The Title Isn't as Dirty as it Seems...Will 10 Inches Make the Difference?

[PearlcorderS701]

Okay.

I'm sure the thread title got everyone's attention; it actually is cemented in a serious dilemma.

We (the wife and I) may be considering upgrading our 50" Sony SXRD rear pro display for something bigger in our main viewing room, but the limitation is that we're stuck using a wall unit/entertainment center that will only hold, seemingly, between a 55 and 58 inch screen, give or take. We're at an approximate 12 foot seating distance in this room, and this cannot change either -- so getting closer to the screen is out of the question too.

We were walking around a local Best Buy the other day, and started looking at the 60" flat panel models they had on display, but, in an ingenious scheme by the store, came upon and fell in love with a Sharp 70" LCD they had hanging above the 50" and up screens -- this thing had a GORGEOUS picture, and of course, it dwarfed the 60's that were beneath it. My wife immediately said the 60" size, looking at it in the store, wouldn't make much of a difference over our 50" we have now impact-wise, and actually started to fall for the Sharp 70 incher -- who am I to argue, in my right mind, with that?

The problem was obvious once we got home and measured our space for the display in the wall unit -- there was NO WAY we were getting a 70" in this cutout, so we were unfortunately back to considering a 60 incher...

Here's the thing, though: First, would 10 inches make a viewing improvement based on our distance of 12 feet? If we were to go with a 60" display, will we see a somewhat dramatic increase in viewing impact in terms of watching films? I know all about the distance vs. screen resolution charts and what that entails -- I am WELL aware of the fact that we are supposedly not resolving 1080p on a 50" at our distance now (even though our current SXRD is a 1080p set), and that we probably won't even with a 60", so please do not suggest any charts to look at; I have seen them all, and we have to work with what we have. I'd simply like to know if we should experience a more enjoyable, somewhat more immersive image moving up the 10 inches.

Further, there MAY be a way to MAYBE, somehow JUST squeeze a 65 or 70 incher in the space we're working with after I realized today that we have some very outer edges of the wall unit's TV cutout to work with, and that MAY allow for a VERY thin, narrow-bezeled screen to maybe fit (something like Samsung's LCDs with the nothing-but-screen look)...

Regardless of which size we end up going with, it's obviously going to be either LCD or plasma (as we're not getting into the super-sized Mitsubishi DLP rear projection sets) and that brings me to the next dilemma: What's the better screen for watching films, in everyone's opinion? I happen to like the interpolation/motion smoothing features on the LCDs which, when activated, make film sources appear as surreal video (the "soap opera look") although I would use this in moderation (and I realize this is far from the filmmakers' intents); for this reason, I am leaning towards a new LED LCD, but what are your thoughts?

Finally, should a new LCD or plasma look "better" than the SXRD we have been using for years now? Should the picture kind of "pop" more being that we'll be going from a rear projection LCoS/SXRD display to an advanced LED LCD, etc?

 

[darien87]

I just recently looked at some 65" TV's the other day because I want to step up from our 52" and honestly it didn't look like much of a difference. I hate to say it but I think for the difference to really be noticeable you're going to need to go up more than 10".

 

[trnqk7]

We recently went from a 50" Sony SXRD to a 55" Samsung LED (Best Buy model, the 6900 series with the thinner bezel like you were mentioning). Is the size difference dramatic? No-our viewing distance stayed about the same if not a little further now that it's wall mounted and not in the corner. Is is noticeably bigger? Yes. A 60" wouldn't have even fit in our suv to bring home anyway, but it would have also dwarfed the fireplace it's going over (cool to me, but not the wife-would've looked stupid if it was that big anyway). We are very happy with the set. There are shortcomings, no doubt, but it's a good compromise and has a nice picture. Would purchase again.

 

[gmichael]

I have a 106" screen and will be upgrading to 120" in the next month or so. I'd go for the 135" if I wouldn't have to make major changes to make it fit.

So my answer is to go as big as you can afford.
(I do sit about 19' from the screen)

 

[PearlcorderS701]

I just recently looked at some 65" TV's the other day because I want to step up from our 52" and honestly it didn't look like much of a difference. I hate to say it but I think for the difference to really be noticeable you're going to need to go up more than 10".

Thanks very much for the input, Darien.

