preamps and sound quality

[PENG]

Sorry what's a 867 lol? Sounds like a police code!

Sorry, I meant SC 27.

 

[PENG]

Yamaha RX-V867 receiver. Some one is thinking this is the receiver you ncurrently have (?).

But you mentioned Yamaha right? Still, definitely my mistake.

 

[PENG]

are these the cds you are talking about? Amazon.com: Copland: Rodeo: Corral Nocturne: Louis Lane & Atlanta Symphony Orchestra: MP3 Downloads

and

Classical Music Orchestras Recorded by Reference Recordings

the one titled VARUJAN KOJIAN and the UTAH SYMPHONY ORCHESTRA and it has a red cover?

Yes, it is sort of red.

 

[moves]

Yamaha RX-V867 receiver. Some one is thinking this is the receiver you currently have (?).

nope i got a Pioneer SC 27

 

[moves]

But you mentioned Yamaha right? Still, definitely my mistake.

no no I used to have one.

 

[PENG]

I really hope you will acquire a few discs of good transfer quality and really sit back and enjoy your speakers. It may be true that they could not take a ton of power due to their size but they do sound great in the right acoustic environment. On SQ alone I would rank them same as the top of the line Paradigm Signature series speakers and the PSB syhronies. They are not cheap either. The SC27 should be good enough for them for two channel listening.

 

[moves]

I really hope you will acquire a few discs of good transfer quality and really sit back and enjoy your speakers. It may be true that they could not take a ton of power due to their size but they do sound great in the right acoustic environment. On SQ alone I would rank them same as the top of the line Paradigm Signature series speakers and the PSB syhronies. They are not cheap either. The SC27 should be good enough for them for two channel listening.

yea that sc 27 is no cheap amp... 2500 or so. It works well. I was just wondering if there was something better out there that would work for me with regards to amps. I will look at that site that I linked you and grab some of those CDs.... The SQ is amazing and they go loud enough. No, they are not meant to fill a 40 by 20 space but that is not what I am looking for. It is even great to use as mains for a room the size of 15 by 20. I was watching The Pacific on blue ray last night and it sounds amazing...

Again... I like nice things and I was just wondering if there were different components out there that I could use that could increase my Totem listening experience. According to these posts, the answer is no.

 

[markw]

Again... I like nice things and I was just wondering if there were different components out there that I could use that could increase my Totem listening experience. According to these posts, the answer is no.

Again, unless you can be more specific about what that "increase" entails, you're right. The answer is no.

 

[moves]

All amps are not the same.

If a person has 84db / 4 ohm 3-way speakers.with dual 10" long throw aluminum woofers, it'll quickly drive most receivers to their limits as ot probably has impedance dips below 2.5 ohm. Combined with the low sensitivity and high power handling, an ordinary amp will clip and warp the sound easily. A tube amp will clip even quicker but warp the sound more gracefully. An OTL or SET amp will warp the sound before it's even clipping. A high powered well designed amp will on the other hand sound reasonably effortless with strong dynamics. The audiophile reviewer will pick the most warped sound as his reference for sonic purity.

Beyond that, there are subtle distortions that can be heard at low listening levels in some lesser class ab amps. In the rest of the amps in the world they are just so insignificant that they can't be identified reliably under controlled conditions - time and time again.

the biggest difference I heard going from a receiver to an outbound 500wpc @ 4ohm amp was a bit more relaxation at high levels, but my speakers benefit from it because they have plenty of radiating surface area. Even then, my speakers and room far and away remain the source of 95%+ of the distortion in the system no matter what amp. Once I make the switch to a 15" acoustic elegance woofer, my systems' ability to handle power will skyrocket, but the need for power will drop exponentially as those things'll hit reference level peaks at my seat with 80 watts. without even getting started.

And some...most reviews.. are just full of B.S. from people with imagination. Maybe they heard a new detail. is that because of the amp or just the different listening session?

To be honest, some of this is hard for me to understand. I totally understand that room conditioning has a lot to do with sound... I get that part.

Your 15" woofer will be able to handle more power - I get that part but why would the need for power drop and why will it hit reference at 80 watts? wouldn't you need more power to hit your reference? Just to double check: reference = ideal listening volume right?

what is a class AB amp? what class should a home user who would like the better end of performance buy?

 

[GranteedEV]

To be honest, some of this is hard for me to understand. I totally understand that room conditioning has a lot to do with sound... I get that part.

Well i don't know what room conditioning is, but i'd say superior speakers sound great in many rooms and usually woth any amp.

Your 15" woofer will be able to handle more power - I get that part but why would the need for power drop and why will it hit reference at 80 watts? wouldn't you need more power to hit your reference? Just to double check: reference = ideal listening volume right?

It's a powerful 15" driver... but it isn't tuned for small boxes or deep bass. Thanks to that it's 97db/2.83v/m sensitive in its intended passband... well... closer to 93 in execution but you get my point. 93db sensitive speakers need way less power. but the driver can thermally and mechanically take a 500w beating.

what is a class AB amp? what class should a home user who would like the better end of performance buy?

99% of amps out there, home or professional, will be some variation of a class AB design. Class A is too inefficient to be useful, class B aren't really suitable for audio as-is. A poorly designed class AB can have a characteristic of class B that makes it also low fidelity, but a well designed class AB amp is 99% transparent to the source material so you have ZILCH to worry about.

Personally I am big on Class D (analog pulse wave modulation amps) but not all Class D amps are flawless. The ones that aren't have given them a bad rep. The good ones are really worth checking out though. If for no other reason, than the fact that they'll have around 85% efficiency (less energy converted to heat) where class AB has around 55-60% (and you don't even wanna know about class A)

 

[jinjuku]

yea that sc 27 is no cheap amp... 2500 or so. It works well. I was just wondering if there was something better out there that would work for me with regards to amps. I will look at that site that I linked you and grab some of those CDs.... The SQ is amazing and they go loud enough. No, they are not meant to fill a 40 by 20 space but that is not what I am looking for. It is even great to use as mains for a room the size of 15 by 20. I was watching The Pacific on blue ray last night and it sounds amazing...

Again... I like nice things and I was just wondering if there were different components out there that I could use that could increase my Totem listening experience. According to these posts, the answer is no.

Why don't you try my suggestion: Go to guitar center, pick up a Crown XLS Drive Core 1000 and give it a shot.

You HAVE, HAVE, HAVE to be willing to go through SOME sort of effort to expand your experience base. When I ask questions on boards like this I have already made my mind up to go some way, it is just getting information on if I am going left or right.

Again, do yourself a favor. Pick up the amp I listed and give it a whirl.

 

[GranteedEV]

Just to double check: reference = ideal listening volume right?

Reference refers to THX reference levels, which state maximum peak SPLs of 105db, even if the average level is closer to 75-80db. I generally use it to refer to how much dynamic range i'd want in a system. IMO even reference is overkill in real life reverberant rooms.

For example, if you took your 87db totems, sat 8 feet away, you'd need about 400w to drive them to that max SPL. Sit 10 feet away and it's 600w needed And given that it's got a single 6.5" driver, it'll overheat, and distort heavily long before that, probably closer to 50w of input, while moving wayyyy too much in the midbass.

In comparision, a 93db sensitive speaker with a 15" woofer will need about 100w to hit 105db at 8 feet, (150 at 10 feet) and it's got way more heat sinking, and needs to move in and out wayyyy less in the mid bass.

IMO if a speaker is designed to dig deep, chances are there were probably some big tradeoffs in overall efficiency. I prefer multiple subs to deal with bass.

 

[brownp23]

pre-amps

Do you know much about the Emotiva brand?