The Title Isn't as Dirty as it Seems...Will 10 Inches Make the Difference?

[PearlcorderS701]

I think that will do nicely. A 20" increase is significant..................... that's what she said.

Thanks, Darien.

Do you think that a 10 inch increase would be significant as well? Enough to consider a 60" flat panel instead of a 70?

 

[PearlcorderS701]

but 10 inches should do nicely.

Are we talking...in the "dirty" realm of man-on-woman relations or in the world of TVs?

Seriously, you think the 60" would be just as significant as a jump?

 

[PearlcorderS701]

20" is a significant jump in size. As said earlier, and it still holds true, we are conditioned for larger displays right now. 70" isn't huge. It WAS huge, but now it isn't. Will it apppear significantly larger than 50"? You better believe it!

You honestly think 70" doesn't seem huge? It did to me, even amidst all the other TVs on the wall at my local Best Buy, and that's hard to do given the bright lighting, other screens, etc...

From 12' that's a really good size. I'm pretty dead set that eventually I will get the Sharp 80" display (have you seen that one yet?) - I saw it over at my local Best Buy and it is ridiculous. Since I'm a ridiculous person, I liked it a lot. Still, the 70" is a great way to go and the price is well beyond belief compared to what other manufacturers have managed to deliver in the last couple of years.

LOL -- no, I haven't seen the 80" Sharp, but the Best Buy chick I was talking to told me about it; they didn't carry any at this particular store. I don't think our wall -- even with modifying the wall unit -- could hold an 80...

Do you think at 12 feet the 70 will seem "cinematic" in a way when watching Blu-rays and DVDs? I don't mean "cinematic" as if we had a front projector and 110 inch screen, but will it feel a little less like you're watching "just a TV"?

No other real options at that size that I'm aware of. I expect we will see more in the next year or so, but most manufacturers are finally getting into the 60" range, they still have a ways to go to be like Sharp and just produce more 70"+ sized displays at a reasonable price.

Hmmm...so, there are no plasmas at that size? I'm kind of forced to go LCD huh?

 

[gmichael]

Are we talking...in the "dirty" realm of man-on-woman relations or in the world of TVs?

Seriously, you think the 60" would be just as significant as a jump?

I was hinting about woofers. At least, that's my story.

20 would be better, but if 10 is all you have room for, then you do what ya gatta do. Either way, it's a step up.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

I was hinting about woofers. At least, that's my story.

20 would be better, but if 10 is all you have room for, then you do what ya gatta do. Either way, it's a step up.

Well, as I stated in the update, we do have the opportunity to have our wall unit modified by our handyman, so the 70 could fit...I just want to be sure that at a distance of 12 feet away from the screen the impact would increase over our 50" that's in there now...

 

[gmichael]

Well, as I stated in the update, we do have the opportunity to have our wall unit modified by our handyman, so the 70 could fit...I just want to be sure that at a distance of 12 feet away from the screen the impact would increase over our 50" that's in there now...

If you can go 70, then I would. You'll be glad you did in the long run.
Think of it this way. You'll probably be keeping this for at least 5 years. If you use it an average of 2 hours a day x 365 days x 5 years, that's 3650 hours. How much does that work out to as far as $'s per hour? If you use it more than 2 hours per day, (like I do) then,... well... you get the picture. (no pun)

 

[PearlcorderS701]

If you can go 70, then I would. You'll be glad you did in the long run.
Think of it this way. You'll probably be keeping this for at least 5 years. If you use it an average of 2 hours a day x 365 days x 5 years, that's 3650 hours. How much does that work out to as far as $'s per hour? If you use it more than 2 hours per day, (like I do) then,... well... you get the picture. (no pun)

I understand what you're saying, 'G, and it makes sense -- but I'm not as concerned about the usage factor/value element as I am knowing the impact of the bigger screen will yield a more "in your face" experience when watching films, as we do that on an almost nightly basis, seven days a week.