Indeed, that is disheartening news -- however, I must say, if you were looking at the 65" sets in a store, amongst other large displays and the bright lights, the 65" would in fact not look bigger than your 52". THAT'S the exact same dilemma we faced when we walked around Best Buy looking at the 60" sets (as I mentioned in the original post), in that the 60 inchers looked no different from the 50" sets that were around them, so to us, in the store, it didn't look like much of a difference, if any at all. However, once you see a bigger screen AT HOME in your particular space, without the 70 and up screen sizes around it, it is most definitely going to appear larger...

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Thanks for the reply, turnquick.

We recently went from a 50" Sony SXRD to a 55" Samsung LED (Best Buy model, the 6900 series with the thinner bezel like you were mentioning).

Very cool -- did you have the same set as me, the A2020? Did you like the SXRD?

Is the size difference dramatic? No-our viewing distance stayed about the same if not a little further now that it's wall mounted and not in the corner.

I wouldn't have purchased a new screen for just five inches more; that's just me personally -- so, we don't want to look at 55 inch models but rather at least 58 to 60, if we can squeeze it in our space.

But I know what you mean about the distance going back a bit more because it's a flat panel vs. the SXRD -- in our case, this isn't going to happen, because the screen is going to be sitting on the low boy cabinet of a wall unit, with cabinet pieces all around it, and not mounted on a wall. So it will essentially sit at the same position and distance as our SXRD now...

Do you have any pics of your setup?

Is is noticeably bigger? Yes. A 60" wouldn't have even fit in our suv to bring home anyway, but it would have also dwarfed the fireplace it's going over (cool to me, but not the wife-would've looked stupid if it was that big anyway). We are very happy with the set. There are shortcomings, no doubt, but it's a good compromise and has a nice picture. Would purchase again.

Thank you for your honest opinion and input here; indeed, believe me -- we have had to make compromises as well (the fact that we're using a wall unit that holds a little bigger than a 55" screen, maybe...budget restraints...etc) so I know what you mean.

Whatever screen we end up getting, we're going to have to have it delivered because we don't have any trucks, just two midsize sedans, so size for bringing it home isn't a factor. I'd love to get the 70" in our space, but I don't think it's going to work...

Here's the main question I wanted to ask you: How does the new display look compared to your SXRD? Is there a picture improvement, or did you like the look of the rear projection better?

 

[BMXTRIX]

I've certainly seen all types of displays, but this comes down more to personal choice. The SXRD displays from Sony are some of the best which were ever produced with good black levels and a great image. Their biggest downfall would ahve to be that they are rear projection, which limits their light output significantly and in a bright room, this can be harsh on image quality.

The jump from 50" to 60" is noticable. It's not huge though. Not like the jump from 27" or 32" to 50" was. The big jump already is something you've done. Now 50"-60" is pretty 'normal' sized for a lot of people. We went from a 50" plasma to a 60" plasma at 12' and yes, it was noticable, but it wasn't night and day. The difference we just made going from 60" to 64" was amost non-existent. I'm thinking we may put in a 80" Sharp at some point, but not this year.

If you have another good location for the SXRD, then maximizing your size in the space you have available makes a lot of sense. If you don't have a good location for the SXRD to move to, then selling it may be possible. But, the upgrade is more a personal choice than a necessity. My upgrade from the 50" plasma to a 60" plasma was entirely a luxury purchase and my wife gave me grief about it! Of course, you have to realize that on your own and deal with whatever comes because of that decision.

But, because you have a good SXRD, you won't see a huge image improvement, and you will see a loss if you don't get a decent display. So, Panasonic plasma, Samsung plasma, Samsung LCD, or Sony LCD are the first recommendations.

To maximize size, you will have to get into the specifications for each display and start reading, then balancing that against your budget.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Hey BMX,

Thanks so much for the input and reply, my friend; let me address each of these approaches separately because you bring up some interesting points that I'd like to explore.

I've certainly seen all types of displays, but this comes down more to personal choice. The SXRD displays from Sony are some of the best which were ever produced with good black levels and a great image. Their biggest downfall would ahve to be that they are rear projection, which limits their light output significantly and in a bright room, this can be harsh on image quality.

