Need To Reconsider Speaker Choice After Sudden $$ Windfall

[Thrill Killer]

I was, am, maybe going to buy the ELAC Uni-Fi Reference UBR62. But, after coming into some cash. Which is to me, spare money. I decided to do a few upgrades as we like to do every few years or so. The upgrades were gonna happen anyways. I have the gear all picked out.

With the now extra cash. I'm thinking of getting better speakers, if that's possible. I have done a in-store demo. And have heard them at the house of my brother's friend. Damn, they sound good. They tick my boxes. It would Have to be Bookshelves. And be up to $3K. With a HARD $3.5K MAX. I wouldn't care if I could get Elysian 2 pr for $3.7K, No.

What I want is not just 'cost more', 'it's made by___". But, The leap from the UBR62 would be quite noticeable and apparent to me with 45 years in the hobby. I don't have golden ears, just good ones. Or maybe, I only have Golden Years Ears, . We all know that a more expensive speaker will sound better. Usually in 1 or 2 aspects of sound. Like more extension, definable upper or mid bass, clear or forward midrange, highs with no 3K or 6K dip or bump. Crisp Treble without sibilance. Sound stage, etc. But a choice that would be a noticeable improvement across the board. Not that every facet of the sound has to be to the same degree of improvement. But, an improvement overall. As it's just the better speaker. The UBR62 is no slouch. It's very good. It's also very good for $1,200 pr. Which is why I chose it in the first place.

The rest of my soon to be gear is locked in and I will not change them. My set up is all encompassing. It does it all. Gaming, Movies, YT, Netflix, Prime, and 2 Channel listening. Which is why my L/R is very important to me. I chose a sub which I feel will fit better with my new gear and new apartment. Living Room approx. 20x20 ft. 22" stands, some kind of treatment behind the speakers. And Throw Rugs where needed on hard wood floor.
I will be x-posting this on other forums too. To get a wide range of suggestions. Thanks for reading my post.



Current Gear:

1. TV: Hisense 65U8G
2. AVR: Yamaha TSR-7850,
3. SPEAKERS: Martin Logan Motion 40 L/R, Motion 8 C, Motion Surr,
4. SUB: SVS PB-1000
5. Console: Series XS
6. PC for Gaming and Music
7. HTPC for movies

Two Channel:

1. Pre-Amp: McIntosh C34V
2. AMP: McIntosh MC2205
3. MBP: SoundSource, Music, FLAC 24/96
4. PC: FooBar, FLAC 24/96

New Gear:

1. AVR: Integra DRX 3.4 As a "Pre" only
2. AMP: Emotiva BasX 3 for L/C/R
3. L/R: ELAC UBR62 - For Now...
4. Center: SVS Ultra Center
5. Sub: RSL Speedwoofer 10S MKII

 

[its phillip]

UBR62s look pretty nice.

ELAC UBR62 Speaker Review

Copy/paste from my site. Review may not translate from my site so here is the link to the full review on my site: https://www.erinsaudiocorner.com/loudspeakers/elac_ubr62/ ELAC UBR62 Speaker Review Monday, Jun 21, 2021 Foreword / YouTube Video Review The review on this website is a brief...

www.audiosciencereview.com

But the KEF R3 looks better for a similarly sized coaxial speaker. With the higher budget these would be my choice.

KEF R3 Speaker Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the KEF R3 stand-mount (bookshelf) speaker. It is on kind loan from a member who sent a pair to me at great cost (they come two in a box). The R3 costs US $1,999 for a pair. The R3 is an example of superb industrial design by KEF: It oozes...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Kef R3 Bookshelf Speaker Review (Erin's Audio Corner)

Note: I put my site in the title so this thread wouldn't get confused with Amir's test which can be found here: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/kef-r3-speaker-review.12021/ Also, to get ahead of things, to address one difference between Amir's and my data: I modified...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[Thrill Killer]

UBR62s look pretty nice.

ELAC UBR62 Speaker Review

Copy/paste from my site. Review may not translate from my site so here is the link to the full review on my site: https://www.erinsaudiocorner.com/loudspeakers/elac_ubr62/ ELAC UBR62 Speaker Review Monday, Jun 21, 2021 Foreword / YouTube Video Review The review on this website is a brief...

www.audiosciencereview.com

But the KEF R3 looks better for a similarly sized coaxial speaker. With the higher budget these would be my choice.

