Onkyo TX-SR608 Receiver First Look

[GlocksRock]

I just think that they should add them, especially at that price point. The Yamaha RX-V663 retailed for $500 and it has preouts. It doesn't cost much to add them, and there is plenty of room on that receiver to add them, same with 7.1 analog inputs. With all it has to offer they ought to add at least preamp outputs, since if you spend a lot more on a receiver, like $1000+ those receivers have much better amps, but maybe you want to spend $500 on receiver, so you can afford to get whatever external amp suits your needs best, you can't do it with this receiver... that was basically my point. I know Denon only adds preamp outs on their higher end units as well, and that's one of the main reasons I don't use Denon receivers in my nice systems.

 

[gliz]

You're taking offense for no reason. I was responding to those complaining that the 608 does not have pre-outs. The average receiver shopper has no interest in pre-outs. If you don't like my choice of the word "enthusiast" for the 1% that care about pre-outs then feel free to substitute whatever word you like. The fact is that if you search my posts you'll find that I often recommend Onkyo's 60X line to those on a tight budget and if you read my signature you'll see I have a 606 in my bedroom. These are great little bang for the buck receivers.

that clears it up, thanks! guess I need more sleep. Thanks for the reply. I am sorry if I offended you.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Wow...how time flies...I had a TX-SR600 when it debuted, now I have the 605 and NOW they're on the 608...

I am a tried-and-true Onkyo afficionado, and I think they do the best receivers especially given the price point. There were some interesting points made in this thread, so let me just throw my two cents in, for what it's worth...

It's true when it's said that 99.9-percent of "600" series owners are not really interested in adding an external amp to the receiver, hence the justification for a lack of preamp outputs. However, it really doesn't make it any less of an "enthusiast"'s selection; I consider myself an avid home theater enthusiast (not QUITE audiophile in many senses of the term) and I simply could not afford anything more expensive that decoded TrueHD and Master Audio at the time than the Onkyo 605. I know this has been cleared up in previous posts between certain members, but I also wanted to add that I don't think these receivers are that "little" or "good enough just for pretty much a bedroom setup" (these weren't exact quotes, but I noticed one member's reference to "nice little bang for the buck receivers")...I am running a 605, with "only" a "mere" "rated" 90 watts per channel, in a decently sized, medium-ish type room and the power seems more than enough, never getting to maximum drive whatsoever. My parents' system is still being driven by an 80 watt per channel 600 in a very large room with 9 foot cathedral ceilings and that surround system SCREAMS. My point is, I don't think all the "criticisms" the 600 series Onkyos get is really warranted; they're not that underpowered for most applications and I really do believe they can power more than just a bedroom system.

That said, let's go back to the preamp debate on this series. It's true that the majority of 600-series owners don't need an external amp, but on the other side of the coin, there's an argument to be made that it's THESE kinds of on-the-lower-side-of-power receivers that could USE or NEED the extra boost from an external amp, so why aren't they equipped with preouts? I understand both sides, but there's probably a **** load of price point politics that Onkyo (and others) consider in these models.

My fantasy would be to use the 605 as a preamp and add a power amp at some point (even though I said the receiver has enough muscle for my current needs, you never know when you would need an amp) through the use of line-level converters or something along those lines, so I can continue using the 605 as a preamp and processor, but I have been told this process is ridiculously "ghetto" in approach, and I should just start over with a new receiver that has preouts. In any case, this information about the new 608 was interesting. I think, though, that the model could benefit from preamp outs, as folks buying 90 watt per channel or so receivers would maybe want more power down the line ("above-average consumers" such as me).

 

[krzywica]

Wow...how time flies...I had a TX-SR600 when it debuted, now I have the 605 and NOW they're on the 608...

I am a tried-and-true Onkyo afficionado, and I think they do the best receivers especially given the price point. There were some interesting points made in this thread, so let me just throw my two cents in, for what it's worth...

