Nova Scotia Forest Fires

Verdinut

Verdinut

Audioholic Spartan
We are at 164 at the moment, so back in the RED zone. We are not really in fire season yet. So I fear that the worst may be yet to come. Since this all started we have only had a few stretches of a few hours where the air quality has been rated as good. This is now the second week in a row we have gone into the red zone. Last week we got into the purple zone. I understand that in this area the smoke is mainly from Ontario fires at the moment, but also still western fires. Either way it looks and smells bad, and I'm sure is harmful to health.

For a couple due any day for a half day out with the undertaker, we can't be cavalier about this. I don't have to bee outdoors very long before the effects are adverse. I was two days ago for unavoidable reasons and paid a penalty. The winter was long and spring late. We have only had one day this year were we could sit out on a patio, either because of smoke or adverse weather.

However the medical costs of this and the heat dome, which is getting ever closer to us, is thought to have cost over 1 billion dollars in excess medical cost so far.

However, as a physician I fear that this will be dwarfed by the long term medical costs. These 2 and 2.5 micron particles, go straight from lungs to blood stream. These carbon particles are highly reactive and the whole cardiovascular system is exposed to them. So what I worry about is future excess costs mortality and morbidity to the young, including children. I fear we are stoking future troubles. I fear this may all dwarf the effects of Covid by many miles and leagues.

The problem is that solutions are all long term, requiring massive changes to the organization of society, and costly. No one has any idea how to pay for all this, and that includes remediation. The effects of failing to act and the time it takes to act are mounting fast. Obviously the question is, how do you fund all this without setting off ruinous inflation? I have no clue.

I do think though, that we can not rely on one energy source, namely electricity. If we do the world will be a bird's nest of wires and transformers.
So we do need diverse energy resources, including electricity, gas and liquid fuels. This was garner maximum benefit from existing infrastructure.
For a couple of months only, I have been using Levoit air purifiers in my apartment which do a good job of keeping my air cleaner. But their HEPA filters suddenly become inadequate to protect our health with the wildfire smoke. The situation is just the beginning of our wildfire smoke exposition which will obviously increase with the coming years.

I have been looking at electrostatic air purifiers. Some manufacturers of HEPA filtered purifiers advertise their product as able to filter particles smaller than 0.3 micron. If you verify on the web, you will easily see a lot of misrepresented publicity. Even Amazon lists most HEPA filtered machines as electrostatic, so the ones who are not aware of the differences between the two filtering systems may not be getting what they were looking for.

The situation is that those table top electrostatic purifiers are rather hard to find, but I only found one company which sells them. Its a product made in Korea that seems to be well designed:

I know you always look for the right product when you wish to get something. It's unfortunate that a big firm such as Honeywell doesn't manufacture any. Would you know any other reliable brand of table top electrostatic purifier?
 
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TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
For a couple of months only, I have been using Levoit air purifiers in my apartment which do a good job of keeping my air cleaner. But their HEPA filters suddenly become inadequate to protect our health with the wildfire smoke. The situation is just the beginning of our wildfire smoke exposition which will obviously increase with the coming years.

I have been looking at electrostatic air purifiers. Some manufacturers of HEPA filtered purifiers advertise their product as able to filter particles smaller than 0.3 micron. If you verify on the web, you will easily see a lot of misrepresented publicity. Even Amazon lists most HEPA filtered machines as electrostatic, so the ones who are not aware of the differences between the two filtering systems may not be getting what they were looking for.

The situation is that those table top electrostatic purifiers are rather hard to find, but I only found one company which sells them. Its a product made in Korea that seems to be well designed:

I know you always look for the right product when you wish to get something. It's unfortunate that a big firm such as Honeywell doesn't manufacture any. Would you know any other reliable brand of table top electrostatic purifier?
Honestly I don't. Filters and humidifiers etc. are best placed centrally. I know you are in an apartment so that is not possible. Its effectiveness is going to be highly dependent on air distribution in your apartment.
 
Verdinut

Verdinut

Audioholic Spartan
Honestly I don't. Filters and humidifiers etc. are best placed centrally. I know you are in an apartment so that is not possible. Its effectiveness is going to be highly dependent on air distribution in your apartment.
Here is an opportunity for a company to start producing good shelf/ table top electrostatic air purifiers and make money, as demand for them will definitely increase within the next years. These are the only products that will catch deadly particles smaller than 0.3 micron found in wildfire smoke, which cause respiratory and cardiovascular morbidities.
 