Indeed; we're not really experiencing poor video quality, at all; on the contrary, Blu-rays are ripe with detail and a clean image and upscaled DVDs look good via our Oppo BD player. I happen to personally like the more "cartoonish" video look of the LCD displays over the rear projection models like my SXRD which tend to make film look very film-like and bordering on soft in terms of overall presentation. Still, that's not our problem -- I would just like a bigger screen size for a more immersive experience at our distance of 12 feet, but we're restricted by the entertainment center we own which won't hold more than a 60 -- if that -- and the seating distance which can't change.

The jump from 50" to 60" is noticable. It's not huge though.

This is disheartening, yet what I expected. In the stores, the 60 inch screens look pretty small on the wall of displays, as if they would make no bigger difference in visual impact over our 50 at all. That's what had us looking towards the 70 inch LCDs like from Sharp -- but we just can't fit it, and believe me, that's pissing me off.

Let me ask this, then -- the difference is noteworthy going from a 50 to a 60 inch, but should the film watching experience improve by going up just the 10 inches in our room? Should I be "worried" that in the stores, the 60" sets don't look that big? I'm thinking that once we get the screen home and set up, the difference when watching Blu-ray and DVD will definitely be experienced once the lights are down and we're in our seats compared to the 50"...do you think images will appear a bit larger on the 60" at least?

Not like the jump from 27" or 32" to 50" was. The big jump already is something you've done. Now 50"-60" is pretty 'normal' sized for a lot of people.

Indeed; this is disheartening as well, but true -- I'm even hearing now cries that "60 is the new 50!" when it comes to screen sizes. Back when I got my SXRD, to have the 60" version of my set was an unbelievable experience from what I read...now, the flat panel 60" sets just don't look all that big or impressive to me.

We went from a 50" plasma to a 60" plasma at 12' and yes, it was noticable, but it wasn't night and day. The difference we just made going from 60" to 64" was amost non-existent. I'm thinking we may put in a 80" Sharp at some point, but not this year.

So you too were watching a 50" from 12 feet? Was it decent for film watching? Did it bother you all that much?

I wouldn't think the jump four inches up would have made a big difference; that's why I don't want to get a 55" because I know we'd never notice any change. May I ask why you went from a 60 to a 64"?

Yeah, the Best Buy rep I was talking to last night told me that Sharp indeed has an 80" LED LCD but they only carried the 70" at their store.

If you have another good location for the SXRD, then maximizing your size in the space you have available makes a lot of sense. If you don't have a good location for the SXRD to move to, then selling it may be possible.

Well, let me say this -- we were thinking of moving the SXRD to our bedroom, but the wife doesn't really want to do this because of the way the TV would make the room appear, and I don't really blame her; we had this TV on an open glass Bell'O stand in our apartment before moving to this house and the living room just felt cold and dorm room-like with this open setup, if you can understand what I mean. We would have to use that same Bell'O stand in our bedroom to sit the 50" SXRD on, and corner-load the TV, and it would just kind of make the bedroom feel "cold" with too much TV screen in that room to look at.

The other option we have is to trade my mother for her 40" Samsung LCD, which we would put in our bedroom, giving her the SXRD for her new house she just bought, but that still leaves us with the expense of a new 60" screen. Then, as you point out, there is the option of selling the SXRD -- but what kind of market is out there for this TV? How much do you honestly think we could get for it? I mean, it's full 1080p, but who would want a bulky rear projection set in this market and how much would they be willing to pay for it? TV prices have come down so much, I don't think anyone would buy a used model, even though we just put a new lamp on it and the TV is like brand new, with the stickers still all over the speakers!

But, the upgrade is more a personal choice than a necessity. My upgrade from the 50" plasma to a 60" plasma was entirely a luxury purchase and my wife gave me grief about it! Of course, you have to realize that on your own and deal with whatever comes because of that decision.

But, as a serious HT enthusiast who uses the system almost every evening, I don't think it's really a personal choice over a necessity in my case; the 50" screen at our seating distance just looks small, especially when watching films that are in the letterboxed format (2.35:1 / 2.40:1) and therefore don't eat up the whole screen's "real estate" (they contain the black bars on top and bottom). When watching these kinds of films on our 50" from 12 feet, the screen feels like a portable monitor you bring to the football game...

But, because you have a good SXRD, you won't see a huge image improvement, and you will see a loss if you don't get a decent display. So, Panasonic plasma, Samsung plasma, Samsung LCD, or Sony LCD are the first recommendations.

