PSB Image 2b's vs. PSB Alpha B1's

[rethomps]

I recently purchased a new pair of PSB Alhpa B1's to serve as my fronts for my Yamaha RXV 1500. I love the sound of the B1's and am very happy with them. More recently, I purchased a pair of second hand PSB Image 2b's with the plan of using them for my fronts and moving the Alpha's to my rear. The image 2B's sound good with a much fuller sound, but they seem to lack pronounceation compared to the Alpha's. I especiallly notice this in my Yamaha's Pure Direct mode (bypass circutry to provide cleaner sound); the alpha's sound amazing in pure direct where as the Image's sound 'muffled.' I don't know how this could be as the images are supposed to be a step up from the alpha's. I do notice however that that the images sound 'more real', almost like you are in the concert.

As a newbie to the audio game, could it be that the sound of the images is in fact much better but my ear has been trained to precieve exagerated EQ to sound better??? i.e. the sound is more authentic with the Images which is somthing I'm not used to as a listener

The images are only 5 years old and look well taken care of, so could this be due to age??? Or is somthing else happening here?

Any advice is much appreciated....

RT

 

[kmad61]

Iam also looking at the Psb's and just got outbid on the bay for a set of image b15.

 

[rethomps]

They are indeed a nice speaker. Dollar for dollar I don't know if anything beats them.

Iam also looking at the Psb's and just got outbid on the bay for a set of image b15.

 

[jostenmeat]

I recently purchased a new pair of PSB Alhpa B1's to serve as my fronts for my Yamaha RXV 1500. I love the sound of the B1's and am very happy with them. More recently, I purchased a pair of second hand PSB Image 2b's with the plan of using them for my fronts and moving the Alpha's to my rear. The image 2B's sound good with a much fuller sound, but they seem to lack pronounceation compared to the Alpha's. I especiallly notice this in my Yamaha's Pure Direct mode (bypass circutry to provide cleaner sound); the alpha's sound amazing in pure direct where as the Image's sound 'muffled.' I don't know how this could be as the images are supposed to be a step up from the alpha's. I do notice however that that the images sound 'more real', almost like you are in the concert.

As a newbie to the audio game, could it be that the sound of the images is in fact much better but my ear has been trained to precieve exagerated EQ to sound better??? i.e. the sound is more authentic with the Images which is somthing I'm not used to as a listener

The images are only 5 years old and look well taken care of, so could this be due to age??? Or is somthing else happening here?

Any advice is much appreciated....

RT

Hm. Are the tweeters working? Well, I've never heard the B2, but I know that those are at least three generations old now.

I have auditioned B15 B25 and B1 Alphas side by side by side, and there is absolutely no contest IMO, the Images kill the Alphas. I used 100% classical music AFAIK, including choral, orchestral at the very least.

However, even the B15/B25 are now superceded.

They are indeed a nice speaker. Dollar for dollar I don't know if anything beats them.

I thought something similar when I first got some Images. "Wow, that is so great you can this quality for something so affordable!". Since that time, I've learned more, and heard more, and I prefer Ascend 170SE to the PSB B15 for pure music listening. This is not to say that the PSB are not a great value, but there are a lot of great values out there I think. A bit more clear, and seemingly a lot better with off axis response. Never owned them, but I've heard them on a number of occasions (my friend, cellist in my string quartet, bought them on my rec, and he usually hosts the great majority of our rehearsals).

 

[anamorphic96]

Which speaker are you referring to. The CBM 170 or the B15.

 

[jostenmeat]

Which speaker are you referring to. The CBM 170 or the B15.

Sorry, I thought I was clear enough. Ascend 170SE being compared to the Image bookshelves. Never heard them side by side though.

 

[rethomps]

Yeah the tweets are working. Although I do notice that one speaker has slightly higher treble than the other one. Like I said, they do sound fuller than the alpha's, as they should with a larger speaker, but still seem muffled some how. Is it possible that the guy that had them before me was hard on them and that's what's causing this?

 

[jostenmeat]

Yeah the tweets are working. Although I do notice that one speaker has slightly higher treble than the other one.

I must defer to those who actually know what they're talking about. I'm afraid I can't really help you.

The one thing I'll offer for now: Does the same speaker sound brighter, or with higher treble as you say, when you swap the speaker positions? (Room acoustics are a crazy thing).

 

[rethomps]

Yeah its definetly the tweeter itself. I found the speaks out of town on Kijiji for a good deal. Usually I like to inspect any equipment I buy but in this case I had my brother in law pick them up so could not see them. Once I got them, upon closer examination I noticed that one if the tweets had some very small pertrusions in them the size of a pin head or smaller (not sure what would cuase this). The sound difference between the two is acute though, nothing you would notice unless you were listening for it. I only paid 125 for them so I guess not a total loss as they are still nice speaks for that price. What else would your recomend in the >$500 second hand price range??