 

[gmichael]

I understand what you're saying, 'G, and it makes sense -- but I'm not as concerned about the usage factor/value element as I am knowing the impact of the bigger screen will yield a more "in your face" experience when watching films, as we do that on an almost nightly basis, seven days a week.

70 will be much more in your face (in a good way) than the 60. You will absolutely be glad you went with the 70.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

70 will be much more in your face (in a good way) than the 60. You will absolutely be glad you went with the 70.

Thanks.

Do you think a 12 foot distance will be okay with a 70?

 

[gmichael]

Thanks.

Do you think a 12 foot distance will be okay with a 70?

Sounds about right. I am about 19 feet back for our 106 screen that will be upgraded to 120" soon.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Sounds about right. I am about 19 feet back for our 106 screen that will be upgraded to 120" soon.

We won't be "squinting" to see the image because we're back so far, will we?

 

[gmichael]

We won't be "squinting" to see the image because we're back so far, will we?

Nope. Not at all.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Thanks, man.

Now -- on to different matters: What do you think I should be looking for, an LCD or plasma? I don't even think there are plasmas at this size commercially available, are there? I know Panasonic had their 100 inch-plus prototype beasts at varying CES shows and such, but are there any plasmas readily available as of right now at a 70" size?

Also -- what do you think, if you had to guess, we could get for our 50" SXRD set if we were to sell it?

 

[BMXTRIX]

There is the 85" Panasonic plasma, but that's the smallest jump up from their 65" plasma. It is worth saying that both the 64" Samsung and the 65" Panasonic plasmas both look a bit better than the Sharp LCD, but the Sharp LCD does look good.

At 19' back with front projection, THX standards would ask for a screen about 160" in diagonal, not 120" or 106". Our 106" is viewed from under 12' away.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

There is the 85" Panasonic plasma, but that's the smallest jump up from their 65" plasma. It is worth saying that both the 64" Samsung and the 65" Panasonic plasmas both look a bit better than the Sharp LCD, but the Sharp LCD does look good.

Thanks BMX...

There is a commercially available 85" Panasonic plasma?? Really? How much does that retail for?

Okay, so here's my dilemma...do you think, first of all, going with a 65" screen instead of a 70" will still yield an enjoyable improvement in impact over our 50? I realize that anything bigger is always better, for the most part, but can we "get away" with going 65 inches instead of 70?

Further -- you're saying the Panny and Samsung plasmas both look better than the Sharp LCD 70"? Did you see them side by side? If that's the case, I may just consider one of these plasmas; I did like the look of Samsung LCDs at any rate, but I just don't know which brand or type of screen technology to go with...

What about Sony? I know they have some 70" LCD that at last check was like 20,000 dollars (for some odd reason); but do one of their BRAVIA sets go as large as 65"?

At 19' back with front projection, THX standards would ask for a screen about 160" in diagonal, not 120" or 106". Our 106" is viewed from under 12' away.

106 inches from UNDER 12 feet away???

Jesus Christ on a saltine cracker...I'm at 12 feet with a 50 inch...

 

[BMXTRIX]

There is a commercially available 85" Panasonic plasma?? Really? How much does that retail for?

About $25,000ish for the home version, about $15,000 for the 'commercial' version. And people wonder why they lose money when Sharp has an 80" display around $4,000.

Okay, so here's my dilemma...do you think, first of all, going with a 65" screen instead of a 70" will still yield an enjoyable improvement in impact over our 50? I realize that anything bigger is always better, for the most part, but can we "get away" with going 65 inches instead of 70?

I think about 15" is where you want to be with a size jump to get a definite noticable increase in image size. So, yes 64"-70" is the right size range for you to be in.

Further -- you're saying the Panny and Samsung plasmas both look better than the Sharp LCD 70"? Did you see them side by side? If that's the case, I may just consider one of these plasmas; I did like the look of Samsung LCDs at any rate, but I just don't know which brand or type of screen technology to go with...

