SVS SB2000 vs Klipsch R-10SW

[SonomaComa]

I had the Klipsch R-10SW paired with two Martin Logan Motion 4 speakers. Then I returned the Klipsch R-10SW for an SVS SB-2000. It sounded to me that the Klipsch was getting the lower notes....alot.
It is only for home theater use in the bedroom. Those little Martin Logan Motion 4 Speakers are on stands right directly on each corner at the foot of my bed.
With the 10" Klipsch Sub I watched Fast & Furious 6. It really shook the room on certain scenes Pencils on the dresser danced around a little. I got the highs and the shaking lows but something was missing towards the middle. Not alot, just some. So I returned it after a week and purchased the SVS SB-2000. I watched Pacific Rim, (I heard of someone else using it to audition subs). Now I do not get the room shaking like I did before.
It does form seamlessly with the Motion 4 speakers now, but it just does not get down to the deep bass like expected and like it did with the Klipsch. What is amazing is that that it now sounds like I have big floor standing speakers. Big floor standing speakers in need of a sub. What gives?? A 10" $349.00 sub (http://www.klipsch.com/R-10SW/details) vs a 12" 699.99 sub (http://www.svsound.com/subwoofers/sealed-box/sb-2000) I thought for sure the SVS would fill in the missing frequency gap towards the middle and add even more thunder-boom at the bottom. I used the Audyssey to calibrate the subs each time. They are both in the same location of the room. The Motion 4's (http://www.martinlogan.com/pdf/brochures/brochure_motion4.pdf) are rated from 70-25,00HZ. The SVS is rated 19-220Hz and the Klipsch only 32-120Hz.
So how can that Klipsch have the bass that you can actually feel and the SVS does not?
Marantz SR6007
Martin Logan Motion 4
SVS SB-2000

 

[rnatalli]

Try a sub crawl and turn the gain on the SVS up to 2 o'clock.

 

[WaynePflughaupt]

I agree with rmatalli, it sounds like the SVS's level is too low. Still, if you’re going to compare two subwoofers, you really should use the same movie for both. There is no industry standard for bass in movies. It can differ tremendously in volume level and EQ from one to the next.

Also, I’d suggest getting a room measurement program like Room EQ Wizard. That way you can really know what’s going on with your bass response instead of just guessing and speculating.

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt

 

[j_garcia]

Good bass does not call attention to itself, it just sounds right. Many people who compare crappy subs to a good one make similar comments. The lesser sub "sounds" like it is doing more because it is louder in a particular range, but nowhere else, and that is by design. Manufacturers know that will tend to impress those who've never heard a quality sub. Live with the SVS for a little while longer and give it a chance and I think you'll come to find it is better than you think. When I first went to good bookshelf speakers and a sub from my towers I felt something was missing too, but what really happened was I was hearing sound that lacked that big "hump" in the lower midrange that was not accurate; I just became accustomed to it.

Also, did you check what Audessey did rather than just accept its settings? I know if I run mine a few times I can get different results, so I always check the settings to see what it did.

Play around with the positioning of the mains as a deficiency in the lower midrange may be the mains not the sub.

 

[Muzykant]

That Klipsch is a ported sub, while SVS is a sealed sub. The Klipsch will probably have more output around its tuning frequency, while SVS will output more linearly and have a natural shallow roll-off. Your SVS should dig deeper than that Klipsch.

It can also be your room. Sealed subs are designed for smaller spaces. I have an SB-2000 in a small room and the bass is very powerful and incredibly deep (much deeper than the specs suggest). That is because the low frequencies are amplified in a small space. It is called room gain. I also have a pair of SB-2000s in a room twice the size, and the low bass is much weaker and doesn't dig nearly as deep. That is because the larger room does not provide as much room gain as the smaller one. Even my pair of SB-13 Ultras are swallowed by a room of similar size.

And of course, try sub gain adjustment and bass crawl test.

 

[j_garcia]

Larger rooms provide less gain but also allow the lower waveforms to properly form which can yield better response. In a smaller room, you tend to have more room modes as a result of the waves never being able to fully develop before being reflected.

