not getting a lot of bass uisng MCACC

[sbinkley]

I have a Pioneer Elite VSX-90 receiver. I recently upgraded to Emotiva B1s for the front, C1 for the center, two SVS PB1000 subs, and a cheap set of JBLs for the rear. I set the subwoofers gain around 11 o'clock when I run MCACC. When I go through the settings it sets the sub at -2.5, which doesn't seem to throw out a lot of bass. It also sets my speakers as large so I manually adjust them to small and set the crossover at 100. What am I doing wrong in terms of bass output? I have cranked these subs and know they have the ability to rattle my basement, but I feel the receiver should be doing a better job setting up the system. Considering purchasing a different receiver with a better calibration system. Appreciate the help!

 

[tyhjaarpa]

Have you changed the receiver level for sub up from -2.5? That should fix the problem. I don't know why but most receivers put sub levels to quite low. Also you could just use the subs gain up to get more output.

 

[sbinkley]

I have, but I’m wondering how much I can dial it up? It seems everything I read says you shouldn’t turn it up that much from where the calibration sets it. Is it best to do a combination of receiver and adjusting the gain on the back of the subwoofer?

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Try it with the gain set to 12 o’clock or so. That will set the sub level lower, like maybe -5(guessing). That way you can trim up manually as much as 5db over calibration(hot) and not go into the +. The reason to stay at 0 or -(minus) is once you get into the plus, that can introduce distortion into the signal. Fwiw, you can run em as hot as you want. Most people seem to run between 2 and 5db hotter than calibration.
The reason it seems weak is because the goal of most RC systems is to EQ for a flat response which means bass is played at the same level as mid and treble. Most people prefer the sound of bass trimmed up a little. In short, we call it a house curve.
If you don’t want to rerun mcacc you’d be fine trimming up the -2.5 to 0 to see if that’s better.

Could also be dealing with some cancellations but I’d trim it up first. That usually makes people happy.

 

[sbinkley]

Thank you, I’ll try that and see if it helps. Thanks for the explanation about going above 0

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Thank you, I’ll try that and see if it helps. Thanks for the explanation about going above 0

No problem. Hate to see a man without good quality bass!

 

[shadyJ]

I have never run MCACC and thought it improved the sound. I would just leave it off. I would just adjust the sub level till it sounds natural to your ears if I didn't have any way of measuring the response.

 

[Reckel]

Hey shady. I saw a post from last year I think where a guy was having trouble with what he thought that one sub was playing louder than the other. You suggested playing different tones through them and measuring with meter. Where should master volume be at when playing the tones?
Second, you said to have them gain matched from main seat but not just with there gain knobs in the exact same spot. This is where you mentioned playing the tones to him. You said to make sure each one has the same spl at the main seat and turn the one subs gain knob down to match the other one after running the tones. Correct me here if I’m missing something but I thought by gain matching, the gain knobs on both subs should be in the exact same spot that way they’re putting the same energy in the room and if you turned the one subs gain down to match the other one, aren’t you level matching?
I thought gain matching is to take the room acoustics out of the picture and level matching keeps the room acoustics in the picture? Correct me here if I’m not getting something because I’ve still been playing around with my subs

 

[shadyJ]

Your understanding seems correct. Keep in mind you can only level match the subwoofers for a single position in room. The ideal is to have the levels match at the same gain level on the subs if possible, but that would be getting very lucky.

Regarding a master volume level for level matching subs, it doesn't really make much of a difference, so long as both subs are loud enough to overwhelm any exterior noises. I am sure 85 or 90 dB would be sufficient.

The idea is to get the single best frequency response from both subs while not working one a lot harder than the other. So the subs should be placed and adjusted in a way where their respective responses sum up to a overall smoother response. The gain dials on the subs themselves should be low enough so that the subs can easily be triggered by input signal voltage when the auto-on setting is used.

 

[sbinkley]

I downloaded a dB meter on my phone. Should I turn one on at a time and sit with my dB meter and have my wife turn the gain until it reaches 90 dB?

 

[Reckel]

Your understanding seems correct. Keep in mind you can only level match the subwoofers for a single position in room. The ideal is to have the levels match at the same gain level on the subs if possible, but that would be getting very lucky.

Regarding a master volume level for level matching subs, it doesn't really make much of a difference, so long as both subs are loud enough to overwhelm any exterior noises. I am sure 85 or 90 dB would be sufficient.

The idea is to get the single best frequency response from both subs while not working one a lot harder than the other. So the subs should be placed and adjusted in a way where their respective responses sum up to a overall smoother response. The gain dials on the subs themselves should be low enough so that the subs can easily be triggered by input signal voltage when the auto-on setting is used.

Ok thx. I might have asked you this before but since I have multiple seats, should I be measuring from my main seat or in the middle of both rows?

 

[shadyJ]

By measuring, are you talking about running the room correction program or are you talking about just doing an acoustic measurement to see the response?

 

[Reckel]

By measuring, are you talking about running the room correction program or are you talking about just doing an acoustic measurement to see the response?

Both I guess unless there’s a big difference between the two

 

[shadyJ]

Both I guess unless there’s a big difference between the two

Well, if you measure to apply room correction, you don't necessarily see the response that you are getting. Unless you have a calibration mic outside of the room correction mic, you wouldn't be able to measure that anyway, so I am guessing you are just talking about room correction. You should measure in all the seats that will be used during listening.

 

[Reckel]

Well, if you measure to apply room correction, you don't necessarily see the response that you are getting. Unless you have a calibration mic outside of the room correction mic, you wouldn't be able to measure that anyway, so I am guessing you are just talking about room correction. You should measure in all the seats that will be used during listening.

I’ll be getting a mic soon. That was the other thing I was gonna ask if I should measure from every seat

 

[Reckel]

Well, if you measure to apply room correction, you don't necessarily see the response that you are getting. Unless you have a calibration mic outside of the room correction mic, you wouldn't be able to measure that anyway, so I am guessing you are just talking about room correction. You should measure in all the seats that will be used during listening.

Will that make a big difference than just measuring from my main seat

 

[Reckel]

Well, if you measure to apply room correction, you don't necessarily see the response that you are getting. Unless you have a calibration mic outside of the room correction mic, you wouldn't be able to measure that anyway, so I am guessing you are just talking about room correction. You should measure in all the seats that will be used during listening.

I’ve got another question for you. The vtf3s sound but why is it when I lean a little forward the bass sounds even better when I’m sitting in my second row? I really only hear this listening to music but it kinda bugs me

 

[Reckel]

I’ve got another question for you. The vtf3s sound but why is it when I lean a little forward the bass sounds even better when I’m sitting in my second row? I really only hear this listening to music but it kinda bugs me

Awesome was supposed to be after sound

 

[nbk13nw]

Sounds like you have it set up / tuned to the mlp in the first row.

 

[Reckel]

Sounds like you have it set up / tuned to the mlp in the first row.

No I measured from every seat. Even when I measure from my main seat in second row it sounds the same. I’ve just been measuring from my main seat in second n tonight I tried measuring from every seat with ypao, I haven’t got a mic yet n rew so I’m doing what I can till I get those