I recently installed the 70" Sharps at a client site and I own the 64" Samsung plasma. There is no question to me that the Samsung is a better looking display. The Panasonic and Samsung are often comparible to each other in many ways, but I opted for the Samsung because the price was a fair bit better compared to the VT series from Panasonic. I would say that both are extremely comparible, and just a step up in quality from LCD. But, they aren't as bright and generally will consume a bit more power.

What about Sony? I know they have some 70" LCD that at last check was like 20,000 dollars (for some odd reason); but do one of their BRAVIA sets go as large as 65"?

What about Sony?

No, I think Sony makes some great stuff which works very well and generally has a good image. For LCD, they are near the top as well, but I think their price leans a bit higher than Samsung and definitely Sharp. So, I generally don't recommend them. On the other hand, they do have two models of a 65" LCD available.

106 inches from UNDER 12 feet away???

Jesus Christ on a saltine cracker...I'm at 12 feet with a 50 inch...

Front projection is supposed to recreate the theater experience at home. People who use front projectors generally understand that a TV is what you watch cable on, while projection is for more special events - big sporting events, gaming with friends, watching movies. It is a very immersive experience, and feels like a theater - expect I get a pause button, better audio, my own snacks, and volume control. Oh, and the best seats in the house every single time.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

About $25,000ish for the home version, about $15,000 for the 'commercial' version. And people wonder why they lose money when Sharp has an 80" display around $4,000.

Wow. Well, forget the 85" plasmas then.

I think about 15" is where you want to be with a size jump to get a definite noticable increase in image size. So, yes 64"-70" is the right size range for you to be in.

Thanks.

I recently installed the 70" Sharps at a client site and I own the 64" Samsung plasma. There is no question to me that the Samsung is a better looking display. The Panasonic and Samsung are often comparible to each other in many ways, but I opted for the Samsung because the price was a fair bit better compared to the VT series from Panasonic. I would say that both are extremely comparible, and just a step up in quality from LCD. But, they aren't as bright and generally will consume a bit more power.

Very interesting; what was so "off" about the Sharp's picture compared to the Samsung? I originally was considering nothing but either a Sony or Samsung for our next display, based on demos I have seen in stores, so that's why I was curious.

What about Sony?

No, I think Sony makes some great stuff which works very well and generally has a good image. For LCD, they are near the top as well, but I think their price leans a bit higher than Samsung and definitely Sharp. So, I generally don't recommend them. On the other hand, they do have two models of a 65" LCD available.

I know they command a premium for their name alone, but you generally don't recommend them to people because of this, is that what you're saying?

They do have two LCD models available? That's good to know; I think I had forgotten that in my research of new TVs...would you put Sony's LCD up there with Samsung and Panasonic at this size?

Front projection is supposed to recreate the theater experience at home. People who use front projectors generally understand that a TV is what you watch cable on, while projection is for more special events - big sporting events, gaming with friends, watching movies. It is a very immersive experience, and feels like a theater - expect I get a pause button, better audio, my own snacks, and volume control. Oh, and the best seats in the house every single time.

Yes, I know this; but some of just cannot do a front projection setup in our homes or rooms, and either have to or prefer to do a television based visual system. Are you saying we can never get a semi-theatrical/immersive experience watching film media on a television display?

 

[BMXTRIX]

Very interesting; what was so "off" about the Sharp's picture compared to the Samsung? I originally was considering nothing but either a Sony or Samsung for our next display, based on demos I have seen in stores, so that's why I was curious.

I don't think that Sharps video processing is as good as what Samsung, Panasonic, and Sony use. Their images tend to appear a bit more processed which I notice. They have significantly improved their color and motion handing compared to prior years displays, but still I don't like their image processing as much as I do the others. I played with their creative frame interpolation on and off, and that didn't seem to be the issue.