 

[SonomaComa]

Well, I have been tried different settings in the SR6007 AVR and still am not getting that deep bass that can be felt. The Phase is set to 0 degrees, Low Pass to LFE and volume is at 2 o'clock. I ran the Audyssey set up with those same settings but volume was at 12 o'clock. The sub will play louder but not deeper.
I noticed when calibrating with Audyssey the Klipsch produced a nice "thud", the SVS just sounded like little taps. I thought for sure the hands down winner would be the SVS. After all it is the Klipsch being a 10", 150w, 32-120Hz vs a 12", 500w, 19-220Hz unit and twice as much moolah. I read so much how people said the SVS rocks the foundation. The room it is in is 12'x17', 204 Sq. feet, 1,632 Cu.feet. That SVS is for rooms up to 3,000 Cu. feet.
So sad now.....

 

[j_garcia]

That's kind of what I was getting at already - that "thud" may be fun, but it is NOT accurate sound. Sounds like what you may want is a PB2000 not the SB2000 - see if SVS will swap it out for you, because you WILL get less "thud" from a sealed sub.

 

[SonomaComa]

I spoke to a representative at SVS. They have excellent phone service! They answer the phone promptly and the person on the other end is very informative. I told him what speakers and AVR I was using and he looked it up on his computer. Instead of the Audyssey settings he said set them up manually. Then said to set the front speakers to "small", set the crossover to 90Hz, and under the Subwoofer Mode set the Sub to LFE (not LFE+Main), set the LPF for LFE to 120Hz, turn the Sub up to 3/4, leave the Low Pass Filter to LFE and the Phase to 0 degrees. That really made a big difference.

 

[PENG]

I spoke to a representative at SVS. They have excellent phone service! They answer the phone promptly and the person on the other end is very informative. I told him what speakers and AVR I was using and he looked it up on his computer. Instead of the Audyssey settings he said set them up manually. Then said to set the front speakers to "small", set the crossover to 90Hz, and under the Subwoofer Mode set the Sub to LFE (not LFE+Main), set the LPF for LFE to 120Hz, turn the Sub up to 3/4, leave the Low Pass Filter to LFE and the Phase to 0 degrees. That really made a big difference.

So you had your front speakers set to large? No wonder you were not getting bass. Your might have misunderstood SVS. They probably meant to tell you to run Audyssey, but after that go back to "manually" set the front speakers to small and change the crossovers to 80-100 Hz. Typically when you run Audyssey, your AVR will set your front speakers to large if they are large book shelf or tower types. Audyssey has told people numerous times that they do not set speakers to large, it is the AVR manufacture who choose to set them to large. Audyssey always tell their user to "manually" change the setting to small.

You should visit the Audyssey website and if too busy, at least read up on the FAQ section.

 

[SonomaComa]

The front speakers were always set to small. Then I just adjusted the crossover to 90Hz instead of 60Hz and set the LPF for the LFE to 120.
But now I'm wondering what level to adjust the Speakers & Sub too and what Distance to set them too. Lots of stuff here...

 

[SonomaComa]

• Ok, I now have the Distance on the two front speakers and the sub set to 7.5ft. Both front speakers are at -2.0db and the sub at +3.5db The MultEQ XT is set to Audyssey, not AudysseyFlat or Graphic EQ or Off. The Reference Level Offset is set to 0db. Dynamic Volume is Off. On the M-DAX menu the Mode is set to Off, not on Low, Middle, or High.

 

[PENG]

• Ok, I now have the Distance on the two front speakers and the sub set to 7.5ft. Both front speakers are at -2.0db and the sub at +3.5db The MultEQ XT is set to Audyssey, not AudysseyFlat or Graphic EQ or Off. The Reference Level Offset is set to 0db. Dynamic Volume is Off. On the M-DAX menu the Mode is set to Off, not on Low, Middle, or High.

One thing Audyssey does good is the dynamic EQ. If you have that option, try turning it on and you may like it. I have it on all the time now even for music. If you always listen at very loud level such as volume at -10 or higher than it won't make noticeable difference.

 

[KEW]

One thing Audyssey does good is the dynamic EQ. If you have that option, try turning it on and you may like it. I have it on all the time now even for music. If you always listen at very loud level such as volume at -10 or higher than it won't make noticeable difference.

I agree completely, but wanted to add that if you listen at -10db all of the time, you may find that with Dynamic EQ you are enjoying the sound at lower volumes because you don't have to crank it to get a full, balanced sound.

It is essentially a loudness control (if you date back a ways), except it is a much better implementation than most. The old loudness controls typically over-did the treble and bass.

 

[SonomaComa]

The Marantz SR6007 does have Dynamic EQ and it is on. The Dynamic Volume is set to off, not Low, Medium, or Heavy compression. The Reference Level Offset is set to 0dB.
What does the Dynamic Volume compression do?