KEF R3 Speaker Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the KEF R3 stand-mount (bookshelf) speaker. It is on kind loan from a member who sent a pair to me at great cost (they come two in a box). The R3 costs US $1,999 for a pair. The R3 is an example of superb industrial design by KEF: It oozes...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Kef R3 Bookshelf Speaker Review (Erin's Audio Corner)

Note: I put my site in the title so this thread wouldn't get confused with Amir's test which can be found here: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/kef-r3-speaker-review.12021/ Also, to get ahead of things, to address one difference between Amir's and my data: I modified...

www.audiosciencereview.com

I'm checking the R3 right now. Thanks for the rec.

 

[Kingnoob]

Why limited to bookshelves you gotta spend significantly more for anything comparable to cheaper towers . I’ve not heard elac of kef but those look like good choices! No audio stores near me I can’t listen to anything..
Ascend acoustic is good also.
Good luck on your search..

 

[-Jim-]

@Thrill Killer are you really going to go to a different Center Speaker OEM than the L&R in the new setup?

1. L/R: ELAC UBR62 - For Now...
2. Center: SVS Ultra Center

I'd have a concern about timbre matching. I'm also a bit wary that you have defined the height of the Speaker Stands at 22" before you figure out what speakers you are getting. Of course when finished they need to be at ear height when seated.

Having bought some HSU CCB-8s a few years ago (they are great) I use them for LCR in our Atmos setup and there are no issues with "Lobing" from the Center Channel. The L&R are on 36 inch stands (as recommended by HSU) and the Center fits nicely under the TV (and tilted a bit upwards). The CCB-8s would not get near consuming your budget but sound very good. Those Kef R3s do have a good review and test data, but can they work for you as a center?

 

[Thrill Killer]

@Thrill Killer are you really going to go to a different Center Speaker OEM than the L&R in the new setup?

1. L/R: ELAC UBR62 - For Now...
2. Center: SVS Ultra Center

I'd have a concern about timbre matching. I'm also a bit wary that you have defined the height of the Speaker Stands at 22" before you figure out what speakers you are getting. Of course when finished they need to be at ear height when seated.

Having bought some HSU CCB-8s a few years ago (they are great) I use them for LCR in our Atmos setup and there are no issues with "Lobing" from the Center Channel. The L&R are on 36 inch stands (as recommended by HSU) and the Center fits nicely under the TV (and tilted a bit upwards). The CCB-8s would not get near consuming your budget but sound very good. Those Kef R3s do have a good review and test data, but can they work for you as a center?

I get what you're saying. But some stands I have in storage are 22". I have a low sitting couch. Tweeters will be about 34'-36" off the floor. It's really hard to get tweeters at ear height without custom or adjustable stands. I already have towers. I'm just done with them, that's all. I want a mor streamlined look. I just want to try something different. I'm not too worried about Timbre matching. As the center will only be used for movies and gaming. The center I chose is often put inti the mix with L/R from other makers. It's a high quality center. It's why I chose it.

 

[Thrill Killer]

Why limited to bookshelves you gotta spend significantly more for anything comparable to cheaper towers . I’ve not heard elac of kef but those look like good choices! No audio stores near me I can’t listen to anything..
Ascend acoustic is good also.
Good luck on your search..

I have Motion 40 towers right now. And I'm really tired of them.

 

[Kingnoob]

I have Motion 40 towers right now. And I'm really tired of them.

No way the bookshelves are superior , what x over are you using?? But I guess if you get bookshelves a tier or two ahead they should outperform the towers ??
I don’t even listen loud enough to get the full benefit of towers so I’m not advocating for towers. However I’m probably going phantom center so I will benefit slightly .

You can carry the bookshelves easier too if you’re considering the switch for weight reasons?
Yeah I understand I get bored of my cheap stuff, but I like my Klipch icon though compression drivers the rp line dropped them . Hope I find a job before my avr dies …

 

[shadyJ]

Erin looked at the UBR62. Seems to be a pretty good speaker. On the minus side, it's rather low in sensitivity. That will limit its dynamic range. Probably not going to bother you unless you are after a THX type experience. With those compromises, you might as well just get a pair of Philharmonic BMR Philharmonitors. They probably do better in those metrics and will provide a more neutral response as well as deeper bass extension. If you want a bookshelf speaker that can jam loud but is still hi-fi, look at the RBH Sound PM-8 monitors. They are large and powered, but damn are they good speakers. If you want something more conventional, look at the PSB Synchrony B600s, very good speaker. I would put those against the Elac speakers.