It's true when it's said that 99.9-percent of "600" series owners are not really interested in adding an external amp to the receiver, hence the justification for a lack of preamp outputs. However, it really doesn't make it any less of an "enthusiast"'s selection; I consider myself an avid home theater enthusiast (not QUITE audiophile in many senses of the term) and I simply could not afford anything more expensive that decoded TrueHD and Master Audio at the time than the Onkyo 605. I know this has been cleared up in previous posts between certain members, but I also wanted to add that I don't think these receivers are that "little" or "good enough just for pretty much a bedroom setup" (these weren't exact quotes, but I noticed one member's reference to "nice little bang for the buck receivers")...I am running a 605, with "only" a "mere" "rated" 90 watts per channel, in a decently sized, medium-ish type room and the power seems more than enough, never getting to maximum drive whatsoever. My parents' system is still being driven by an 80 watt per channel 600 in a very large room with 9 foot cathedral ceilings and that surround system SCREAMS. My point is, I don't think all the "criticisms" the 600 series Onkyos get is really warranted; they're not that underpowered for most applications and I really do believe they can power more than just a bedroom system.

That said, let's go back to the preamp debate on this series. It's true that the majority of 600-series owners don't need an external amp, but on the other side of the coin, there's an argument to be made that it's THESE kinds of on-the-lower-side-of-power receivers that could USE or NEED the extra boost from an external amp, so why aren't they equipped with preouts? I understand both sides, but there's probably a **** load of price point politics that Onkyo (and others) consider in these models.

My fantasy would be to use the 605 as a preamp and add a power amp at some point (even though I said the receiver has enough muscle for my current needs, you never know when you would need an amp) through the use of line-level converters or something along those lines, so I can continue using the 605 as a preamp and processor, but I have been told this process is ridiculously "ghetto" in approach, and I should just start over with a new receiver that has preouts. In any case, this information about the new 608 was interesting. I think, though, that the model could benefit from preamp outs, as folks buying 90 watt per channel or so receivers would maybe want more power down the line ("above-average consumers" such as me).

90WPC simply isn't going to cut the mustard playing back at reference levels with all but the most efficient speakers. And thats IF you are getting a true 90WPC which you most likely are not due to the testing methods used. My 663 is spec'd to 95WPC and its simply not enough to drive most full range towers at reference levels. But I guess I'm also one of the few people on here that playback my media at reference levels on a regular basis....well me and Patrick.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

90WPC simply isn't going to cut the mustard playing back at reference levels with all but the most efficient speakers. And thats IF you are getting a true 90WPC which you most likely are not due to the testing methods used. My 663 is spec'd to 95WPC and its simply not enough to drive most full range towers at reference levels. But I guess I'm also one of the few people on here that playback my media at reference levels on a regular basis....well me and Patrick.

That may very well be, but in terms of "real world power" and simply sitting in your HT and experiencing the audio, the so-called "90 watts" per channel this model is said to put out fills my rather medium-ish/bordering-on-semi-large room with enough power and seemingly copious amounts of reserve, as I never get it anywhere near the max output. And that's WITH running two Polk RTi12 monsters as the main fronts (crossed over inside the AVR, of course).

My point was merely that it's MY personal belief and sentiment that the "600" line of Onkyo AVRs aren't merely ONLY for using in a bedroom-style setup; they're quite capable of a good deal more.

 

[anamorphic96]

That may very well be, but in terms of "real world power" and simply sitting in your HT and experiencing the audio, the so-called "90 watts" per channel this model is said to put out fills my rather medium-ish/bordering-on-semi-large room with enough power and seemingly copious amounts of reserve, as I never get it anywhere near the max output. And that's WITH running two Polk RTi12 monsters as the main fronts (crossed over inside the AVR, of course).

My point was merely that it's MY personal belief and sentiment that the "600" line of Onkyo AVRs aren't merely ONLY for using in a bedroom-style setup; they're quite capable of a good deal more.

You make some good points.

I would also like to add that most people do not listen at reference level.

Also when you cross a receiver over at 60 to 80hz one is able to turn things up more as the amp is not producing any deep bass. Which is where most power gets used. Granted there are some speakers with tricky impedance curves above 80hz but most well designed receivers can deal with this.

My Onkyo TX-SR506 crossed over at 80hz drives my Paradigms with no sense of distress or problems. Even at near reference levels.

With all this being said about the 608. It will be more than enough to drive just about all reasonably efficient speakers with ease. Especially since it now has the amp section from the 707.

