Sub advice, around $1000

[Nuance AH]

I've read through most of the threads about how the CHT was run in that shootout and it certainly wasn't run as Craig would have wanted or how others normally run it. It did very well in the two brothers shootout. The amp showing the clipping light doesn't concern me either as my volumes don't get close to the max volumes they were getting. Chase seems like the most bang for your buck in subs and Craig seems very knowledgeable and dedicated to his customers. Wish I could hear some before buying but I've done the same things with cars before so I 'm used to it. I appreciate all the the input.

Subs aren't like speakers in that you absolutely need to hear them before you buy them, in my opinion. I would purchase based on the desired size/dimension constraints, performance and price. CHT's sub is a beast and I think is the cheapest offering. While Curtis may not agree, Craig is a great guy and very passionate about this hobby. I wouldn't hesitate purchasing something from him (I actually already have - a pair of bookshelf speakers, and they are awesome for the money). Whatever you go with, whether it's Rythmik, HSU, CHT, SVS, Epik, Funk Audio, etc, I am sure you'll really enjoy it.

 

[Bigotis]

I saw that the Outlaw EX's are on sale now, I wonder how duals of this would sound compared to the HPv15 Rythmik? I think the Rythmik is more musical according to everyone but the dual Outlaws at $1100 or so shipped is appealing.

 

[its phillip]

I like the LFM-1 EX a lot, but a single FV15HP will still have much more output than 2 EXs (no comment on SQ, since I've never heard the rythmik). Of course, if max output isn't your primary goal, 2 subs would be nice since you could potentially have more even coverage/response...but you could always buy another FV15HP later

 

[Nuance AH]

I like the LFM-1 EX a lot, but a single FV15HP will still have much more output than 2 EXs (no comment on SQ, since I've never heard the rythmik). Of course, if max output isn't your primary goal, 2 subs would be nice since you could potentially have more even coverage/response...but you could always buy another FV15HP later

^ This. I am posting these charts all over today, but below you can see the Outlaw and Rythmik measured (max SPL):

 

[Bigotis]

I'm thinking I might need to expand my budget to get what I need in the room, thinking about the Seaton Submersive or dual Epik Empires. Another question is the receiver I'm using for the new subs is a Yamaha RX-V667, it uses Yamaha's YPAO system calibration, how good is this compared to Audyssey? Thanks for the help so far. I've looked at the anti-mode 8033, interesting product.

 

[jjackkrash]

I'm thinking I might need to expand my budget to get what I need in the room, thinking about the Seaton Submersive or dual Epik Empires. Another question is the receiver I'm using for the new subs is a Yamaha RX-V667, it uses Yamaha's YPAO system calibration, how good is this compared to Audyssey? Thanks for the help so far. I've looked at the anti-mode 8033, interesting product.

A Submersive HP would be a great choice. IIRC, that Yamaha won't eq a sub, I'd find this out if I were you. I would rather have Audyssey MultEq XT that will eq a sub, and if I were running duals, I would want XT32, which will eq duals. If you are going to stick with the Yamaha and it won't eq the sub, getting anti-mode 8033 makes sense. You might want to look into a Denon 4311, it has XT32 and a street price of <$1350 right now and then you would have a new receiver and could skip anti-mode.

 

[GranteedEV]

Subs aren't like speakers in that you absolutely need to hear them before you buy them, in my opinion.

+1

I also think that once you get into most I.D. vented 12s and sealed 15s, most people start getting into excess headroom territory unless they run their subs hot, or need sub-20hz performance.

 

[Bigotis]

A Submersive HP would be a great choice. IIRC, that Yamaha won't eq a sub, I'd find this out if I were you. I would rather have Audyssey MultEq XT that will eq a sub, and if I were running duals, I would want XT32, which will eq duals. If you are going to stick with the Yamaha and it won't eq the sub, getting anti-mode 8033 makes sense. You might want to look into a Denon 4311, it has XT32 and a street price of <$1350 right now and then you would have a new receiver and could skip anti-mode.

How do you think the XT32 version compares to what the anti-mode 8033 can do? I've looked at the SMS-1 but it appears it can only do one set of filtering and applies this to all subs.