 

[lovinthehd]

Maybe consider BMR Monitors https://philharmonicaudio.com/

 

[Thrill Killer]

Maybe consider BMR Monitors https://philharmonicaudio.com/

The BMR is def something I want to look more into.

 

[Kingnoob]

The BMR is def something I want to look more into.

I’ve never heard hardly any top brands but yeah those get a lot of praise everywhere you look . I’m in an audio blackout zone . Other brands selling bmr quality speakers want up to 20x more lol. Like legacy , focal etc

 

[Eppie]

The BMR is def something I want to look more into.

I got to hear them finally last year and it's a great speaker. The bookshelves are within your budget at $1700 - $1900 but the tower is $3900 (plus shipping). Very similar sound with the main difference being that the tower goes deeper with a flat response to 25Hz. If you have a subwoofer the bookshelves would work fine. They actually go pretty deep too for their size.

Slightly lower efficiency than some speakers but unless you want rock concert level volume they get plenty loud. The BMR is a very neutral speaker (very flat frequency response) for those that want uncoloured sound. Any tweeking can be done through EQ on the pre-amp or AVR. What I loved about them is that the flat response remains off axis which gives them a very wide sweet spot. With my current speakers I need to be in that listening triangle but the BMRs remained very consistent while moving around the room. That flat response also gives them great detail in the important vocal band. I have no qualms recommending them to people.

 

[Thrill Killer]

I got to hear them finally last year and it's a great speaker. The bookshelves are within your budget at $1700 - $1900 but the tower is $3900 (plus shipping). Very similar sound with the main difference being that the tower goes deeper with a flat response to 25Hz. If you have a subwoofer the bookshelves would work fine. They actually go pretty deep too for their size.

Slightly lower efficiency than some speakers but unless you want rock concert level volume they get plenty loud. The BMR is a very neutral speaker (very flat frequency response) for those that want uncoloured sound. Any tweeking can be done through EQ on the pre-amp or AVR. What I loved about them is that the flat response remains off axis which gives them a very wide sweet spot. With my current speakers I need to be in that listening triangle but the BMRs remained very consistent while moving around the room. That flat response also gives them great detail in the important vocal band. I have no qualms recommending them to people.

The BMR are something I am looking into. Thanks to those that have suggested it.

 

[lovinthehd]

No speakers for the 2ch gear or are you going to try some convoluted home theater bypass kind of setup? Why the McIntosh pre/amp? You spending an appropriate amount more on speakers?

As to the BASX amps, I'd just look for better power/impedance capabilities....they're more like an avr amp section.

 

[Thrill Killer]

No speakers for the 2ch gear or are you going to try some convoluted home theater bypass kind of setup? Why the McIntosh pre/amp? You spending an appropriate amount more on speakers?

As to the BASX amps, I'd just look for better power/impedance capabilities....they're more like an avr amp section.

The bookshelves I buy will do double duty as my ML 40s do right now. I have a 5 ch ML set up. The mac gear is for two channel listening. Cables connected to the 2205 get plugged into the 40s for two channel listening. When I'm not doing that the cables from my avr are plugged into the 40s. I have Command Hooks on the back of my speakers. And tied to each set of cables is a piece of yarn with a loop that hangs off of the hook. Makes it easy to "Switch" between sources. The BasX 3 ch. amp is for the L/C/R speakers. As I'm gonna use the Pre Out on my new AVR to feed the amp. As the BasX is a better amp with a better power supply than the avr has.

 

[lovinthehd]

The bookshelves I buy will do double duty as my ML 40s do right now. I have a 5 ch ML set up. The mac gear is for two channel listening. Cables connected to the 2205 get plugged into the 40s for two channel listening. When I'm not doing that the cables from my avr are plugged into the 40s. I have Command Hooks on the back of my speakers. And tied to each set of cables is a piece of yarn with a loop that hangs off of the hook. Makes it easy to "Switch" between sources. The BasX 3 ch. amp is for the L/C/R speakers. As I'm gonna use the Pre Out on my new AVR to feed the amp. As the BasX is a better amp with a better power supply than the avr has.