I know they command a premium for their name alone, but you generally don't recommend them to people because of this, is that what you're saying?

Sony is still a Japanese manufacturer and so their prices are higher because they have to be. Samsung is able to lower prices due to their location more than anything else.

I think the premium price on Sony is strictly do to this, and is not a reflection of added quality/benefits of the product itself. So, I generally don't go that direction, but their product certainly is very good.

...would you put Sony's LCD up there with Samsung and Panasonic at this size?

Yes, Sony is easily up there as one of the premiere LCDs on the market. Remember - Panasonic is plasma only for quality. Samsung is both LCD and plasma.

Yes, I know this; but some of just cannot do a front projection setup in our homes or rooms, and either have to or prefer to do a television based visual system. Are you saying we can never get a semi-theatrical/immersive experience watching film media on a television display?

IMO - no. Others have long disagreed with me on this, but most people that have owned a front projection system with decent surround sound agree on this. It's just something you can't understand until your field of view hits THX minimum standards.

You can get that at home, but at 12' you need the 103" Panasonic plasma.

If you move up to about 8' you can get the 80" Sharp LCD and that'll be extremely close to ideal and will be very immersive.

The one thing to remember: When you are just watching TV, you don't always want it to be super big in your face. You don't want that level of immersion all the time. So, getting a more reasonably sized display really does make more sense as a primary viewing display. Due to our floor layout, the 64" TV often is viewed from the kitchen which puts us at 15+ feet away quite often. But, I can sit close on the couch which puts me about 8' away as well. Being closer is certainly more immersive in this case and is not a bad way to watch a movie for sure.

It does come down to some budgetary stuff though. I would strongly recommend that if you were having any woodwork done, then you should probably plan to make the opening large enough to handle something as large as the 80" Sharp.

Seriously, after buying the Samsung, the only other display I would consider for that location would be the 80" Sharp.

 

[gmichael]

At 19' back with front projection, THX standards would ask for a screen about 160" in diagonal, not 120" or 106". Our 106" is viewed from under 12' away.

We just don't have the room for 160" Even a 133" screen would require me to make some major changes. The 120" will have to do.
Moving our seating a little closer would end up pushing our sectional in front of the right main speaker. Even though the tweeter and mid-range are higher than the sectional, it would bug me.
I guess that 120" from 19 feet will have to be a comprise for us to live with.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

I don't think that Sharps video processing is as good as what Samsung, Panasonic, and Sony use. Their images tend to appear a bit more processed which I notice. They have significantly improved their color and motion handing compared to prior years displays, but still I don't like their image processing as much as I do the others. I played with their creative frame interpolation on and off, and that didn't seem to be the issue.

I see.

I didn't have a chance to compare them directly and in depth, but the Sharp's picture quality on the one they had on the wall at my local Best Buy was ridiculously saturated and rich...of course, the picture mode was most likely set at "Vivid/Dynamic" but...

Sony is still a Japanese manufacturer and so their prices are higher because they have to be. Samsung is able to lower prices due to their location more than anything else.

Sounds very much like the situation in the car market...

At any rate, like I said, I originally had my heart set on only a Samsung or Sony for the next display; I have enjoyed our SXRD up until this point, and although I prefer a more "garish, cartoonish" look to the colors and overall appearance of a screen like the LCDs provide (versus the smooth film like quality the SXRDs/rear pros produce), I can't fault our Sony for anything short of needing to replace the lamp once already (regular maintenance for a projection TV or projector).

I think the premium price on Sony is strictly do to this, and is not a reflection of added quality/benefits of the product itself. So, I generally don't go that direction, but their product certainly is very good.

Thanks for the honest input here. If I could afford one of the 65" LCDs from Sony, I'd probably look there first...

What do you make of their $20,000 (U.S.) 70" LCD that's out there? Why do they charge so much for this thing when the 70" SXRD was never this expensive? And do you have a theory as to why this company won't build TVs over 70 inches in size, or why they left the plasma market altogether?