 

[timoteo]

Audyssey XT32 is great but another option out there that always gets overlooked is the Yamaha Aventage line. Not all of them but the 2 top models (RX-A2000/2010 & RX-A3000/3010) DO have actual dual sub outs including dual sub calibration. Not only does YPAO automatically calibrate for dual subs, but you can go in to Manual mode & have COMPLETE control over the Parametric EQ for both sub AND all the INDIVIDUAL speakers!

I own the RX-A2000 & am taking advantage of the EQ. I have recently spent time EQing my system with incredible results.
FYI: The SubEQ has 4 Bands of EQ power, Frequency adjustment & Q adjustment.

If i were to go with an external EQ system, id go with the Beheringer Feedback Destroyer/Dayton mic/free REW software route. For a few hundred bucks you get a very powerful EQ system. There is a bit of a learning curve BUT once you figure out how to measure correctly, the Beheringer & REW work together & apply the EQ on their own.

Remember though that not all situations NEED such a powerful EQ. If you measure & find the best sub location, adjust the settings on the sub to your advantage & apply SOME EQ (such as found in the Yamaha or XT32) you may find that gets you pretty d@mn Flat.

So if i were you, id take an SPL meter, get some measurements of the room response & see just how flat you can get before EQ. Then if your graphs look like a crazy roller coaster THEN youll know what kind of EQ youll need.

 

[Bigotis]

Audyssey XT32 is great but another option out there that always gets overlooked is the Yamaha Aventage line. Not all of them but the 2 top models (RX-A2000/2010 & RX-A3000/3010) DO have actual dual sub outs including dual sub calibration. Not only does YPAO automatically calibrate for dual subs, but you can go in to Manual mode & have COMPLETE control over the Parametric EQ for both sub AND all the INDIVIDUAL speakers!

I own the RX-A2000 & am taking advantage of the EQ. I have recently spent time EQing my system with incredible results.
FYI: The SubEQ has 4 Bands of EQ power, Frequency adjustment & Q adjustment.

If i were to go with an external EQ system, id go with the Beheringer Feedback Destroyer/Dayton mic/free REW software route. For a few hundred bucks you get a very powerful EQ system. There is a bit of a learning curve BUT once you figure out how to measure correctly, the Beheringer & REW work together & apply the EQ on their own.

Remember though that not all situations NEED such a powerful EQ. If you measure & find the best sub location, adjust the settings on the sub to your advantage & apply SOME EQ (such as found in the Yamaha or XT32) you may find that gets you pretty d@mn Flat.

So if i were you, id take an SPL meter, get some measurements of the room response & see just how flat you can get before EQ. Then if your graphs look like a crazy roller coaster THEN youll know what kind of EQ youll need.

Are you using the REW software to produce the graphs?

 

[timoteo]

No i did it the hard way by making the graphs myself. But online you can find charts where you enter all the values & it plots them itself. I do want to get into REW but havent yet. Im really getting great results with my test disc & SPL meter. I know it could be more accurate & Flat if i went a more technical route. But i already had the meter & disc so i took the time to measure the old school way. The audible improvement was more than subtle, plus i learned A LOT about my room & its effect. Very educational & to me, enjoyable. To get these results on my own felt good.

 

[Bigotis]

No i did it the hard way by making the graphs myself. But online you can find charts where you enter all the values & it plots them itself. I do want to get into REW but havent yet. Im really getting great results with my test disc & SPL meter. I know it could be more accurate & Flat if i went a more technical route. But i already had the meter & disc so i took the time to measure the old school way. The audible improvement was more than subtle, plus i learned A LOT about my room & its effect. Very educational & to me, enjoyable. To get these results on my own felt good.

I don't think I have the time right now to do what you have done, very impressive, maybe sometime I can. As far as controlling the subs to get a nice flat response which would be more accurate, the anti-mode 8033 or an new AV receiver with the XT32? I really hate to invest in a new receiver but really want to get rid of the boom and decay in my next setup. Thanks

 

[timoteo]

I have read a lot of good things about XT32. I dont know all the details on it though. If you have manual EQ capabilities for the subs then it could be very helpful. Antimode is another great option. Or a Behringer Feedback Destroyer. My Yamaha RX-A2000 has a pretty nice sub EQ system built into the YPAO. Each sub has 4 bands of EQ, Frequency adjustments & Q settings. Combining those with the adjustment options on the HSU subs has given me very satisfying results!

A new AVR?...Maybe...but id prob measure your response first to see how bad the room response is. Then probably get an external EQ to add to your existing receiver.