 

[krzywica]

That may very well be, but in terms of "real world power" and simply sitting in your HT and experiencing the audio, the so-called "90 watts" per channel this model is said to put out fills my rather medium-ish/bordering-on-semi-large room with enough power and seemingly copious amounts of reserve, as I never get it anywhere near the max output. And that's WITH running two Polk RTi12 monsters as the main fronts (crossed over inside the AVR, of course).

My point was merely that it's MY personal belief and sentiment that the "600" line of Onkyo AVRs aren't merely ONLY for using in a bedroom-style setup; they're quite capable of a good deal more.

I've heard the RTi's are very power hungry. Keep in mind lack of power doesn't always manifest itself as distortion. In my situation I when I added an external power amp I noticed added detail at low listening levels as well as an incredible increase in dynamics when listening at high levels. You say your perfectly happy but have you tried a power amp in your setup yet? I'm not trying to pick a fight or be argumentative but until you add a decent amp and do an A/B comparison you can't really say that an amp is not needed. Just because it gets as loud as you can stand doesn't mean the speakers are getting enough power.

 

[sholling]

It's true when it's said that 99.9-percent of "600" series owners are not really interested in adding an external amp to the receiver, hence the justification for a lack of preamp outputs. However, it really doesn't make it any less of an "enthusiast"'s selection; I consider myself an avid home theater enthusiast (not QUITE audiophile in many senses of the term) and I simply could not afford anything more expensive that decoded TrueHD and Master Audio at the time than the Onkyo 605. I know this has been cleared up in previous posts between certain members, but I also wanted to add that I don't think these receivers are that "little" or "good enough just for pretty much a bedroom setup" (these weren't exact quotes, but I noticed one member's reference to "nice little bang for the buck receivers")...

I think people are over reacting. I have a 606 is my bedroom but nowhere did I say it was only fit for a bedroom system. I did say that it's a nice little bang for the buck system and I stand by that. It's smaller than the 707 and half the weight of my 906 and above thus the term "little' and it's at a price point where compromises are made thus "bang for the buck". Its 90wpc is plenty for most people with reasonably easy to drive speakers. I wouldn't want to drive it hard with 4ohm speakers or super power hungry speakers but let's come back down to earth. Onkyo makes models for harder to drive speakers. The X08 line is a darn good reasonably full featured receiver but it's not a TX-NR5007 killer. It's the entry point to the HTMI repeater/video processing part of the market. Love it for what it is and don't waste words trying to defend it for what it was never intended to be.

 

[BWG707]

I own a Onkyo 606 and just out of curiosity I was wondering how warm the 608 runs? Is it any cooler than the previous models?

 

[PearlcorderS701]

You make some good points.

I would also like to add that most people do not listen at reference level.

Agreed, Anamorphic.

Also when you cross a receiver over at 60 to 80hz one is able to turn things up more as the amp is not producing any deep bass. Which is where most power gets used. Granted there are some speakers with tricky impedance curves above 80hz but most well designed receivers can deal with this.

Right -- hence why it's always recommended, even if you have big floor standing speakers, to cross over at 80 (or so)...there is less strain on the receiver. Of course, if you have NO sub at all, that's another story...

My Onkyo TX-SR506 crossed over at 80hz drives my Paradigms with no sense of distress or problems. Even at near reference levels.

Indeed...

With all this being said about the 608. It will be more than enough to drive just about all reasonably efficient speakers with ease. Especially since it now has the amp section from the 707.

Does it? That's a nice step in the right direction right there...

 

[PearlcorderS701]

I've heard the RTi's are very power hungry. Keep in mind lack of power doesn't always manifest itself as distortion. In my situation I when I added an external power amp I noticed added detail at low listening levels as well as an incredible increase in dynamics when listening at high levels. You say your perfectly happy but have you tried a power amp in your setup yet? I'm not trying to pick a fight or be argumentative but until you add a decent amp and do an A/B comparison you can't really say that an amp is not needed. Just because it gets as loud as you can stand doesn't mean the speakers are getting enough power.

'Wica,

Please don't think that I was attempting to say that your tone was attempting to "pick a fight" or "start trouble" or anything like that -- I was merely expressing my personal feelings about the 600-series line of AVRs from this company. No problem to keep discussing our opinions and feelings! No harm done.

