Quick Question Regarding the Pioneer VSX1130K

[sizzam]

Hi I was tweaking with the settings a bit and when I set all speakers to "small" The Sub-Woofer has the option for a "plus" setting still, I am running my receiver in passive BI-Amp Mode for the towers built in 10" woofers, does the "plus" setting affect the way the receiver treats the Bi-Amped 10"s in the mains or no? Much Love

 

[lovinthehd]

The avr if setting speakers to use bass management (i.e. small) then each of the speaker terminals' signals (i.e. the two terminals you're using to passively bi-amp) will get the crossover you set applied.

 

[sizzam]

The avr if setting speakers to use bass management (i.e. small) then each of the speaker terminals' signals (i.e. the two terminals you're using to passively bi-amp) will get the crossover you set applied.

exactly what I needed to know thanks I was wondering if it did anything to affect the bi amp settings like for instance setting the sub-woofer to "plus" would enable the bi-amp or some such.

big help thanks

 

[lovinthehd]

There are no bi-amp "settings"....just two terminals outputting the same signal....

 

[sizzam]

There are no bi-amp "settings"....just two terminals outputting the same signal....

are you talking about the passive bi-amp feature of my receiver?

 

[Pogre]

are you talking about the passive bi-amp feature of my receiver?

All you're doing is dividing a single power source among extra sets of binding posts. It's not really "bi amping" and more "bi wiring" with an AVR, IMO. I say that because you're pulling from the same single power source and not really gaining anything from the configuration. It's more a marketing gimmick. True bi amping involves active crossovers and separate amplifiers.

 

[sizzam]

All you're doing is dividing a single power source among extra sets of binding posts. It's not really "bi amping" and more "bi wiring" with an AVR, IMO. I say that because you're pulling from the same single power source and not really gaining anything from the configuration. It's more a marketing gimmick. True bi amping involves active crossovers and separate amplifiers.

I can understand that but I thought the point of bi-amping is that it sends the mids and highs through one channel and the lows through the other channel therefore reducing the strain on the dac per channel and making it more efficient by halving the workload and halving the perceived ohms required to power it since its no longer using the channels for a separate speaker but instead a integrated low driver in the mains?

 

[Pogre]

I can understand that but I thought the point of bi-amping is that it sends the mids and highs through one channel and the lows through the other channel therefore reducing the strain on the dac per channel and making it more efficient by halving the workload and halving the perceived ohms required to power it since its no longer using the channels for a separate speaker but instead a integrated low driver in the mains?

No. You're sending the exact same signal to both sets of posts. The passive crossover network inside the speaker is what filters high and low frequencies going to each driver.

 

[lovinthehd]

are you talking about the passive bi-amp feature of my receiver?

Yes, many have the assumption that somehow the avr is providing an active crossover, only a few avrs ever have had that feature and yours isn't one of them. It's just a duplicate signal, mostly about marketing. Like Pogre said....

You can get more details in this article https://www.audioholics.com/frequent-questions/the-difference-between-biamping-vs-biwiring

 

[Pogre]

Yes, many have the assumption that somehow the avr is providing an active crossover, only a few avrs ever have had that feature and yours isn't one of them. It's just a duplicate signal, mostly about marketing. Like Pogre said....

You can get more details in this article https://www.audioholics.com/frequent-questions/the-difference-between-biamping-vs-biwiring

I did not know that there were some receivers that actually did that. Though now that you mention it, I think you might have told me this before. I was right this time, but I've got to be careful not to give out wrong advice! I'll do a little Google work on it in my spare time.

 

[lovinthehd]

I did not know that there were some receivers that actually did that. Though now that you mention it, I think you might have told me this before. I was right this time, but I've got to be careful not to give out wrong advice! I'll do a little Google work on it in my spare time.

Yeah Onkyo 818 (noob's) and 929 I think were the only ones at least among the major brands....

 

[timmyleohoward]

There are no bi-amp "settings"....just two terminals outputting the same signal....

I was curious about bi-amping. Does it have a noticeable difference? I've got two terminals on my towers. I bi-amped my old speakers and I couldn't tell a difference at all.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

 

[Pogre]

I was curious about bi-amping. Does it have a noticeable difference? I've got two terminals on my towers. I bi-amped my old speakers and I couldn't tell a difference at all.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

Your experience is the same as mine, meaning I don't hear a difference. It didn't make anything worse either tho so I still have them connected that way.

 

[lovinthehd]

I was curious about bi-amping. Does it have a noticeable difference? I've got two terminals on my towers. I bi-amped my old speakers and I couldn't tell a difference at all.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

Did you read the article I linked? Yes, many speakers have such terminals, it's become a marketing requirement, like the passive bi-amping terminals on avrs. I consider it a waste of wire/time myself, but knock yourself out.

 

[timmyleohoward]

I was curious about bi-amping. Does it have a noticeable difference? I've got two terminals on my towers. I bi-amped my old speakers and I couldn't tell a difference at all.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

I agree! I'm not bi-amping anything.
It's a waist of wire to me.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

 

[sizzam]

Well after doing a bit of research and whatnot ill hand it to you that I thought that the receiver would separate the workload in an active crossover when bi-amping but it seems it just doubles the draw on the power-supply by sending the same signal, so I learned something it seems thanks to you lot. cheers

 

[PENG]

Well after doing a bit of research and whatnot ill hand it to you that I thought that the receiver would separate the workload in an active crossover when bi-amping but it seems it just doubles the draw on the power-supply by sending the same signal, so I learned something it seems thanks to you lot. cheers

Just to be clearer and more accurate, the preamp sends the same signal to the power amp bi-amp or not. So the power amp has to amplify the same signal in terms of voltage, but it will not send the same signal in terms of current to the speaker terminals as such.

In fact, one amplifier will send the higher frequency signal to one set of speaker terminals and the other amp will send the lower frequency signal to the other set of speaker terminals. The frequency range split will depend on the crossover characteristics of the speaker.

 

[Verdinut]

In fact, one amplifier will send the higher frequency signal to one set of speaker terminals and the other amp will send the lower frequency signal to the other set of speaker terminals. The frequency range split will depend on the crossover characteristics of the speaker.

If each amplifier only sends a portion of the frequency range, then you are actively bi-amping. You know that in a passive bi-amping situation such as the one we are referring to here, , both amplifiers send the full frequency signal and the frequency range is actually split by the passive crossover which is in the speaker enclosure.

 

[Pogre]

In fact, one amplifier will send the higher frequency signal to one set of speaker terminals and the other amp will send the lower frequency signal to the other set of speaker terminals. The frequency range split will depend on the crossover characteristics of the speaker.

If each amplifier only sends a portion of the frequency range, then you are actively bi-amping. You know that in a passive bi-amping situation such as the one we are referring to here, , both amplifiers send the full frequency signal and the frequency range is actually split by the passive crossover which is in the speaker enclosure.

I almost quoted @PENG about this too. I'm not sure how to interpret what he's saying, the difference between the voltage and current. Does the crossover filter prevent the amp from sending the full current, but sends the full voltage signal? It almost sounds like the opposite of what I posted earlier, but I might be interpreting it incorrectly.

 

[lovinthehd]

Might be easier to think that each part of the crossover will use the power from each amp channel that it needs....still, in the long run it just doesn't mean much.