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highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
We are at 164 at the moment, so back in the RED zone. We are not really in fire season yet. So I fear that the worst may be yet to come. Since this all started we have only had a few stretches of a few hours where the air quality has been rated as good. This is now the second week in a row we have gone into the red zone. Last week we got into the purple zone. I understand that in this area the smoke is mainly from Ontario fires at the moment, but also still western fires. Either way it looks and smells bad, and I'm sure is harmful to health.

For a couple due any day for a half day out with the undertaker, we can't be cavalier about this. I don't have to bee outdoors very long before the effects are adverse. I was two days ago for unavoidable reasons and paid a penalty. The winter was long and spring late. We have only had one day this year were we could sit out on a patio, either because of smoke or adverse weather.

However the medical costs of this and the heat dome, which is getting ever closer to us, is thought to have cost over 1 billion dollars in excess medical cost so far.

However, as a physician I fear that this will be dwarfed by the long term medical costs. These 2 and 2.5 micron particles, go straight from lungs to blood stream. These carbon particles are highly reactive and the whole cardiovascular system is exposed to them. So what I worry about is future excess costs mortality and morbidity to the young, including children. I fear we are stoking future troubles. I fear this may all dwarf the effects of Covid by many miles and leagues.

The problem is that solutions are all long term, requiring massive changes to the organization of society, and costly. No one has any idea how to pay for all this, and that includes remediation. The effects of failing to act and the time it takes to act are mounting fast. Obviously the question is, how do you fund all this without setting off ruinous inflation? I have no clue.

I do think though, that we can not rely on one energy source, namely electricity. If we do the world will be a bird's nest of wires and transformers.
So we do need diverse energy resources, including electricity, gas and liquid fuels. This was garner maximum benefit from existing infrastructure.
I searched for info about what Canada is doing about the fires- didn't find anything substantial, but I did see that they have been limited in prevention- that, if it was limited by government, is a very stupid thing to do. Environmentalists who want trees to live free and long lives are killing us- the forests need to be well-managed in order to prevent this kind of event and I don't think controlled burns are the way- they lose control far too often.

WRT energy- I think a national grid is necessary, but want an end to utilities being government-sponsored monopolies because they're raising rates to the point where it's not reasonable. However, the cost to build and maintain that infrastructure is immense and private individuals/cities couldn't afford to pay for this but the states and utilities need to be willing to let people go off-grid if they want. Home-made alternate power systems that feed back into the grid do need regulation and inspections in order to operate safely, but for those who want to power their own homes and facilities, they should be able to, using whatever safe methods possible.

I don't have a problem with Ethanol itself, I have a problem with government shoving it down our throats, subsidizing corn as the main source of bio-mass and being mixed with gasoline. Brazil used Switch Grass and it grows all over the US- we should be using that, not corn. Solar? Sure- it's becoming more efficient and battery technology is improving, too. In addition, everyone should be using the most efficient lighting possible and wasting energy could be limited if more devices had automatic shut down functions after people leave the premises- doesn't need to use geo-fencing, occupancy/vacancy sensors have existed for decades and are frequently used in commercial/industrial/educational facilities.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
While no narrow period of hot dry weather can be blamed on climate change, there is no denying that increasingly worse fire seasons all over the world are a consequence. And, with the massive emissions of CO2 into the atmosphere over the course of the industrial age being the primary source, we don't have any choice but severely curtail our use of fossil fuels. In the long run, we need to eliminate them.

As a doctor, you know that prevention is better than cure. So, rather than wonder how we are going to pay for the environmental and medical costs incurred through climate change, we should be doing our best to prevent those problems beforehand.
One cause of these fires is human carelessness and I would add stupidity. A couple of weeks ago, I read that more than 400 fires were burning in Canada at the same time- how did this happen?

In 2002, East Central Arizona had two fires that eventually merged- this was called the Show Low/Rodeo-Chedeski fire, named after the places where they started and both were caused by humans- Rodeo was started by arson and the other was caused by an injured quad rider who was trying to get the attention of a news helicopter. More than 462,000 acres burned- that's a tiny fraction of the current fires in Canada, where more than 19.1 million acres have burned.

