do with its cooling efficiency and therefore loud music.

Now if the fan is quiet because it is undersized for the required heat dissipation and if the amp is placed directly on the carpet so ambient cooling doesn't work or has a load with such low impedance that the current causes excessive heat build-up, so that there is not adequate ambient and forced cooling then the amp could overheat and have premature failures and/or clipping which can downline cause speaker failure and bad smells

YOMBD ( Your Opinion May Be Different)


Peace and Good Sound,

Forest Man