Yes, Sony is easily up there as one of the premiere LCDs on the market. Remember - Panasonic is plasma only for quality. Samsung is both LCD and plasma.

Does Panasonic make plasmas any longer?

IMO - no. Others have long disagreed with me on this, but most people that have owned a front projection system with decent surround sound agree on this. It's just something you can't understand until your field of view hits THX minimum standards.

You can get that at home, but at 12' you need the 103" Panasonic plasma.

If you move up to about 8' you can get the 80" Sharp LCD and that'll be extremely close to ideal and will be very immersive.

Oh boy...where do I start with this...I thought I was opening the inevitable can of worms but...

I understand what you're saying when you state that it's not something those of us who have never experienced a 120" screen with a projector could understand until it happens...I'm sure that's the case. For me, and for what it's worth, I've personally never seen a properly set up and adjusted front projection system that looked any good; I've seen the soft, out of focus and generally poor looking projector setups at certain outlets and this always brought me back to a television setup anyway. Now, that said, the numbers you are citing in the statement above regarding what would be needed to fulfill a cinematic fantasy via a TV screen alarms me greatly because we will NEVER be able to afford a TV of these sizes, nor fit one in our room.

Our seating distance can't change in this current room -- it must remain at 12 feet. And, we're not getting rid of the wall unit/entertainment center the TV must sit in, so even with heavy modifications by our handyman to it, it looks like the absolute biggest screen we can get in there (and still have room on this wall for the two Polk RTi12 mains and sub) is going to be 70 inches, and at this very moment it seems like that screen size is a fantasy, budget wise (this element changes on a regular basis for us...the budget, that is).

So, we cannot do the Sharp 80" -- or the Mitsubishi DLPs for that matter -- at a 8 feet seating distance; the best we could HOPE for is a 70" at the 12 feet...you STILL don't think we will experience any kind of more cinematic immersion impact COMPARED TO the 50" we're watching now at 12 feet?

This is very disheartening to me; further, what are your thoughts regarding just going full-tilt and getting one of those gigantic Mitsubishi DLP sets? I'm wondering if I should just bite the bullet and not bother with the "smaller" flat panels we've been discussing, but rather do a ton of money saving and scrap the wall unit we have now (it would be a TREMENDOUS loss money wise) and have something built that would house the 73" or bigger Mitsubishi screen, plus the speakers and sub (a custom kind of wall unit, which our handyman could do) even though this would be a HUGE investment...

I am torn because taking the money out of the equation, I am being told that these Mitsubishi DLPs just can't hold a candle, image wise, to the plasmas and LCDs; I wanted your opinion on that...

The one thing to remember: When you are just watching TV, you don't always want it to be super big in your face. You don't want that level of immersion all the time. So, getting a more reasonably sized display really does make more sense as a primary viewing display. Due to our floor layout, the 64" TV often is viewed from the kitchen which puts us at 15+ feet away quite often. But, I can sit close on the couch which puts me about 8' away as well. Being closer is certainly more immersive in this case and is not a bad way to watch a movie for sure.

I totally understand; we are definitely not looking for the "in your face" look when watching cable, as that really annoys my wife and for the small amount of broadcast TV viewing I do on the big screen in this living room, the smaller sets wouldn't bother me. The thing is, even for serious film watching, we cannot get closer than 12 feet which is where our love seat and couch is from the display...I need to find a display that would be a good mate for this seating distance, yet not go as big as the 100-inch-plus Panasonic or a front projection setup.

It does come down to some budgetary stuff though. I would strongly recommend that if you were having any woodwork done, then you should probably plan to make the opening large enough to handle something as large as the 80" Sharp.

Seriously, after buying the Samsung, the only other display I would consider for that location would be the 80" Sharp.

Thank you very much; going to consider that -- although I don't think there's any way we're gonna get the 80" plus our speakers and sub on this wall...