 

[anamorphic96]

Yeah its definetly the tweeter itself. I found the speaks out of town on Kijiji for a good deal. Usually I like to inspect any equipment I buy but in this case I had my brother in law pick them up so could not see them. Once I got them, upon closer examination I noticed that one if the tweets had some very small pertrusions in them the size of a pin head or smaller (not sure what would cuase this). The sound difference between the two is acute though, nothing you would notice unless you were listening for it. I only paid 125 for them so I guess not a total loss as they are still nice speaks for that price. What else would your recomend in the >$500 second hand price range??

Try contacting PSB and see if they have replacement tweeters for sale. Some of these companies have spare part inventory for older models.

Paradigm has surprised me. Especially when I refurbished my Monitors that I picked up at a garage sale.

Also try e-bay for replacement parts.

 

[Rick T]

Try contacting PSB and see if they have replacement tweeters for sale. Some of these companies have spare part inventory for older models.

Paradigm has surprised me. Especially when I refurbished my Monitors that I picked up at a garage sale.

Also try e-bay for replacement parts.

Do contact PSB... their support and willingness to help is outstanding. Lenbrook Industries covers PSB, NAD, Energy speakers and a few others, and also happens to be @ 2 blocks away from my home near Toronto.
My sons now 8 year old NAD 760 went on the blink repeatedly.. kept toasting resistors and such. Franchised authorized repair center had it more than my son for > 1 year and seemingly couldn't get it right. Eventually he went directly to Lenbrook and they told him to bring it over for them to have a look. 1 full day later it was fixed 100%, completely tested all performance and components and no charge of course, but more surprising that the Service Mgr and tech took the time personally to explain exactly what the issue was and what they did. Now that's service.
If I had more nerve, I should have asked for a tour of their sound testing facilities... LOL.

 

[rethomps]

Try contacting PSB and see if they have replacement tweeters for sale. Some of these companies have spare part inventory for older models.

Paradigm has surprised me. Especially when I refurbished my Monitors that I picked up at a garage sale.

Also try e-bay for replacement parts.

Cool, I'll give PSB a call on Monday. They make them an hour or so from where I live so hopfully I can get a decent price, lol.

 

[anamorphic96]

Do contact PSB... their support and willingness to help is outstanding. Lenbrook Industries covers PSB, NAD, Energy speakers and a few others, and also happens to be @ 2 blocks away from my home near Toronto.
My sons now 8 year old NAD 760 went on the blink repeatedly.. kept toasting resistors and such. Franchised authorized repair center had it more than my son for > 1 year and seemingly couldn't get it right. Eventually he went directly to Lenbrook and they told him to bring it over for them to have a look. 1 full day later it was fixed 100%, completely tested all performance and components and no charge of course, but more surprising that the Service Mgr and tech took the time personally to explain exactly what the issue was and what they did. Now that's service.
If I had more nerve, I should have asked for a tour of their sound testing facilities... LOL.

Actually Energy is owned by Klipsch.

 

[Rick T]

Actually Energy is owned by Klipsch.

Lenbrook Group is actually a Distribution Channel Manager and Brand Developer with a variety of customers that includes PSB, NAD, Audio Quest cables, Panamax line conditioners and a bunch of other companies in related fields, rather than necessarily the owner of any of the companies.
IIRC at one time Energy was one of the brands, and I think perhaps Marantz too, but they aren't shown as current clients.
Never-the-less, they fixed our very frustrating year-long problem instantly, and on a product that was long out of warranty.

 

[Boerd]

Yeah the tweets are working. Although I do notice that one speaker has slightly higher treble than the other one. Like I said, they do sound fuller than the alpha's, as they should with a larger speaker, but still seem muffled some how. Is it possible that the guy that had them before me was hard on them and that's what's causing this?

Switch the speakers Left with Right. If the same speaker has higher trebles then one of the speakers has a problem in the tweeter.
If after the switch the same side has higher trebles then it is the room.
Now speaking about the "fuller" sound - this just may be the xover - the new speakers have a better xover and that means a lot (my 2c).
I don't know what tweeters they use but any ferro-fluid tweeters suffer damage when they are abused - the cooling liquid evaporates when you drive them too hard for long periods
One last thing - I did have a chance to audition the B1 - they are hard to beat in that price range.

 

[anamorphic96]

Lenbrook Group is actually a Distribution Channel Manager and Brand Developer with a variety of customers that includes PSB, NAD, Audio Quest cables, Panamax line conditioners and a bunch of other companies in related fields, rather than necessarily the owner of any of the companies.
IIRC at one time Energy was one of the brands, and I think perhaps Marantz too, but they aren't shown as current clients.
Never-the-less, they fixed our very frustrating year-long problem instantly, and on a product that was long out of warranty.

From my understanding and reading Energy was part of Audio Products International who acquired Energy in the early 80's and also owns Mirage and Athena loudspeakers as well as
the Energy Pro Division. In 2006 API was acquired Klipsch.