Phase problem with new Yamaha RX-V1500

[vividere]

Just a few days ago I received the 1500 and replaced the 657 I had bought in the interim. I set it up with the speaker arrangement I had been using and it passed the wiring and phase test just fine.

I moved the center lower and changed how the surrounds faced so I ran YPAO again. For some strange reason it now says the R/L front speakers are out of phase. When the speakers are out of phase it won't equalize them. I actually had to reverse the wiring on the front speakers to get YPAO to function properly and not complain about phase. Unless I am hallucinating, the front speakers are now wired out of phase... I have used the same setup with a not of receivers this year as my receiver was in the shop more than at home. Another receiver I had with it's own mic was the Denon 3805. It was also fine with my wiring as was the 1500 until I moved some speakers.

Has anyone heard of this? The other three speakers (center and surrounds) are wired as they were (correctly).

Help!!

 

[bcycle]

Your out of phase fronts

Is it possible that a driver (like a woofer) is out of phase? Have you replaced a driver recently? That might confuse things. I'm sure you've double/triple checked the wire yes? (red to red, black to black, ridge to red, copper to red, blah, blah, blah.)

Greg

 

[vividere]

Thanks for the suggestion but the point is the speakers passed the test, I changed the direction two surrounds pointed, and then the test showed the front L/R as being out of phase with no wiring work done or anything else, no change but turning two speakers 90 degrees.

I am not running the sytem with those two out of phase so it would equalize them. Don't know what is worse, out of phase or not EQ'd?

 

[gene]

I am not running the sytem with those two out of phase so it would equalize them. Don't know what is worse, out of phase or not EQ'd?

Don't trust the YPAO results. Trust your ears instead. I recommend using YPAO only to set speaker distances (not the sub) and levels. Do the rest manually and don't use the EQ unless it is extremely necessary. Check out our reviews of the Z9, 2400, 2500, and 4600 for further elaborations.

 

[bcycle]

Ypao

I let YPAO equalize my various brands of surround speakers but since my front speakers were recognized as "large", YPAO does not equalize the fronts, just the surrounds. I found that the equalization settings for the surrounds sounded good but had to manually adjust levels overall.

Don't trust the YPAO results. Trust your ears instead. I recommend using YPAO only to set speaker distances (not the sub) and levels. Do the rest manually and don't use the EQ unless it is extremely necessary. Check out our reviews of the Z9, 2400, 2500, and 4600 for further elaborations.

 

[vividere]

Yesterday I got a PB-10 subwoofer so I ran the YPAO test again. This time it said one of my front speakers was out of phase...so now one of them is changed back...

Frankly, I can't hear the difference...my ears aren't "tuned" well enough to know a reversed polarity speaker or not.

Wish there was someone local to me that had a better ear. Perhaps I am just better off wiring them "right" and not worrying about what YPAO says..

Thanks!

Lew

 

[vividere]

BTW, my Yamaha equalizes the main speakers even though identified as large.. at least I think it did.

 

[bcycle]

Curious on what other RX-V owners have to say on this... I just checked my setup and verified that the front speakers after YPAO show flat EQ and they do. You can verify that by going manual setup/sound/Parametric EQ/and choosing the speaker you want to adjust for. You will see the EQ settings there. Make sure when setting up YPAO that you check front for EQ settings. On your phasing issue, there's an excellent Audioholics review where the reviewer is states that his setup showed a phasing error due to the fact that his woofers on his speakers (RBH I think?) are wired out of phase by design. I doubt that your changing the direction of your surrounds created the problem. I'm pretty sure that YPAO checks for phasing electronically rather then through the mic. (Can anyone verify this?)

When you are out of phase, 2 things happen. The bass drops noticeably and the imaging (sound stage) goes out of wack. One test would be to listen some full sounding music with some good steady bass to in Pure Direct mode (which will play through the front speakers only), then try reverse the polarity on one speaker and listen to see if there's a noticeable drop in the bottom end. Good Luck!

Greg

Yesterday I got a PB-10 subwoofer so I ran the YPAO test again. This time it said one of my front speakers was out of phase...so now one of them is changed back...

Frankly, I can't hear the difference...my ears aren't "tuned" well enough to know a reversed polarity speaker or not.

Wish there was someone local to me that had a better ear. Perhaps I am just better off wiring them "right" and not worrying about what YPAO says..

Thanks!

Lew

 

[vividere]

It was suggested I view the professional reviews done on here of the various Yamaha receivers. Almost all of the reviews indicated a false phase problem. I guess it is best to set the phase properly and don't let the test check. It was suggest to just skip the wiring test.

Thanks,

LEw

 

[bcycle]

Can't find how YPAO measures phasing...

I dunno.The critical issue is how YPAO checks for phasing. I can say with certainty that if YPAO checks electronically and you are running speakers where the drivers are intentionally wired out of phase (read dipole), that will throw YPAO off. If YPAO measuring through the mike, I can't say. Are you running any dipole speakers or other interesting driver configurations? Below is the Audioholics review of the 1400 which says some interesting things. Ah well, sorry if this doesn't help, I've tried my best.... Good Luck!

Greg

Wiring Check

I was a bit concerned that right off the bat that the first auto test checking for wiring of my system

incorrectly identified my front main channels being wired out of phase. I double checked the wiring of my

speakers and audibly verified my front speakers were in deed in phase and that the RX-V2400 was in

error. Interestingly enough when I moved the RX-V2400 into my bedroom system, it correctly identified

the proper phase of all of my speakers. I could only speculate that somehow the more lively nature of my

living room, or perhaps the more complex crossover/driver arrangement of my main reference speakers,

was tricking the receivers phase test. As a side note, I checked with a colleague who recently purchased

an RXV-1400 with Boston Acoustics speaker package, and he too had problems with the internal phase

tester correctly identifying his systems phase. Yamaha also states in their user manual that the wiring

identification check may identify some speaker systems or configurations incorrectly. I recommend

interpreting the results of this test with a grain of salt. If it should report any of your speakers are out of

phase, first check the wiring and then use the Avia or equivalent home theater set-up disc, to audibly

confirm the proper phase of each channel. This is a good measure to practice on any home theater

install regardless if the device has the built in ability to check it for you or not.

It was suggested I view the professional reviews done on here of the various Yamaha receivers. Almost all of the reviews indicated a false phase problem. I guess it is best to set the phase properly and don't let the test check. It was suggest to just skip the wiring test.

Thanks,

LEw

 

[vividere]

hello,

My speakers are all "normal", no dipoles or other weird things...

Originally all the speakers where in phase, then it said a front speaker was out of phase, then the other front speaker, and now it thinks one of them is out of sync and one isn't...from test to test I get different results and in none of the tests have I touched the speakers it is complaining about. All of my speaker movements and additions have been the new surrounds and sub I bought. I have had three difference receivers in the same spot with the same front speakers and it wasn't until I got this 1500 did I get a complaint about the phase of the speakers. I have re-wired the main speakers to "correct" and told the test to ignore wiring.

Thanks,

Lew