I TOTALLY understand the whole thing behind a good power amp adding even intense dynamics to lower volume listening situations and such, and how good, clean power can be effective across the entire volume spectrum. Also, I understand that my RTi12's are power hungry, but I discussed this at VERY LONG lengths with Polk Audio's support staff, and when I told them, repeatedly, that I was worried about my Onkyo 605 driving these speakers, they assured me that the RTi12's would be absolutely fine being driven by the 605, as they're 8 ohm models and can take anywhere from 50 to 500 watts with no problems. I am also crossing them over inside the receiver, so the 605 doesn't have to work as hard to drive them.

Now, THAT DOES NOT MEAN that these giant speakers could absolutely benefit from a good, strong, powerful multichannel amp -- they sure could to really get them to sing. But I was just stating that RIGHT NOW, the audio I am experiencing from my setup seems more than adequate for our needs and ears (that is, the so-called "90 watts per channel" feeding the RTi12's and other speakers).

So, let me clear that up a bit...I'm not saying my system is completely and utterly fine the way it is, as a power amp wouldn't do any benefit to it and wouldn't make it sound any better than it does now...no...that's not what I'm saying. I am absolutely sure a good amp would bring these speakers and the soundstage to life -- but right now, I am satisfied, personally, with the punch and dynamics of the system. I'd love to upgrade to a beefier receiver with preamp outs and perhaps the three channel Emotiva amp, but our room really ROCKS the way it is, right now.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

I think people are over reacting. I have a 606 is my bedroom but nowhere did I say it was only fit for a bedroom system. I did say that it's a nice little bang for the buck system and I stand by that. It's smaller than the 707 and half the weight of my 906 and above thus the term "little' and it's at a price point where compromises are made thus "bang for the buck". Its 90wpc is plenty for most people with reasonably easy to drive speakers. I wouldn't want to drive it hard with 4ohm speakers or super power hungry speakers but let's come back down to earth. Onkyo makes models for harder to drive speakers. The X08 line is a darn good reasonably full featured receiver but it's not a TX-NR5007 killer. It's the entry point to the HTMI repeater/video processing part of the market. Love it for what it is and don't waste words trying to defend it for what it was never intended to be.

Sholling,

That's why I specifically mentioned in one of my last posts that my quote regarding your thoughts was NOT A DIRECT QUOTE of any kind; you are right -- you never stated that it's only good for a bedroom system...I was just using that as a jumping off point for my arguments. That was NOT a direct quote of yours.

What I merely meant was that I am one of those 605/606/607 owners that feel that these AVRs are capable of more than most enthusiasts give them credit for -- I PERSONALLY wouldn't think that one of these models should be regulated to an extremely small setup situation such as a bedroom system, as this is my second AVR from Onkyo's "600" lineup and both filled main theater rooms just fine -- not bedrooms. But this is my personal opinion, and it's not that I am "wasting time trying to defend something it wasn't meant to be," but rather expressing that I feel these models should get more credit than just being slapped with the usual comments of "this is a flimsy, ultra-entry-level POS" or "in this day and age, who would put 90 watts of power into a receiver?" or a plethora of others...I believe these models are much better than that. I do not, to this day, feel these 600 series of models are TRUE "entry level" products, as Onkyo sells cheaper and less intuitive models from the 500's down. I have always considered the 600's "lower-middle of the road."

As for the weight and size issues, the 606 may indeed be lighter and physically smaller than your other Onkyos, but my 605 has a nice heft and size to it for its price class, in my opinion. Of course, these models can't physically compete with flagship brutes from the likes of Onkyo's own line, or Denon, Marantz, Rotel, etc. but my 605 does look pretty beefy sitting in my entertainment center/wall unit's glass-doored cabinet.

 

[Knucklehead90]

Anyone know if Onkyo will have an RC version of the 608? I see the 308 and 508 have been added to their website but don't see any new RC models.

 

[sholling]

What I merely meant was that I am one of those 605/606/607 owners that feel that these AVRs are capable of more than most enthusiasts give them credit for -- I PERSONALLY wouldn't think that one of these models should be regulated to an extremely small setup situation such as a bedroom system, as this is my second AVR from Onkyo's "600" lineup and both filled main theater rooms just fine -- not bedrooms.