Are you serious about this? Really -- we would actually see a DECREASE in PQ by getting a new LCD or plasma compared to the SXRD, possibly based on our decision of which model we'd get?

I definitely have the Sony and Samsung LCDs in mind -- as well as the Panny plasma -- but we're not sure if we want to go with plasma or LCD yet. Further, you didn't put the Sharp LCDs on your list...do you not recommend these, even if we were able to fit the 70" in our space?

To maximize size, you will have to get into the specifications for each display and start reading, then balancing that against your budget.

Indeed; we took measurements last night of our wall unit space and it seems we would be able to JUST squeeze a 60" in the cutout, but there's no way a 70" is getting in there unfortunately.

Now, based on what you're saying, I'm not sure that getting a 10 inch bigger screen makes any sense -- it seems we may just be throwing away 3 grand for no perceived increase in immersiveness in our room...

 

[BMXTRIX]

Why I went from a 60" to a 64" TV...
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/televisions-displays/75772-shoot-me-please.html

You likely will see similar overall quality with a Sharp vs. the Sony, but the Sony SXRD is close to class leading technology. My brother had my old Sampo 50" plasma and a similar make Sony SXRD to what you have, and the difference in image quality was definitely there. He ended up replacing the cheap 50" plasma with a Panasonic 65" display, which was a huge jump in quality, but similar overall to the 60" SXRD television.

Is it more immersive? I think the big jump for me going from the 50" to the 60" was the jump in quality that we got with a really good display. The size was noticable for sure. Going from 50" to 60" is a 20% increase in size. But, in our minds, 50" displays are normal. 40" displays are SMALL. I don't even like the 42" LCD in our bedroom anymore, its just to small for me.

So, yeah, our perceptions have shifted. But, 60" is still a good size, and if you are going to be in the house for years, then now is the time to go ahead and upgrade. It's still a personal decision, but I don't think you would be at all upset with going into a Samsung 60" plasma/lcd now, and just enjoying it for the next 10+ years. If you can't change that space to put in 70"/80" in size, and don't see that ever being the case, then maximizing the space now will give you the most years of enjoyment with a display.

Perhaps the biggest jump you will get, especially by going with LCD, is that the display will be significantly brighter, which will make daytime viewing a very enjoyable experience.

Because the SXRD is good, the image quality jump won't be huge. Image size won't be as impactful due to you already experiencing a large screen. Brightness will be significant. Overall, satisfaction, should be excellent, and I think that really matters. You should be VERY happy with a maximized screen size over the long term.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Why I went from a 60" to a 64" TV...
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/televisions-displays/75772-shoot-me-please.html

I see...

Long story short, your 60" was broken by one of your kids? Did I read that right?

You likely will see similar overall quality with a Sharp vs. the Sony, but the Sony SXRD is close to class leading technology. My brother had my old Sampo 50" plasma and a similar make Sony SXRD to what you have, and the difference in image quality was definitely there. He ended up replacing the cheap 50" plasma with a Panasonic 65" display, which was a huge jump in quality, but similar overall to the 60" SXRD television.

I see...

Is it more immersive? I think the big jump for me going from the 50" to the 60" was the jump in quality that we got with a really good display. The size was noticable for sure. Going from 50" to 60" is a 20% increase in size. But, in our minds, 50" displays are normal. 40" displays are SMALL. I don't even like the 42" LCD in our bedroom anymore, its just to small for me.

Indeed; but isn't the jump from 50 to 60 inches more like a 40 something percent increase?

So, yeah, our perceptions have shifted. But, 60" is still a good size, and if you are going to be in the house for years, then now is the time to go ahead and upgrade. It's still a personal decision, but I don't think you would be at all upset with going into a Samsung 60" plasma/lcd now, and just enjoying it for the next 10+ years. If you can't change that space to put in 70"/80" in size, and don't see that ever being the case, then maximizing the space now will give you the most years of enjoyment with a display.

I suppose that's very logical...

Perhaps the biggest jump you will get, especially by going with LCD, is that the display will be significantly brighter, which will make daytime viewing a very enjoyable experience.