Like I said, a convoluted setup. What's the point? I'd just get better speakers for now rather than worry about electronics, particularly the limitations of two-ch only gear in a multich system. Two ch listening is vastly overrated as to what gear enables great results...

 

[Kingnoob]

Like I said, a convoluted setup. What's the point? I'd just get better speakers for now rather than worry about electronics, particularly the limitations of two-ch only gear in a multich system. Two ch listening is vastly overrated as to what gear enables great results...

Yeah spending most your budget on speakers usually nets the best results , a fancy amplifier over a certain price tag has diminished returns ? What’s the highest 2ch amp you’d suggest to the op ?

 

[Thrill Killer]

Like I said, a convoluted setup. What's the point? I'd just get better speakers for now rather than worry about electronics, particularly the limitations of two-ch only gear in a multich system. Two ch listening is vastly overrated as to what gear enables great results...

First, I have the money for all that I want. I don't like my avr, I'm getting a new one. I don't like my speakers, I'm getting new ones. My 2 ch. listening is great. Music from mbp. To a McIntosh C34V. Into a MC2205. And, into Martin Logan Motion 40s.Two channel and five channel are not connected. To switch between the two is to just unplug one set of speaker cables and plug in the other set. To switch the cables on each speaker takes like 5 seconds. Two speakers, ten seconds.

 

[Thrill Killer]

First I want to thank everyone on your great suggestions and recs. Every brand that was brought up were not available where I live. I'd have to drive to a Major Metropolitan City that is a little ways from my city. Well. I went listening today. And I kinda fell for the okey doke. But, not quite. I didn't buy anything. I went to two towns. Well, kinda one town. I visited two of the local shops where I live. And one shop in a neighboring city. I made a day of it. I listened to UBR62 again. Kef R3, LS50 META, Sonus Faber Sonetto II, Dynaudio Special Forty, Wharfedale EVO 4.2, Linton 85th Anniv., etc. And a few more. Buchardt S400MKII too, damn, I kinda want this one. And last one is to be named in a bit. It's how I got almost tricked by my sales guy. I'm not giving a review of what I listened to. Just mainly talking about my experience and what connected with me. The UBR62 is great and worthy of purchase. I most likely won't get it though. The Sonetto II, $2, 400 you say. It sounds "nice". The Meta was nice for reals. That shape though. I'm just not into it. Shallow? I don't care. Evo4.2, them and the '62s are neck and neck as far as quality of sound.

Linton are good. Their sound sig is kinda not for me. I'm probs wrong. But they sounded like a better Bose speaker. The R3 were better at producing the kind of sound I like. So they become my baseline speaker in my search. Then I listened to the Special Forty. That's a very good speaker. Then I thought, if I get a REL T/7, or T9x instead of an RSL sub. That and the Buchardts would be really close to a Special Forty. So, the Forty's out. I can eq to suit my taste. That Forty is over $4K. Worth it mebs, you'd have to want dynaudio though.

The gear I listened with were all SS, no tubes. Like Luxman, Naim, Music Fidelity, McIntosh, Cambridge, etc. All from my iPhone 14 Pro. Hey, it worked fine. As to the songs? there's no right or wrong songs for demo. Just what you like and know well.

So sales guy says...wait for it..."I know it's out of your price range. But give these a listen since you're here." Then he put on some Mission 770s. Eff me!, EFF ME!! Dang Man, that's a Speaker. Better than all I had listened too. Very apparent without trying hard to find a difference. I can say a lot of stuff. But if you've heard them. You know what they give you is magic. I'll say this. I think, to me, my own opinion, that it's a "Audiophile" style, type kind, of bookshelf speaker. It needs good gear. You give it that. And it'll make you cry. Not just because you spent $5k on speakers that aren't even towers. But because they're that good. It's not a "smaller version of...". Or a Bookshelf that is a part of a 5.1 set. It's in a class of it's own. I hate that sales guy.

So, my decision is The Bucs with a Rel sub. The R3 is a Serious close second though. I do think about going to a neighboring state close by with a low sales tax and buying the 770s there. It's out of my stated price range. So I'm not even thinking about it. It's only a tank of gas there and back....

So thanks to you all for everything. Happy Listening.