I think that we for the most part agree. In my case the bedroom system that I'm entrusting to a 606 isn't what I would call meager. It's a full 5.1 system with a 42" TV and Blu-Ray player. In my opinion it's both what I consider the entry point for a quality AVR and all the AVR that most people need. That's pretty high praise.

 

[WmAx]

That may very well be, but in terms of "real world power" and simply sitting in your HT and experiencing the audio, the so-called "90 watts" per channel this model is said to put out fills my rather medium-ish/bordering-on-semi-large room with enough power and seemingly copious amounts of reserve, as I never get it anywhere near the max output. And that's WITH running two Polk RTi12 monsters as the main fronts (crossed over inside the AVR, of course).

That may be, but you also be experiencing sound quality reduction at higher SPL levels. Many people don't even realize that the are driving their amps into clipping range often at higher SPLs. The audible result is an added 'harshness', as the best I can describe it right before you hit 'hard clipping', which is just fuzz and can not be missed. But hard clipping is very rarely experienced at a rate that would be plainly audible. It comes down to the RMS average power of the music relative to the 0dBfS point. You are far less probably to experience distortion issues on moderan jazz/pop/country/rap music, as it is dynamically compressed to have no more than about 10dB of peak capacity, where as older stuff from the early/mid 90s had around 18dB of capacity, and stuff from the 80s, 20+ dBs. And realize that dBs are not linear. 6dB increase is 2x linear. 12db is 4x linear. And so on. It takes 4x amplifier power to achieve just a 6db increase in acoustic output. So, it is easy to see why modern music requires far less power than older music, on average.

Since I use a huge range of music and ages(one favorite CD of mine has nearly 30dB peaks), and do audio editing of uncompressed audio signals, I have 10x the power(1000+ RMS total per stereo channel on both my main systems) available as compared to average systems to ensure clipping is never an issue under any circumstances.

-Chris'

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Anyone know if Onkyo will have an RC version of the 608? I see the 308 and 508 have been added to their website but don't see any new RC models.

Aren't the "RC" receivers part of the HTiB systems, but also available separately?

 

[PearlcorderS701]

I think that we for the most part agree. In my case the bedroom system that I'm entrusting to a 606 isn't what I would call meager. It's a full 5.1 system with a 42" TV and Blu-Ray player. In my opinion it's both what I consider the entry point for a quality AVR and all the AVR that most people need. That's pretty high praise.

Gotcha, sir.

I've always run the 600-series AVRs in "main" HT rooms with no issues I could audibly discern -- something I'll get to Chris about next.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

That may be, but you also be experiencing sound quality reduction at higher SPL levels. Many people don't even realize that the are driving their amps into clipping range often at higher SPLs.

I have been exposed to, and have had experience with, clipping and distortion, and know the exact characteristics, aurally, they exhibit -- I'm not getting any ear fatigue, harshness, cymballic timbre edging or anything that would suggest to me the system is reaching a level it cannot operate at...

Now, as I have said before, this does NOT mean, at all, that these RTi12's I have being pushed by the 605 cannot or should not be powered by something 100 percent more powerful, or more. They SHOULD. But right now, I'm not sensing "anything wrong" with my 605.

 

[Knucklehead90]

Aren't the "RC" receivers part of the HTiB systems, but also available separately?

I'm not familiar with Onkyo's HTIB offerings - but I am with the RC160/SR607 and RC180/NR807. The RC160 and RC180 have been available separate from any HTIB. They are a bit different than the model they were spun off of - the RC160 has no front panel HDMI connection.



From A4L:

The HTRC160 is basically the Same as the TX-SR607 except:

*

80w x 7 vs. 90w x 7
*

No front hdmi port
*

Not Sirius ready
* No DTS Surround Sensation Speaker

For the price either are a good alternative to the 607 & 807 if the buyer is looking to save a few $s.

 

[BriPhil]

Anyone know if Onkyo will have an RC version of the 608? I see the 308 and 508 have been added to their website but don't see any new RC models.

the RC260 just showed up on Onkyo's web site a day or two ago. Spec's are EXACTLY the same as the SR608 except:

* $50 (US) cheaper
* no THX certification or processing mode
* no SIRIUS port
* no VGA input