Yeah, I keep hearing about the increase in brightness for daytime viewing, but to be honest, our SXRD when set to the brighter "Auto 1" dynamic iris setting looks fine with sunlight streaming in if it's a scene that has a lot of brightness (i.e. outdoor, sunlit sequences or commercials).

Because the SXRD is good, the image quality jump won't be huge. Image size won't be as impactful due to you already experiencing a large screen. Brightness will be significant. Overall, satisfaction, should be excellent, and I think that really matters. You should be VERY happy with a maximized screen size over the long term.

Thanks for your overall conclusion here; if you have any further thoughts, I'd like to continue to read about them.

My biggest question thus becomes...when is a screen simply big enough if you're not doing a front projection setup? In other words, 60 inch screens have become the new 50, in which 60 just seems "normal" and "right" (not so huge as they once were)...when does this upsizing end? I mean, sure, I'd love an 80 inch set in my living room -- but I am sure that won't satisfy after awhile, so what do we do?

 

[Matt34]

Thought this sounded familiar:

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/televisions-displays/69521-will-eight-8-inches-make-difference.html

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Indeed, Matt; but that was when we thought we ONLY had eight inches to play with (oh boy...I know how that sounded) -- now, it seems we may be able to get a screen 10 inches larger in there.

 

[BMXTRIX]

This conversation is getting less heterosexual with every response.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

LOL......

 

[PearlcorderS701]

UPDATE:

Okay -- we have a handyman over right now to take care of some things for us, and we asked him about the possibility of modifying our current wall unit/entertainment center so that it could fit a 70" screen. He said it's possible, as the pieces appear to be modular in our unit so they can move outwards...

And so now we're back to considering a 70" display instead of the 60...the wall unit would need some modifying, but it would be a hell of a lot less than starting over with a new wall unit AND a new screen which is what we'd have to do if we went with a 70 and ditched the wall unit we have now...

Here's my question, friends...and please give me some sincere input: Will going from our 50" SXRD to a 70" flat panel yield a noticeable difference in picture impact at 12 feet? An honest opinion here would be greatly appreciated; if you still don't think the 20 inch increase would make the experience in our room more immersive, please explain why.

Thank you.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Also Guys,

If we were to put our SXRD up for sale, what do y'all think we could get for it via Craigslist or another site? The TV is basically still brand new, with all stickers still on the speaker/bezel and I have all the manuals...the unit is kept in top notch shape, being cleaned and dusted regularly, and it wasn't too long ago that we changed the lamp in it (the first replacement since owning it).

What would one of these go for used? It is, of course, a 1080p panel...

Additionally -- if I were to go with a 70" screen, what would be recommended at this size? There are no 70" plasmas as of right now, are there? I have my eye on that Sharp LED which looked amazing at my local Best Buy, and I can't afford the 20 grand Sony wants for one of their 70" LCDs, so what other brands can I look at?

 

[trnqk7]

Sorry it took so long to respond...I don't have any pictures of the setup. The original tv we had was the A2000. As far as picture quality-it was great at the time, but the picture is much better now, particularly with the black levels being so improved.

 

[darien87]

UPDATE:
Here's my question, friends...and please give me some sincere input: Will going from our 50" SXRD to a 70" flat panel yield a noticeable difference in picture impact at 12 feet? An honest opinion here would be greatly appreciated; if you still don't think the 20 inch increase would make the experience in our room more immersive, please explain why.

Thank you.

I think that will do nicely. A 20" increase is significant..................... that's what she said.

 

[gmichael]

Two 8 inchers would be better

but 10 inches should do nicely.

 

[BMXTRIX]

20" is a significant jump in size. As said earlier, and it still holds true, we are conditioned for larger displays right now. 70" isn't huge. It WAS huge, but now it isn't. Will it apppear significantly larger than 50"? You better believe it!

From 12' that's a really good size. I'm pretty dead set that eventually I will get the Sharp 80" display (have you seen that one yet?) - I saw it over at my local Best Buy and it is ridiculous. Since I'm a ridiculous person, I liked it a lot. Still, the 70" is a great way to go and the price is well beyond belief compared to what other manufacturers have managed to deliver in the last couple of years.

No other real options at that size that I'm aware of. I expect we will see more in the next year or so, but most manufacturers are finally getting into the 60" range, they still have a ways to go to be like Sharp and just produce more 70"+ sized displays at a reasonable price.