I closed my house last might and the air quality index shown in my phone's weather map is at 174, down from 204 at 10PM and 233 yesterday afternoon. Eyes are burning, but at least the temperature has been lower. Supposed to hit 90 tomorrow.
 
Mikado463

Mikado463

Audioholic Spartan
yep, ditto here in SE Pa, hse closed up AC on. My eyes were burning this morning on the way to the gym
 
Verdinut

Verdinut

Audioholic Spartan
Honestly I don't. Filters and humidifiers etc. are best placed centrally. I know you are in an apartment so that is not possible. Its effectiveness is going to be highly dependent on air distribution in your apartment.
I remember having seen a couple of electrostatic air purifiers either in Montreal audio shows in the 1960-70's or in a specialized audio shop. Table top electrostatic or even floor standing ones don't seem to be available right now. I remember them as they were outputting static sparks.

The medical grade H13 HEPA filter is however available in some table top air purifiers, and it is reported to be able to capture smoke particles as small as 0.1 micron. I have a Levoit Core 300 unit and I'm going to order the appropriate filter which contains a H13 HEPA filtering system for it, to replace the one that I'm using at present.

When I woke up this morning, my vision was a little bit blurred, from wildfire smoke. In Montreal, the air quality is not supposed to be good before around 6:00 pm tomorrow. I'm staying inside.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
Index now shows 154 and it's supposed to drop further. I saw blue sky yesterday, then it went back to gray. It's moving East, finally- hopefully, it's over.
 
R

rnatalli

Audioholic Ninja
While no narrow period of hot dry weather can be blamed on climate change, there is no denying that increasingly worse fire seasons all over the world are a consequence. And, with the massive emissions of CO2 into the atmosphere over the course of the industrial age being the primary source, we don't have any choice but severely curtail our use of fossil fuels. In the long run, we need to eliminate them.

As a doctor, you know that prevention is better than cure. So, rather than wonder how we are going to pay for the environmental and medical costs incurred through climate change, we should be doing our best to prevent those problems beforehand.
This is far too logical. More likely we will instead look for another planet and ability to get there; those with means will then escape when life on Earth becomes unsustainable.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
here's a far right thought to chew on.........


kind of a dumb idea to want to tank our largest trading partner IMO.
How is Brazil
here's a far right thought to chew on.........


kind of a dumb idea to want to tank our largest trading partner IMO.
You can't be referring to Brazil.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
The equatorial rain forests act as the planet's air conditioner- they DO absorb a huge amount of Carbon and by losing that reduction, the temperature is affected. They have been cutting the rain forests for far too long without replanting and many wood species are now protected because they support many other species just by existing.
 
Bobby Bass

Bobby Bass

Audioholic Chief
yep, ditto here in SE Pa, hse closed up AC on. My eyes were burning this morning on the way to the gym
Bad in central PA this past week too. Took the family to Hershey for the first time. Rented a place with a pool and the kids were in it all day. They all had respiratory issues. Tough to tell a kid on summer vacation they can’t go outside but safer indoors. strange driving through the Poconos and seeing all the smoke in the valleys. I’m an old guy and I can’t remember a stranger 4 years than 2020 till now. Feel bad for the kids. Thank you to all the firefighters etc. Hope everyone stays safe!
 
GO-NAD!

GO-NAD!

Audioholic Spartan
agreed, just like your Prime Minister ....... ;)
Not going to respond to that.;)

Why aren't we doing better with the forest fires?

There are too 'effin many, too 'effin large, too 'effin remote.

And the conditions created by climate change are making them worse than would have naturally occurred in the past.


Meanwhile, here in Nova Scotia, we had a lot of rain yesterday and another rainfall warning for today. I'd gladly share it with the rest of the country.
 
Mikado463

Mikado463

Audioholic Spartan
Not going to respond to that.;)

Why aren't we doing better with the forest fires?

There are too 'effin many, too 'effin large, too 'effin remote.

And the conditions created by climate change are making them worse than would have naturally occurred in the past.


Meanwhile, here in Nova Scotia, we had a lot of rain yesterday and another rainfall warning for today. I'd gladly share it with the rest of the country.
not respond ?? LOL , you did, but you forgot to mention the 'forest management' part of the equation, for if climate change and humans part in causing / creating the change is to blame than for sure we need to do better in forest management as well, agreed ?
 

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